Bought a toolbox full of goodies or lemons?

[Hilton Ralphs]

This was an impulse purchase so I may live to regret it.

Are these tools lemons or useful to my workshop?

I paid the equivalent of $260 (don't laugh too loudly please ;))

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[Jim Matthews]

If the steel is any good, you've got at least $100 in chisels - never mind all the other gear.

This is the essential tool kit for working by hand.
It appears that they were carefully used, and bear the signs of competent handling.

It's not the deal of the Century, but you did well.

What's more, what were your freight costs?

PS - I'm doing 75-80% of my handplaning with a similar #4 handplane.
Properly set up, they're really flexible.

[Hilton Ralphs]

What's more, what were your freight costs?
PS - I'm doing 75-80% of my handplaning with a similar #4 handplane.


This was a local purchase on an auction site. Normally the old hand tools are junk but this one popped up today. The seller is 300kms away but she is will drop it off near my office next week which is handy dandy.

Any idea what hand plane that is? The front knob looks a bit weird.

[Sam Takeuchi]

Those chisel handles resemble Berg or other maker out of Eskilstuna. If they are, they should be good to very good chisels.

[Bruce Haugen]

Those chisel handles resemble Berg or other maker out of Eskilstuna. If they are, they should be good to very good chisels.

Plus, those chisel blades look to be fairly long, so they will last a very long time. I have nearly a full set of tanged Berg chisels, and I rate them all at least very good, if not excellent.

[Harold Burrell]

Any idea what hand plane that is? The front knob looks a bit weird.

It is obviously hard to tell for sure from the picture, but...it looks like a Stanley to me, from what I can see of the lateral adjuster. Also, by what I can see of the brass wheel, it looks to be an older plane (Type 11 or before).

The weird knob was probably a replacement.

[Steve Friedman]

Hilton,

I think that's a great find and am sure that the value of the tools will end up being worth at least what you paid. Based on the level of craftsmanship and the inclusion of a full set of full-length Berg chisels, I would assume many of the other tools to be of high quality as well. It would be fascinating to know where that came from. I'm just curious about whether it was made by someone locally, as opposed to having been made by a craftsman who brought it with him when he moved to South Africa. Even if you never use any of the tools, you can certainly clean it up and make it a great display piece.

Congratulations on a great find.

Steve

[Tony Zaffuto]

Chisels look like Berg to me and if they are, probably some of the best going. There were other chisels in the same locale as Berg, with others having a similar appearance, but for the most part, also being good.

The knob & tote of the plane both (sort of) look like replacements, but I recall not long ago seeing a plane (European mfg.) that had a similar style knob. The sides of the plane look a bit different than run of the meal Stanley.

[Matthew Hills]

Looks like a fun box of goodies. Hope you fix up the box and use it!

Any idea what is in the tin between the plane and spokeshave? (wax? tallow -- ewww...)

Matt

[george wilson]

Except for the lack of saws,except for the keyhole saw, you got a pretty complete kit of someone who made a living with it. Likely a house carpenter. I think the money was well spent. I don't know what the supply of vintage tools in South Africa is like.

As said,those chisels look like Bergs. Can't identify the mortising chisel,but the owner came from Northern Europe,it seems. He wasn't fancy,but he went to the trouble to take care of his tools by making the chest.

[Chris Hachet]

Very impressed with the find. As much as I enjoy looking at the new stuff from Veritas, Lie Nielson, Bad axe and the like....when I walk into my shop to actually start working with wood I often find myself reaching for the vintage tool. Something about them I often actually prefer for whatever odd reason. Enjoy your new tools, Sir!

[Hilton Ralphs]

Any idea what is in the tin between the plane and spokeshave? (wax? tallow -- ewww...)

Apparently it's Vaseline Matt.



Except for the lack of saws,except for the keyhole saw, you got a pretty complete kit of someone who made a living with it. I don't know what the supply of vintage tools in South Africa is like.
George, I've noticed what appears to be a panel saw tucked away vertically behind the chisels. Vintage tools here are pretty scarce and when they do appear they are either in bad shape or the dealer has no idea what they are.

Would you buy a Spear & Jackson that was missing two nuts and had part of the toe missing?

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[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

Regardless of the value of the tools, having what appears to be an original kit all together and a piece of history I would think adds to the value considerably - if not in the financial aspect of value, certainly the emotional value. See if you can't find out some of the history, and keep those guys together if you can - it's always a bummer to see something like that slowly parted out. At least, I'm always bummed when I find a well-though out chest with no tools and wonder what exactly went were.

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

Would you buy a Spear & Jackson that was missing two nuts and had part of the toe missing?



If the price was right, it wasn't too pitted, and the blade was straight and in good tension, I'd take a shot on it. You're not apt to get much work out of that little missing bit, and you could always snip it off it bothered you. Saw nuts can be replaced easily enough. (If I have any extra left, I'd send 'em if you got it, but I think I'm out.)

[William Adams]

Folk art version of the Studley! Way cool!

I'd've paid that and more.

[Jim Matthews]

The way I understood an earlier post from our man in SA, tools are scarce and hard to come by.

The distance between him and most sellers makes shipping a large component of his cost.
This set (missing a couple saw nuts, and all) is a very good start on fitting a shop.

My guess is that when the S&J is properly sharpened, it will be a very good saw indeed.
Whoever used these appeared to use them often, and an underperforming tool wouldn't keep a place in such a small case.

[Hilton Ralphs]

My guess is that when the S&J is properly sharpened, it will be a very good saw indeed.
Whoever used these appeared to use them often, and an underperforming tool wouldn't keep a place in such a small case.
Jim, sorry for the confusion but the S&J is not part of that tool chest. It's on offer from the same seller who is traveling to Joburg next week to deliver my goodie bag so I was wondering about the hand saw on offer (essentially to save on shipping but it's not that much locally). I think she wants about $19 for the S&J.

[Derek Cohen]

Hi Hilton

The plane is likely to be a Stanley #4, which everyone has guessed. What is out-of-place is the knob and handle. The South African market used English-made Stanleys, and the wood for these was stained and varnished beech. What you have appear to be replacements, possibly shop made - unless we are looking at a Berg version of the Stanley (Berg did make blades for the Stanley planes).

The set of Irwin augers, if still able to be sharpened, and if the lead screws are OK, should not be stored the way they are. Metal against metal is not good for edges. Store them in canvas.

Anyone recognise the saw set?

Regards from Cape Town

Derek

[Kim Malmberg]

Any idea what hand plane that is? The front knob looks a bit weird.

The plane looks very much like a German made Kunz to me. I've had a couple of Kunxz planes with similar very thick front knobs. The older Kunz planes are decent users but sometimes the casting is uneven.

The chisels could be Berg, but the handles doesn't seem to be polar birch which is what Berg used. They look very much like Finnish made Sorsakoski chisels: http://www.flickr.com/photos/77333663@N07/collections/72157632909109731/

Any idea abut where these tools came from, who owned them and where he or she came from? I'm asking because this looks a lot like a European kind of tool box.

[george wilson]

Old Spear and Jacksons were good saws. Apparently a bit collectible. I had a wealthy collector try to buy one from me for $75.00 way back in the late 70's. It was not in good shape either. Just cut off the toe of that saw. Not enough length lost to be much difference. Find some saw screws. I'm not saying your saw is valuable,especially with the toe damaged or cut off. It will be a decent user.

[Kim Malmberg]

The plane is likely to be a Stanley #4, which everyone has guessed. What is out-of-place is the knob and handle. The South African market used English-made Stanleys, and the wood for these was stained and varnished beech. What you have appear to be replacements, possibly shop made - unless we are looking at a Berg version of the Stanley (Berg did make blades for the Stanley planes).

I would disagree on the hand plane. The knob looks like Kunz to me. The saw set is made in Germany, either by Romünder or any other of several maker's. The sliding bevel marked Hanred is also German. The bradawl looks German. The try square looks like a Romünder I've owned. The compass saw looks like a European one with removable blades. And the general impression of the contents of this box would indicate that the lot was gathered somewhere in Europe.

Regards from Finland,

Kim

[Chris Vandiver]

If the chisels are indeed Bergs, you have already done very well. Cleaned up Berg's with full length blades and good handles fetch a pretty penny. I think you did rather nicely!

[Mel Miller]

It is obviously hard to tell for sure from the picture, but...it looks like a Stanley to me, from what I can see of the lateral adjuster. Also, by what I can see of the brass wheel, it looks to be an older plane (Type 11 or before).

The weird knob was probably a replacement.

I think Harold's right on about the plane being a Stanley. As far as I can recall, no one else made 2 piece lateral levers like that, and they're not a part that can be easily replaced like blades, knobs, lever caps, etc.

[Sam Takeuchi]

As far as I can recall, no one else made 2 piece lateral levers like that, and they're not a part that can be easily replaced like blades, knobs, lever caps, etc.

Record did. Exact shape and size.

[Hilton Ralphs]

The knob looks like Kunz to me.
Indeed it is. Not sure if that's a good or bad thing but it appears to be a size smaller than a Stanley #4 and the sole is corrugated.


The saw set is made in Germany, either by Romünder or any other of several maker's.
I can't make out any names but it certainly looks German and has one sliding lever to (I think) adjust the size of the teeth and then on the other side is a screw type lever that adjusts the degree of set.


The sliding bevel marked Hanred is also German.
Yes it's pretty cool actually. Unlike the cr@ppy modern plastic handled Stanley that I have, this one has a locking mechanism at the bottom of the handle. Seems very solid.


The try square looks like a Romünder I've owned.
Again, I cannot make out a maker but I still need to clean it up. It looks in good condition although I haven't tested it against my Starrett yet.


The compass saw looks like a European one with removable blades.
It's labelled Sandvik which I believe is Swedish. It's a mean and nasty looking saw (in a good way) as the blade is quite thick and has an unusual double tooth set (two to the left and then two to the right).



And the general impression of the contents of this box would indicate that the lot was gathered somewhere in Europe.
I think most of the tools originated in Europe but there a scattering of South African pliers thrown in for good measure.

What could be nice is the Nicholson Dovetail saw in a Gents' saw format. I can't find any online reference to this though. I 'think' it cuts on the push but I running the blade across my leg probably isn't the best test.

There's a Stanley 151 Spokeshave and Yankee driver (after it popped open, I couldn't get the ratchet back in again :)). The chisels are sadly not Berg but are definitely of Northern European origin. Two type though and the one that looks like a mortising chisel has this peculiar taper back to the bolster. So it wider at the end.

The auger bits are pretty decent and as Derek advised, I will wrap them up in a tool roll.

I get the feeling that I paid too much but most of not all the tools are useful. There was one real junk chisel that was skew ground as well as bevelled on both sides but was probably used to remove glue.

I will take and post more pictures of the chisels if anyone is interested?

[Kim Malmberg]

Hi Hilton
The Sandvik saw would be interesting to see. I'm sure it's not good, but since I am working on a project trying to document the Sandvik saw production I'd like to know what it looks like, if it has any model number and if it came with several blades or just the one.

The chisels would be really interesting to see. There could have been several copycats mimicking the Berg design but are there no stamps on the tangs? If I'm right about this it ought to say either "Sorsakoski or "Made in Finland" or both. It could also say "Hackman & Sorsakoski" or even just "Cast Steel".

Regards from Finland, Kim

[Steve Friedman]

Hilton,

I still think it's a cool find. Any information on the original owner? Any hidden identification in the box?

Steve

[Hilton Ralphs]

I still think it's a cool find. Any information on the original owner? Any hidden identification in the box?

Sadly not Steve. He had a steel punch with the letter P which is found on the one saw handle but he also seemed to mark his other tools with a V sign.

The Square is indeed a Romünder but it's weird that the length is not a full 25cm but rather an odd 24.8cm. It's also appears to be deadly square.

The Saw Set is a Garanto Fein.

The Brace is marked FROTT''. I believe it's German made and has a 10" swing but the chuck is of the non-ratcheting type with two sprung jaws.

The aggressive Compass Saw is not Sandvik but Skandia.

The two tapered Chisels are of Dutch origin and The mark is JNIJ which I believe stands for Jan Nooitgedagt, IJlst.

There is a 1-1/4" bevel edged Chisel with the markings of Eskilstuna Steel and Eskilstuna Sweden. It has a rather nice brass ferrule with two engraved ////// rings.

The 1inch Chisel is marked W Marples & Sons.

The remaining Chisels are marked Stockholm Sweden with a logo incorporating the letters DEJO encircled with an arrow pointing up. The J is bigger than the other letters.


So a mix and match set and most of the tools are obviously sourced in Europe from at least four different countries.

Thanks for your interest.

[Kim Malmberg]

Well, the overall impression of your tool box is that the previous owner was of European descent. He or she could have been German or Dutch, going by the tools in your box. The bit brace is made by Flott, not Frott. Flott made some very good bit braces and I have owned several of their braces. The Garanto Fein saw set is not a brand, rather a guarantee of quality, very much like the Warranted Superior mark on a hand saw. Te Swedish made chisels ought to be made of very good steel despite irrespective of the maker.

[Hilton Ralphs]

Thanks Kim. I was probably thinking of the Afrikaans word Vrot which is pronounced with a 'F' when I posted. It does say FLOTT on the Brace though.

Keep well.

[Jim Matthews]

Dude, around here (Millers Falls country) we call what you have there
a "Wicked good" deal. My guess is that the steel in your chisels all came
from the same foundry in or around Eskilstuna, home to EA Berg.

Watch out handling those, when you get them sharp.
My first set of properly tuned chisels were bloodthirsty.

It is my belief that Swedish steel derives some of it's power from regular sacrifice by the ardent user.

http://vikingcarver.angelfire.com/page5.html