Bandsaw riser block question

[Bryan Ericson]

This question may be more appropriate for the power tools forum, but since I don't follow that forum and I'm sure people here will have a good answer, I'll post here.

I recently bought a real gloat of a bandsaw on Craigslist: a Jet 14-inch from the original purchaser, reportedly used only a few times and then left to sit in an unconditioned shop, with only some minor rust that cleaned up easily, for $200. It's the open base model with the 3/4 HP motor and 6-inch resaw capacity. Before I start buying new blades, I'm wondering whether I should buy a riser block - I don't want to re-purchase new blades if I buy a riser block later on.

My question, then, is whether the motor is powerful enough to warrant the riser block. Will three-quarters of a pony be enough to resaw up to 12" lumber? I have no specific plans to do anything like this, but it would be nice to have the option in the future.

Thanks!

[Chris Griggs]

This question may be more appropriate for the power tools forum, but since I don't follow that forum and I'm sure people here will have a good answer, I'll post here.


Just change the word bandsaw to "resawing apprentice" and everyone here will know what you are talking about.

[Jim Koepke]

This may be something you have to determine by yourself by seeing how it handles 6" stock during a resaw.

jtk

[Bryan Ericson]

This may be something you have to determine by yourself by seeing how it handles 6" stock during a resaw.

jtk

I'd considered this, but the blade that came with it is not very good, so I don't think it would be an accurate test. If it saws well with a junk blade then it will definitely work well with a good one; but if it saws poorly then I still don't know whether the problem is the motor or the blade.

[Jim Koepke]

One new blade hopefully won't break the bank.

jtk

[Paul Murphy]

A Wood Slicer blade from Highland Hardware is about $30, so that may be your cheapest answer. I'm assuming resaw for veneer or thin-stock.

The overall answer is that a 12" resaw with 3/4 HP will require the right blade [Wood Slicer is a good blade, thin/sharp/correct tooth pattern] on a well adjusted machine with a well made aux-fence. It's doable, but you'll have to feed slowly and be patient.

[Bryan Ericson]

One new blade hopefully won't break the bank.

jtk

No, it won't at that. And I suppose if a new blade shows that the saw wouldn't be powerful enough with the riser block installed, I'll have saved quite a bit of money in the end.

[Bryan Ericson]

A Wood Slicer blade from Highland Hardware is about $30, so that may be your cheapest answer. I'm assuming resaw for veneer or thin-stock.

The overall answer is that a 12" resaw with 3/4 HP will require the right blade [Wood Slicer is a good blade, thin/sharp/correct tooth pattern] on a well adjusted machine with a well made aux-fence. It's doable, but you'll have to feed slowly and be patient.

This is a hobby, not a business, so I can afford to take it slow. :D Thanks for the info!

[george wilson]

My old model Delta14" WITH riser blocks has had a 3/4 H.P. motor since I bought it used in 1963. But,the motor I have is an old,1940-50's GE motor about 10" in diameter. It puts out full sized horses! I kind of think bandsaws are over powered these days. I don't see why 2 HP is needed. Our old 20" 1950's Delta at work still had its original 1 HP motor. I have very accurately resawn CUBAN MAHOGANY over 12" thick without any bogging down. I think wet woods are the worst thing to bind the blades. I don't use wet woods,though. I think your 3/4 will be o.k.,unless you use wet woods.

A lot depends upon your skill in using a bandsaw. You have to FEEL that the blade is cutting,and feel how fast you can feed the wood without overloading the blade. You'll start cutting vertically cupped cuts if you overload the blade. I have never worried about how fast I can cut. I use very valuable woods and am more concerned about not messing the wood up than how fast I can cut it. I know some will think I'm nuts,but I do EVERYTHING with a 1/4" blade with 6 TPI. Even made an accurate 1/16" veneer from the Cuban mahogany over 12" tall using the 1/4" blade,because I know how to feel my way along. I resaw quartered Sitka spruce(the quartered grain can be a challenge!) and Brazilian rosewood over 9" deep for guitars with my 1/4" blade.

Your Jet will not be as rigid as an old model Delta. The castings aren't as thick. You might have to allow for that,and take it easy.

[Adam Cruea]

It should be able to, but it might take a while depending on the wood you feed it.

Like George said, pay attention when sawing and depending on your wood, you might have to have high tension. When I resaw QSWO, my blade didn't need the tension it needs with hickory. Just go slow, and listen. When the saw screams, you're going too fast. I know on my saw that I'm going the right speed because the riser block I have has ceramic glides on it. . .if they spark, I'm feeding too fast. I've found I don't really hear it cutting when I'm feeding at the right speed. . .it just sounds like the saw is running at that's it.

I also use a 3 TPI dedicated re-saw blade with carbide tips. I was having an issue with feeding mine for a while until I cranked the tension sky-high, but my bandsaw has a lever to untension the blade when not in use, so I don't worry about it much.

[John Powers]

there's feed rate then there's feed rate. I know it's a hobby but there's a limit. I don't think even with the wood slicer that resawing 12 inches with 3/4 HP is realistic for most of us. try the 3tpi and if you don't hit any nails I'll buy it from you. my 3/4 delta motor awaits repurposing since I found a nice 1.5 HP for my 1986 delta saw. that said, I'm not known for patience.

[lowell holmes]

I have a 14" Jet w/ 1 HP. I have the best results with 3tpi 3/8" blade from BC Saw in Canada for resawing. My saw has a riser block.
The 3tpi requires less hp than higher tooth count blades. It clears out the saw dust. It tracks straighter without drift.

The tension should not be set excessively tight either.

I think you should be able to put a riser block in yours.

[jamie shard]

My old model Delta14" WITH riser blocks has had a 3/4 H.P. motor since I bought it used in 1963. But,the motor I have is an old,1940-50's GE motor about 10" in diameter. It puts out full sized horses! I kind of think bandsaws are over powered these days. I don't see why 2 HP is needed. Our old 20" 1950's Delta at work still had its original 1 HP motor. From hanging out at the OWWM.org website, I think I heard that older motors were rated for there standard HP, but after a certain year (50s-60s) motors were rated for their max. horsepower. As a result, a 3/4HP motor from the 50s is about the equivalent of a modern 2HP motor.

[jamie shard]

As someone who just acquired a 1950s era 14" delta (still very rusty and frozen, but hopefully restored this fall/winter), ahem Resaw Apprentice... what's the cheapest source of 6" risers? Are there cottage makers that make these things?

[george wilson]

Yea,it's kind of like those 6 horse power shop vacs that still operate on a 15 amp circuit. Nonsense ratings like that should not be allowed! I collected several good old motors in the early 60's and treasure them. My old father in law was an electrician and a great self educated man. He went around to Esso stations,installing pumps,air compressors,underground tanks,and whatever else they needed. He showed me what was good in motors.Old Master motors are great,so are old G.E. .Lincoln motors were great motors,too. I'm forgetting the names of some of those great old motors now. I still have enough to meet my needs. If you find some of those old,oversize motors that still run,buy them if you can.They have great overload capacity that these cheap,pressed steel body motors just don't have.Their armatures were also dipped in high temp varnish. That is no longer done(unless you pay VERY big bucks for a real industrial motor).

I have said before that I often do things the wrong way. But,I am practiced enough to pull them off. The trouble with 3 teeth is,they have 1/2 the teeth of a 6 tooth blade,and they get dull quicker. If you saw carefully and feel how the saw is cutting,and don't force it,it is remarkable what it can do.

I had the furniture conservation guys(3 of them) come into my shop and ask to use my 20" Delta. They wanted to resaw 5" tall walnut planks. I watched them saw,and none of them could stay within 1/4" of the line. After watching them waste a lot of wood in several planks, I took a plank and sawed it right on the pencil line they had drawn. They wanted to know how I could do that. I told them "You have to learn to make love to the bandsaw". They all thought I was joking,but I really wasn't. I was using the usual 1/4" blade.

I'm certainly not advising any of you to use a 1/4" blade for everything. I do it because it's just convenient not to change blades. And I have developed the ability to feel the machine's cut.

One time,I had a bunch of rosewood up to 12" thick to resaw. I think I paid about $120.00 for a 1" wide carbide tipped blade. It never felt sharp from the get go. Carbide is just not as sharp as carbon steel,or HSS for use in metal lathes. I used it for a while then took it off to try to get it sharper. I honed each tooth with a fine diamond hone. It sawed about as before,but soon the weld broke and the blade got thoroughly destroyed by the spokes in the wheels.

I was never satisfied with that blade's performance,and did not get much wood resawn for the money. After that,I went back to my 1/4" blade.

I have tried many blades in my career,including some 1/2" highly touted blades that were all welded a little crooked. I called the company and told them that whoever was welding their blades was not doing them good service. I always weld my own blades with my own welder. I take a lot of extra care to get them butted tight. After welding and the first anneal,I FILE(NEVER GRIND) the weld flush. It's real easy to grind a thin spot in the blade with those little wheels on the grinders. After filing,I put the blade back into the welder,and carefully bump the anneal button until the bright filed weld is annealed a spring temper blue color. Very seldom do my welds ever break. I doubt that any wood working supply co's. weld blades that carefully. It takes extra time and trouble.

Sometimes,when I need a blade,and don't have a new one on hand,I'll carefully,gently bump each tooth of a used blade on the bench grinder. It takes a little while,and you want to be consistent. Those blades are always sharper than new ones and cut beautifully. The reason is the way they make new blades. They aren't sharpened after they are tempered blue,apparently. If they were,they would have bright grinds on their teeth.

Years ago,in the early 60's,I used to buy packs of 5 bright rotary files from Sears. They were so sharp,they'd cut your finger prints while rolling them between the fingers. About the mid 60's,I ordered a new set. They were black,and they were not as sharp as the used bright ones I had wanted to replace. When I called whoever it was that purchased them for Sears,he said "We nitride them to make them last longer". In nitriding them,they also ruined the fine cutting edges the rotary files USED to have. That was the end of my using them:They burned the wood when I tried using them. I wish people in charge of procuring things like that were more competent.

[lowell holmes]

I don't use a blade larger than 1/2", but the 3/8" seems to work better. I sharpen blades on the saw with a Dremel tool using a small stone. The bit for sharpening chain saws works quite well. It takes about 10 minutes .


I don't like changing blades either.

[Curt Harms]

Another thought is you may not be resawing 12" very often but I find 7"-8" boards in the rough frequently so it's useful to have capacity greater than 6". An open framed band saw is easy enough to re-motor if you find it necessary.

[Derek Cohen]

This question may be more appropriate for the power tools forum, but since I don't follow that forum and I'm sure people here will have a good answer, I'll post here.

I recently bought a real gloat of a bandsaw on Craigslist: a Jet 14-inch from the original purchaser, reportedly used only a few times and then left to sit in an unconditioned shop, with only some minor rust that cleaned up easily, for $200. It's the open base model with the 3/4 HP motor and 6-inch resaw capacity. Before I start buying new blades, I'm wondering whether I should buy a riser block - I don't want to re-purchase new blades if I buy a riser block later on.

My question, then, is whether the motor is powerful enough to warrant the riser block. Will three-quarters of a pony be enough to resaw up to 12" lumber? I have no specific plans to do anything like this, but it would be nice to have the option in the future.

Thanks!

Hi Bryan

My first bandsaw was a 14" Ridgid with a 3/4 h.p motor. It came along with a top review from FWW magazine. It was woefully underpowered for anything larger than 4" resawing using a 3 tpi 1/2" blade. Naively I added a 6" riser. This did not improve matters. It could cut 12" but slowly as in watching paint dry. And not very accuractely, as the cast iron frame was let down by the pressed steel guides and guard. I upgraded the motor to 1 1/2 h.p., which made a significant difference to the power, as you can imagine. Nevertheless this was not still enough to overcome the limitations of the frame with upgraded guides. I think that 14" models with 3/4" motors should remain as is.

I now have an 18" Hammer with 4 h.p. (runs on a 20 amp circuit). This has serious power, serious construction, and does 11" resawing with ease. A 14"-er is not in the same league, not in the same universe. Stay with what you have and use it on smaller boards.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Bryan Ericson]

Lots of good advice here. Thanks, everyone. I think I'll follow Jim's advice from early on in the thread: get a decent blade and see how it handles 6" resaws. I'll make my final decision based on that.

[george wilson]

I haven't tried adding a riser block to Asian bandsaws,but already have had reservations about the castings being thinner. The riser block would make their frames even less able to stand high blade tensions. I would have the same concerns about RECENT,Asian made Deltas,too. If possible,find an older Delta that still has the hexagonal guide arm. The new ones have round arms with a groove in them. I have not made any "upgrades" to my old saw,and it works fine.

[Prashun Patel]

I am sure some of the pros can do magic with an underpowered saw. But I previously owned a 1hp saw; a Grizzly G0555 which is in the league of your Jet. It was a struggle to resaw thick stock. I had a riser block too. It's possible, it's just not very fun.

That being said, the riser did not adversely affect the thinner cuts, so I found no harm per se in installing it - if you can afford it. The blades were only marginally more expensive than the shorter ones.

[Niels Cosman]

I think that this is the same saw that I have, and I upgraded it with riserblocks and roller bearing blade guides.
When i resaw I use a 3/4 3tpi timberwolf blade and have been very pleased with the results. when cutting 8-9" material (walnut, ash, oak) The key is feed rate. The saw can get bogged down and the blade will deflect if you bear down on the material. Also the top wheel can start to "bounce' as the frame flexes. If you feed evenly and slowly its a great little saw.
I also upgraded with a quick release tensioner, which is a great improvement.

[Niels Cosman]

This was resawing ~9" 16/4 ash. Man that stuff was hard but the Jet dealt with it handily. The difficultly was milling those boards by hand, it was a real workout!
268057

[Pinwu Xu]

The age of the saw may determine how powerful the 3/4 hp moter is, i.e., the newer 3/4-HP moters may not be as powerful as that from a 1/2-HP built in the '50s.

That said, if you really do it slooooooooowly, it might still be doable (resawing, say 12")

The wood specie matters, more important, the blade plays a big role. You need sharp, narrow blade. Some would say the carbide, but the kerf might be too wide. Some would say the
wood slicer -- it may not last long. Some would say bi-metal (Lenox, or Olsen MVP) ...

[Pinwu Xu]

Some reported that one of the Grizzly riser block could be made to fit.

Amazon put it on sale the Delta Riser Block in the past year, that seemed to cleared up the inventory.

[Rich Enders]

I added the Griz riser to my 14" Ridgid bandsaw which seems to have the same casting as many of the 14" bandsaws. Ridgid advertises the standard 3/4 hp motor. I bought the riser mostly to gain an extra inch or so on re-saws to make bookmatched veneers and panels. Using a 1/2" Woodslicer I have had no problem in re-sawing white oak, walnut, and cherry. The widest of these hardwoods has been about 7-8". The only really tall re-saw at about 10 inches was spalted sycamore which cut very easily.

If anyone needs them I have new Woodslicer blades that fit the pre-riser dimension.

[Mike Holbrook]

I bought a bandsaw not long ago. I ended up getting a Laguna 14 SUV, instead of the Hammer Derek bought, mostly because I got a good deal on one locally, at a place I could just drive to and pick it up with my truck. I ran a long post on the general forum and got some education on the "power tool users perspective".

The posters on the general forum love great big bandsaws made in Europe. The main argument I heard against smaller saws has as much to do with saw frames as motor size. As I understood the argument, larger blades are more convenient for big sawing jobs like long rips and re-sawing. The posters on the general forum feel the frames of smaller saws typically are just not stiff/strong enough to handle the kind of tension necessary to run the larger blades.

The SUV designation on my saw is suppose to mean supped up version: larger motor, stiffer frame, foot break....other features typical on larger saws, atypical on 14" saws. I do not have room for a BIG saw. As George explains a smaller blade may do the job if one has the skill to make it work. I have trouble keeping a 1/4" blade cutting straight on my old small Inca band saw. After years of struggling with the issue I went with a saw designed to run larger blades.