Baseboard molding -- normal practice?

[John Lemke]

I've been plumbing the vulgar end of my vocabulary as I remove baseboard molding from a wall that's going to get built-in shelving. Back in the dark ages (before I bought the house in 1993), the baseboard was put in before plush carpet was installed, and it was nailed near the sub-floor. Upshot is that the molding can't be pried away from the wall owing to the deep carpet, and the nails can't be pulled. In the end what worked was to get thoroughly POed and brute force things off with pry bars, bolt cutters, and absolute cussedness.

So is this the normal way to install carpet and baseboard? Seems like you'd want the baseboard above the carpet for painting, replacement, and whatever.

Anyone have way to handle this that's kinder on the blood pressure?

[Peter Quinn]

Sounds pretty typical of a carpet retrofit. Carpet guys are not concerned about the molding...they are thinking about when you call to replace the carpet. Imagine having to remove every foot of baseboard to pull up the carpet! In your case I'd consider replacing the carpet at this time....then it won't be a factor in your built ins, or you can replace the carpet with hardwood flooring and throw rugs. Hardwood always goes under the base, or at least a shoe.

[Jeff Duncan]

Short answer is yes, it's pretty much the normal way to do it these days.

Longer answer.....not the best way to do it! It's done that way as it's cheaper to just drop it in place and nail it, than to do it correctly after the hardwood is installed and scribe in place. As for better techniques for removing it.....I haven't found any yet:confused:

JeffD

[Jason Roehl]

Normal practice around here is to install baseboards first, held off the floor by a scrap of baseboard laid flat (7/16"-1/2", typically, removed after nailing, of course). Then the carpet layers install tack strip about 1/2"-3/4" from the baseboard and tuck the edge of the carpet underneath the baseboard. Neither the baseboard nor the carpet are terribly difficult to remove then (and I've done plenty of both). What I really hate is when hardwood is covered by carpet (bad enough in itself), and the carpet layers don't bother to remove the shoe mould first. Pretty much guarantees the homeowner will want me to paint said shoe mould a drastically different color...

[Chris Rosenberger]

I have used a reciprocating saw with long metal cutting blades to cut the nails between the base & wall.

[Roy Harding]

Way back in the '70s I worked for a carpet installer for about a year. We laid the carpets right after the painters had finished, and right before the trim guy came in for the baseboards. On a retrofit, we (me) CAREFULLY removed the baseboards, replaced the carpet and CAREFULLY replaced the baseboards.

On a couple of occasions I wasn't so careful, and my boss had to swallow the cost of a paint job - some of the curse words my boss taught me held me in good stead in my subsequent career in the Army.

[Mike Cozad]

This is how I was taught to install baseboard.

I have been jammed up like the OP, recently in fact. Got a little carried away with the brute force and got speared in the forehead with a springloaded scrap piece. Jackasses installed shoe and base with liquid nails.....


Normal practice around here is to install baseboards first, held off the floor by a scrap of baseboard laid flat (7/16"-1/2", typically, removed after nailing, of course). Then the carpet layers install tack strip about 1/2"-3/4" from the baseboard and tuck the edge of the carpet underneath the baseboard. Neither the baseboard nor the carpet are terribly difficult to remove then (and I've done plenty of both). What I really hate is when hardwood is covered by carpet (bad enough in itself), and the carpet layers don't bother to remove the shoe mould first. Pretty much guarantees the homeowner will want me to paint said shoe mould a drastically different color...

[Frederick Skelly]

Yeah, its normal. I used an oscillating tool with a saw blade to cut the baseboard up then pried it out. Yeah, prying it damaged the drywall, but not excessively.

Fred

[Sam Puhalovich]

Once had a similar situation ... I was able to drive the nails through the trim with a nail-set.

[Doug Richardson]

This is how I was taught to install baseboard.

I have been jammed up like the OP, recently in fact. Got a little carried away with the brute force and got speared in the forehead with a springloaded scrap piece. Jackasses installed shoe and base with liquid nails.....

I don't really consider myself a jackass, but I used Locktite's Liquid Nail equivalent (Power Grab?) to install our baseboards. It was, however, to two layers of plaster and cinderblock walls.....

[Phil Thien]

This comes up from time to time, and I'm always surprised by the # of people that say they installed carpeting first, then the base. What if a new owner wants a laminate floor, or tile? Whatever gap you left is worthless for the next floor, which will have a different thickness. And you can't just move the base lower, you'll have an unsightly paint line.

And properly installed base can't be easily removed and reinstalled, either. Maybe you guys are talking about the base SHOE? Not the base, though.

I don't know about you guys, but I learned the carpeting gets installed AFTER the base. You may remove an existing shoe if desired, but the base stays in place.

[Jason Roehl]

Not to mention, if the base is painted, it's an extra pain to remove in that it will be (should be) caulked at the top and ends. Or, if it's not caulked (ugly and un-professional, IMNSHO), there is likely to be paint build up just below and behind the top edge that will look bad when the base is reinstalled--unless there's a paint job involved.

[Michael W. Clark]

One way to cure the blood pressure/frustration problem is to not worry too much about what the wall looks like behind the built-ins. Its getting covered up anyway, else you would not need to remove the base molding. Sorry if I'm misunderstanding and not trying to be-little the problem, but I have to tell myself this sometimes too when this situation comes up.:)

One concern I would have is in regards to the carpet you are installing over. Are you going to remove the carpet or install over it? Either way will be fine for now, but when the carpet needs replacement, will it be an issue if it is under your built-in? Installers would need to cut the carpet around the built-in and install additional tack strips at the edge of the built-in. I don't have any experience with this as the few projects I have done were over tile or hardwood.

Mike

[Charles Wiggins]

Most of my experiences are with older homes where carpet was installed much later over the original flooring (usually gorgeous hardwood) and in every case the carpet was laid up against the base molding, not under it. I have removed the old base on two occasions because there were too many scars to repair and too many ugly layers of slathered on paint to sand or strip. In both cases most of it went fairly smooth with a couple of wonder-bars and backer blocks to save the drywall. The carpet has always been "floated" over the old floor and fastened by tack strips just inside the perimeter of the base. In a couple of cases I had to pull the carpet loose from the tack strips to get a little clearance to pry the base out. The biggest challenge there is avoiding laying my hand down on the tack strip.

All that said, if I were doing a built-in, I would be more likely to leave the baseboard and cope the bottom of the new construction to the base, then carry matching baseboard around the bottom new shelving unit.

[phil harold]

Once had a similar situation ... I was able to drive the nails through the trim with a nail-set.
Been there, done that!

[Michael Zerance]

I normally shim the baseboard up if carpet is going to be installed. However, most jobs I come across, where the baseboard is already installed, the baseboard sits on the floor and the carpet is tucked tight to it.

If you are installing a built-in, shouldn't the carpet be rolled back out of the way first anyway. I would roll the carpet back, install the built-in, install new tackless up to the toekick (or base), then restretch the carpet to fit against the toekick (or base).

To remove stubborn baseboard, wedged behind flooring, it is easier to pry it up from the bottom than to pry it out from the wall. Sometimes I have to have a pry bar positioned between the base and wall and another one on the bottom, then use both together to pry up and out at the same time. This will usually crack the baseboard so be careful if reusing it.

[scott vroom]

For carpeted floors we shim the base 1/2" off the subfloor. For tiled and hardwood/engineered flooring the base is always installed after the finished flooring is in.

[Mike Schuch]

I would never attempt any remodeling work without my favorite pair of Pincers at my side:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pincers_(tool)

Having just replaced ALL my carpet with hard surface flooring (slate, tile and engineered hardwood) I can testify a good pair of pincers is a must have when removing baseboard or carper strips!