LA or regular block plane, which one?

[Alan Tolchinsky]

O.K. I'm almost ready to buy one of these except to decide on the blade angle. What's the best criterion to use for selecting the angle, low angle or regular? It seems most people are buying the LA but are they correct in this? Isn't LA mostly good for end grain and the regular angle used for surface cuts? I was just about to buy the LA LN but I don't want it primarily for end grain. Is this just a fad or is the LA better overall? Man some tricky decisions here. Thanks Alan

[Steve Elias]

My limited experience says your understanding is correct: LA for end grain, regular for surface cuts. For years I have gotten by with a regular block as I have used it primarily for fitting inset doors in cabinetry. Now that I have both and am ready for any situation, I find that my division of use is as suggested in the first line above. Naturally, my advice (since it is your money) is to buy both ;). Otherwise, I assume your primary use will determine which one to purchase initially.
-Steve

[Richard Gillespie]

I'd like to second everything Steve said. In addition, buy the best quality block plane you can afford. LV and LN's are just about ready to go out of the box. The blade might need a little lapping.

Four years ago I bought a new Record LA Block Plane and was stunned at the hours I had to spend to bring it up to speed. There are good quality block planes on sale through Ebay and/or rust hunting but again you will have to spend time bringing them up to speed.

[Brian Buckley]

Alan,

From what you describe your primary use will be, I would start with the regular angle LN block plane. It will work on end grain, just not as well as the low angle. I had good results with the regular angle plane on end grain for many years. It was not until I started reading these forums and woodworking mags that I learned how unsophisticated I was. The low angle is a big improvement on end grain, but not the only way to "skin the cat".

Brian

[Marc Hills]

I have one each of the regular angle and low angle block planes.

Obviously, the LA is demonstrably better at working end grain than the regular angle block. And I know that hypothetcially the higher bed angle of the regular block should be better in some situations where the LA would tend to lift and tear out wood fibers.

But in actual, varied use, I'll be darned if I can find much at which the regular angle block is clearly better. Is this just me?

[Bob Smalser]

Is this just me?

No.

I've never noticed any real difference at all on end grain. I like adjustable mouths, tho.

My favorite has become this old Sargent knuckle cap....big for a block plane, so it's enough plane to do jobs I used to reach for the #3 for.

http://pic3.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/6791366/85653808.jpg

They go cheap on Ebay...this one has Shapleigh Hardware's name on it and was well under 20 bucks.

[Derek Cohen]

If you are going to get just one small block plane, then make it a low angle with an adjustable mouth. These are so much more versatile, for example, because of the bevel up configuration, they can use blades with different angle bevels, so enabling a wide range of cutting angles to be achieved.

You can make a low angle plane perform as a high angle block plane, but you cannot get a standard angle plane to perform as a low angle block plane.

Low angle block planes are better than standard angle block planes on end grain. Yes, a standard angle can cut well (just about any plane can do so), but not in the same class as a LA block plane. I ran a sharpening workshop in Perth last weekend and quickly proved this. Take one piece of Radiata Pine end grain and plane it with a sharp LA block plane. If you are very good, have a very sharp blade, and the stars are in the correct configuration, it will cut a smooth, clean edge without tear out. I like to believe that tearout does not occur on end grain, but it does with Radiata Pine. They should just ban the stuff! Now try the test with a surgically sharp Standard Angle block plane. Again, if you have been good, eaten all your vegetables, walked little old ladies across the road, then it will cut fairly cleanly, but still will leave a section with some tearout. I had several participants do their best, but the results were the same every time.

An adjustable mouth is important when you are wanting to take fine cuts without tearout on face grain timber, especially when the grain is interlocked. The mouth size is much less important for cutting end grain, especially with hard woods.

I use three block planes: a low angle Stanley #65 with Hock blade, a standard angle Stanley #18 with original blade ground to 40 degree bevel (i.e. cutting angle of 60 degrees), and a LA bronze LN #102. The #65 will cut any end grain, the #18 will smooth any face grain, and the little LN is the one I grab when there is any trimming to do.

Pics of the #65 and #102 below (with jarrah end grain).

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Steve Cox]

I have the LV LA block. There really hasn't been anything I haven't been able to do with it. It is larger than the Stanley or LN which I like personally. It allows it to be both a block plane and a small smoother. If it was one or the other I'd buy the LA with an adjustable mouth. As a matter of fact I have two LA blocks, the LV mentioned above and a Stanley 60 1/2 with a Hock blade and no regular angle ones.

[Marc Hills]

I know your picture is just for illustration purposes, Bob. But I have to tease you.

If I had left a nice block plane, a razor sharp slick and that chisel plane all perched precariously like that, an overly-friendly labrador would choose that particular moment to coming bounding up and bump into my Workmate.

And those beautiful tools would each find the only three rocks resting exposed on the ground below!

[Alan Tolchinsky]

Anybody know what Stanley this is? It has an adjustable mouth, 6"Lx2" W and 20 degree bed. I've flattend the sole and sharpened the blade. It works o.k. but I'd like something better. Thanks for all the great ideas.

[Clay Craig]

My instinct is that it's a modern 9-1/2, but I admit I've not seen one with the horizontal-axis adjuster in the back. Most people seem to think that the modern Stanleys are not worth the effort it requires to tune them to work well, especially a common model like yours. An ebay equivalent from before WWII would probably work better than the one you have. Lots of places will tell you how to ID such an item, one is the 9-1/2 page from Blood and Gore. (http://www.supertool.com/StanleyBG/stan2.htm)

I'd agree with the votes for the low angle - the ability to 'make it into' a high angle by simply changing the iron (some people say the result is even better than a standard angle bedding) makes it a pretty easy choice, I think - if you're only gonna get one.

Clay

[James Carmichael]

I believe the model# is 12-920. The iron should be 1 5/8"W and bedded 21*.

http://www.builderdepot.com/browse.ihtml?pid=139529&step=5&prodstoreid=2128

[Alan Tolchinsky]

I believe the model# is 12-920. The iron should be 1 5/8"W and bedded 21*.

http://www.builderdepot.com/browse.ihtml?pid=139529&step=5&prodstoreid=2128

Yep, that's got to be it. The specs they give fit mine. Thanks.

[Bob Smalser]

If I had left a nice block plane, a razor sharp slick and that chisel plane all perched precariously like that, an overly-friendly labrador would choose that particular moment to coming bounding up and bump into my Workmate.



They get knocked off the scaffolding around boats occasionally...unavoidable in that trade. The trick is to be able to put them back in order pronto and get yer butt back to work. ;)

[Walt Pater]

[QUOTE=Bob Smalser]
My favorite has become this old Sargent knuckle cap....big for a block plane, so it's enough plane to do jobs I used to reach for the #3 for.

I recently scored this ten buck Sargent YSF (Yard Sale Find) and tuned it up: works really, really well. I thought it was a Stanley until I looked under the adjustable mouth plate. (Shows you how much I know) It's a 316 or 306, maybe? With end knob, it's just shy of 9". Another vote for Low Angle Adjustable Mouth Block Planes, LAAMBP's. Oh yeah, there was a SB #3 there too.