Fat mortar joints in stone walls

[Stephen Tashiro]

The local style in stone walls is to have fat mortar joints. I'm curious why this would be done. Is it fashion? Something peculiar about the local stone? Skill or lack of skill on the part of the masons? (A quick search for photos to show a stone wall gave me the web page of a welding company. See the stone work in "design 99" http://www.torreswelding.com/fencing_and_panels.htm )

I've always read that fat joints in masonry are weak and less resistant to weathering. Mortar mix sold for brick and block work isn't very strong. Can some special mortar be used that makes fat joints reasonable?

[Mel Fulks]

I don't like the big joints either. Looks like they are just making the job easier,less fitting .To do stone walls without using a lot of rubble and big joints ,a good mason told me he always ordered twice the stone needed ,then hauled all leftovers to next job or storage.Most likely the contractor is capable of better work than those photos .For higher price.

[Brian Elfert]

Stone jobs like design #99 almost always look like a DIY job when I see them. They also tend to have mortar all up on the stone. It looks awful to me.

[Stephen Tashiro]

Stone jobs like design #99 almost always look like a DIY job when I see them. They also tend to have mortar all up on the stone. It looks awful to me.

In this neck of the woods, the professional jobs have fat joints too. I looked at a wall that's being built by a contractor. The technique appears to be to pile the rocks up so they form a wall without any mortar. (So the stones are touching in some places even though it doesn't look like it when you only see the face of the wall.) Then I think they put mortar in the joints, although I haven't witnessed this part of the work yet.

Another curious thing is that many of the the rocks are delivered as big boulders and one guy has the job of breaking them up with a sledgehammer.

[Brian Elfert]

Even if a professional did the work the stone work with the large joints it still looks like a DIY job when I see it. Hopefully a professional job will have no excess mortar on the stones themselves.

[Mel Fulks]

Quality varies .Sophistication of buyers varies.The stone walls of New England farms are charming and seen on postcards ,but not cathedral quality.Always more ordinary work than good work. I wouldn't be influenced by that company's ads,just tell them what you want and decide if its worth the money.

[Stephen Tashiro]

Quality varies .Sophistication of buyers varies.

I'd like to emphasize that it isn't just some stone walls in my area that have fat joints, it's nearly all of them. And by "my area", I don't mean just my side of town, I mean the whole town and also the whole of the neighboring city of El Paso TX. (Of course some have said the entire geographic region lacks sophistication!)

Here's one under construction:http://s716.photobucket.com/user/tashirosgt/media/RockWall_zpsc5fabc8f.jpg.html?sort=3&o=44

[Tim Boger]

I've done a bunch of stone work and the example you've shown is a sloppy mess .... in my opinion.

With a reasonable amount of skill and a larger amount of pride it would look a lot better than that.

[Jason Roehl]

Cheap, fast, good: pick two. Most people pick the first two.

[Curt Fuller]

Stephen, the strength and durability of mortar joints is more related to the type of mortar than the thickness of the joints. In the case of a rock wall like you've pictured, which is not a load bearing wall, a type S mortar that is about 1800psi would be best. It has more cement than a type M (interior non load bearing) and less lime than a type N (high psi structural). The thickness of the joints is going to vary when using natural stone. So you're going to have places where there may be a very thing joint and places where it is thicker. But what you're really after in a wall like that is surface area of the joint, or the area the mortar is in contact with the stone. That and the type S mortar which will adhere to the stone more than a stronger type N and have more psi strength than the type M. As far as the style, that varies all over the world and most good stone masons can give you whatever look you want.

[Greg R Bradley]

264887
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264888

[Mel Fulks]

Thanks Greg. For proving good work is still available .Not cheap ,but available.

[glenn bradley]

I agree that #99 looks like the wall that was done after the 6-pack lunch break. Styles and tastes differ but, that looks unattractive and amateurish to me.