Drum sander functionality question

[Wilbur Harris]

I need a drum sander for taking small amounts per pass from relatively narrow (6 inch) thin wood. Looking at the cheaper Grizzly (about $400), the specs list the minimum piece thickness at 1/4 inch. The more expensive Jet 10 incher lists the minimum thickness at 1/32nd - more in line with what I need. I have never used a drum sander in my 63 years. That said, here's my questions:

I'm guessing that I can use a "backer board" to exceed the min thickness of the Grizzly but would that be functionally feasible? If feasible, how would I stick the working piece to the backer board and it not break taking it off?

If I have to buy the Jet to make life "MUCH" easier I will. Suggestions concerning other drum sanders are surely appreciated.

[Eduard Nemirovsky]

I bought Jet 16-32 old machine about 3 years ago. Spent some time to set it up. And now I would not work without it. I am a hobby ww. I never use Grizzly sander. I would recommend Jet - more capable machine.
Using backboard for drum sanding - very well possible. Just use a carpenter tape and make sure your backboard is even thickness.
Ed.

[jerry cousins]

i have the 22-44 performax - which i use primarily for cleaning up home cut veneers - 5/64. regardless of machines, for thin pieces i would use a backer board - presently i use 1/2" fiber board (maybe also called sound board) it has a pretty coarse textured surface and holds the pieces well just by friction - however, sometimes small pieces do need a finger on them as they feed in and come out to avoid a shoot back.
jerry

[Roy Harding]

I use a 24" dual drum sander extensively every day. I don't remember what the specs say about minimum thickness of pieces - but for anything less than around 1/4" I use a backer board I made up. I contact cemented rubber onto it, and have never had a problem. Previous to this, I used a rough textured board as suggested by jerry cousins - it worked, but I found that due to my heavy use of the machine, the occasional shoot back became annoying.

My machine is a Craftex - which as I understand it is the Canadian equivalent of Grizzly, but I cannot comment directly on the Grizzly or Jet machines you're considering.

A word of caution - once you acquire a drum sander you will become much less vigilant when gluing up panels (at least I did). Knowing that you can cut your stock slightly thick and flatten it out perfectly in the drum sander after glue up makes for a faster but sloppier woodworker!!

[Wilbur Harris]

Sooo...Y'all are sayin' that you're running stuff through on the conveyor belt with a rubber coated backer board or fiber board without tape or glue? I played that out in my mind before my original post and had pieces flying everywhere. They didn't fly very far as it was in my mind. :)

[Rick Potter]

The only problem I can see with a backer board is that it must be as long as the piece you are sanding. A lip on the back end (facing up) should solve slippage problems. Get a scrap af MDF and give it a try.

Rick Potter

[Mark Bolton]

The only trouble with the backer/lip route is with thin material the stock being sanded can curl slightly with the heat of sanding and lift off the lip. The friction backer whether it be rough material or rubber backed gives traction right at the compression rollers and sanding drums.

[Roy Harding]

Sooo...Y'all are sayin' that you're running stuff through on the conveyor belt with a rubber coated backer board or fiber board without tape or glue? I played that out in my mind before my original post and had pieces flying everywhere. They didn't fly very far as it was in my mind. :)

Yup. That's exactly what I'm saying.

[Roy Harding]

The only problem I can see with a backer board is that it must be as long as the piece you are sanding. A lip on the back end (facing up) should solve slippage problems. Get a scrap af MDF and give it a try.

Rick Potter

You're right regarding the length - nothing that I'm making thinner than 1/4" is more than 3' - which is the length I made my backer board.

If I had to do something longer, I'd probably use a piece of double sided tape on the leading edge of the veneer on an appropriately long backer board. This would result in "snipe" where the tape is, but just take that into account when figuring the length of your piece.

[jerry cousins]

yes, the backer board needs to be as long as the piece being sanded - otherwise, will get flex on the ends that are not supported. i tried the lip thing for awhile but on the very thin material it did not work well - still had to hold the piece down to make sure the lip got it just before it hit the pressure rollers.
i do not use any tape or glue - and i also do NOT stand directly behind the feed table.
jerry

[Mark A Johnson]

Start using a drum sander and you'll wonder how you lived with out one. If your sanding to 1/4", on the Jet you won't have a problem on the 10/20 or the 16/32. I have had both Jet units and sanded plenty of 1/4" thick stock. On using a backer board, it needs to be larger then the stock your sanding. The backer can be MDF or wood, hard or soft, I haven't seen any difference in the results.

Take your time and go through the set up instruction. On sandpaper, buy a box so you have the end taper and length to pattern off of. Then get bulk rolls from Klingspor and cut your own strips. It will save you some bucks. Most of the rolls I have bought have the Klingspor name on the backer. Hope that helps.

[John Coloccia]

I have a Jet 22/44. They're spec'd at 1/32", if I remember correctly. The spec is absolutely bogus. When I called them on it, they said, "Well, you have to use a carrier board to get that thin". No kidding, huh? I could use a carrier board on ANY drum sander and get that thin. The Jet spec is absolutely bogus, and I bought the Jet specifically because of that spec. What a debacle. Get whatever drum sander that turns you on, and plan on a carrier board for anything under 1/8" or maybe 1/16". Then, you won't go wrong. Personally, I wouldn't buy another cantilevered drum sander. I also, personally, wouldn't buy another Jet or any of the other similar sanders. I want a sturdy frame, a real belt (not a repurposed sanding belt) and real specs that can be relied on. I have my 22/44 dialed in, and I can do wonders with it, but it's a serious love/hate relationship. In the end, it was simply not worth what I paid for it and I will replace it when I can. For guys doing normal drum sander stuff that doesn't go too thin....doors, cleanup work, stuff like that - normal drum sander stuff...the Jet is a great, sturdy, reliable tool and it will perform beautifully.

I don't mean to be harsh, but you're asking about probing the edge's of Jet's specs, and their specs aren't worth paper they're written on.

edit: and just FYI...this isn't a rant. I called them multiple times about this issue. Despite promises to look into it, I've yet to hear back from them (it's been a couple of years now) other than to suggest using a carrier board, and they've yet to update their specs to something reasonable. It's just a friendly FYI to fellow creekers so they don't get sucked in by a bad spec. If the spec were reasonable and they could achieve it without drama, this would all be a non-issue.

[Wilbur Harris]

That bit of knowledge opens things up a bit. Now that I think about it...1/32 would be getting parts too close for comfort anyways.

[Rick Potter]

Used to have the Delta, my Woodmaster is light years ahead of it. Of course it is more money too.

Rick Potter

[Mark Bolton]

That bit of knowledge opens things up a bit. Now that I think about it...1/32 would be getting parts too close for comfort anyways.

agreeed, even a slightly sloppy wrap on your paper would have you sanding the feed belt.

[Alan Lightstone]

Use mine all the time. And yes, Roy's comment about being less vigilant about making glue-up tops flush is true. As long as you make your table tops a little thick, a drum sander can cure many ills.

I have the Jet 16/32. I would have loved to have had the space for the 22/44 oscillating one, but working in too small a shop.

I installed a Wixey DRO on mine, and have been happier still. I'm in the process of installing a digital ammeter on it also, but that's just the nerd in me.

I always use a large backer board for veneers on mine. Rubber cement glued sandpaper on it, and just place the veneers over it and no problem getting to uniform, thin thickness.

[John Coloccia]

agreeed, even a slightly sloppy wrap on your paper would have you sanding the feed belt.

Oh, it's worse than that. When the head gets close to the belt, the dust collector sucks the belt into the drum.

[Mark Bolton]

Oh, it's worse than that. When the head gets close to the belt, the dust collector sucks the belt into the drum.

Wow, Id say so!! Yikes. I run a 26" dual drum in the shop but there is a lot of air flow around the drums so not a possibility for me. Gosh, that would be a hard lesson to learn..

[Steve Peterson]

I have a Jet 22/44. They're spec'd at 1/32", if I remember correctly. The spec is absolutely bogus. When I called them on it, they said, "Well, you have to use a carrier board to get that thin".

I agree with this. I have a Jet 22/44 and have taken wood down to around 5/64". It is a bit problematic going this thin because the belt does not lie perfectly flat. It has random bulges that press flat when sanding, but rub into the sanding drum after the wood passes. Dust collection vacuum only aggravates the problem. Eventually, you would probably wear a hole in the belt if it stays at the low position.

For stock above 1/8", I think it is a great machine.

Steve

[John Coloccia]

Wow, Id say so!! Yikes. I run a 26" dual drum in the shop but there is a lot of air flow around the drums so not a possibility for me. Gosh, that would be a hard lesson to learn..

You have plenty of warning. There are parts of the belt that rub first, so you can kind of hear the *****SHHHHH>>>SHHHHH>>>SHHHH***** sound as just a little touches here and there. This could be completely mitigates with a slight redesign, and it's on my list of things to do. Well, they could use a real belt instead of that stupid sandpaper thing, for starters. Since that's not going to happen, because a poly belt isn't available for the 22/44 best I can tell, I'm going to attach a couple of spring loaded bearings inside head casting, on the left and right sides of the drum. When the head gets close, they'll make contact and hold down the sandpaper. In my experiments, I found that constraining the paper at the edges is enough to prevent this problem. It's on the to-do list for this year sometime.

[glenn bradley]

At some point the material will be too flexible to remain in control while passing through the pressure rollers. Flexible (rubber or rubber-backed) feed belts can add to this problem but, a backer will at least make thin stock only as susceptible as thicker stock. The obvious problem with double-stick taping really thin stock to a backer is that it self destructs during removal. The grip would not need to be too great and there may be adhesives with the right properties that are available in hobbyist quantities. I will follow this with interest and hope for a good solution.

[Roy Harding]

...

I always use a large backer board for veneers on mine. Rubber cement glued sandpaper on it, and just place the veneers over it and no problem getting to uniform, thin thickness.

I like the sandpaper idea, it's probably a better solution than my rubber mat. I'll give it whirl next time I need really thin veneer.

[John Coloccia]

At some point the material will be too flexible to remain in control while passing through the pressure rollers. Flexible (rubber or rubber-backed) feed belts can add to this problem but, a backer will at least make thin stock only as susceptible as thicker stock. The obvious problem with double-stick taping really thin stock to a backer is that it self destructs during removal. The grip would not need to be too great and there may be adhesives with the right properties that are available in hobbyist quantities. I will follow this with interest and hope for a good solution.

The one thing the Jet really has going for it is that the pressure rollers are very close to the drum. That means you can put very short stuff through as well as pretty thin stuff. If I think hard enough about it, I convince myself that stress goes as the cube of the span, so keeping the rollers close is critical to getting reasonable performance with thin items...and I know in retrospect that's what Jet means when they say they can go down to 1/32", but they should say that in their specs.

[Wilbur Harris]

Doesn't have much to do with the original subject - but kinda....

What is the minimum dust collector I'll need to make a 10 inch drum sander work right?