Need Info on Gravograph IS200

[Steve Clarkson]

I had a company contact me looking to have 5,000 brass nametags engraved. They bought a Gravograph IS200 to make them themselves but didn't realize that they have to oxidize them to darken the engraving, so apparently they don't want to do it themselves anymore. They want to give me the machine, along with the brass nametags they had printed with their logo and pay me to engrave the 5,000 nametags. I've never used a rotary engraver.....how long would it take to engrave just a name on one tag, let alone 5,000? Is the IS200 easy to set up and use? Any other info or advice would be appreciated.

[David Takes]

The machine is realistically worth $.35 - $.40 per tag, so whatever your time is worth, you can deduct that from the final unit price.

As far as how long it takes to engrave a name, that is going to vary considerable based on the typestyle, number of characters and size of characters. We would need more information.

As far as learning how to run the machine, it's basically run with a retrofitted CAD program. I could have you up and running in less than five minutes for this type of job.

[Mike Null]

I agree with Dave but I would offer them a laser sublimated brass tag instead of engraved. It looks better and will hold up well not to mention faster and easier to produce.

But this is a deal you can't turn down.

[Steve Clarkson]

Thanks for the input guys. Mike.......do you mean dye sublimation? Or is laser sublimation some other secret process that I don't know about?

[Ross Moshinsky]

I don't think you'll be able to sublimate the plates as they probably don't have the protective cover on it still and the printed/screened logo will probably not hold up to the heat. Laser sublimation is simply sublimation using a laser printer instead of an inkjet.

As for the job, it's a lot of babysitting. Assuming it comes with some sort of version of Gravostyle, you're going to send over the job in batches of 100. You'll engrave a plate at a time (assume about 15-20 seconds per plate + load/unload time). The machine will automatically stack the jobs so you should be able to just hit go after you load up the new plate. You'll need to blow off the brass to get off all the dust and then wipe it down with acid, then clean the plate after. It's not rocket science but to do this job efficiently, you're going to be sitting there watching the machine changing plates for hours on end. It's not a load it and go do something else kind of job. My guess is you're going to spend about 8 - 8 hour shifts to get this job done between the engraving, darkening, cleaning, and bagging.

[Mike Null]

Steve

Laser sublimation is not new and when I'm working with with black I use laser sub rather than dye sub. It's better and cheaper--uses ordinary paper.

If the brass needs to be oxidized then it has a coating which is most likely suitable for sublimation.

The photo is engraver's brass with laser sub.264371

[Steve Clarkson]

Holy !!!! ONE nameplate at a time???????? Ugh...

[Mike Null]

Ross makes a good point about the screen printed logo but laser sub is done at lower temps than dye sub so it may work. You can run 8.5 x 11 sheets pretty quickly.

[Ross Moshinsky]

Holy !!!! ONE nameplate at a time???????? Ugh...

You might be able to do two with the IS200. It's small "bed". It only fits 8.9"x3". If I got this job, I'd probably spend the money and get the plate feeder for my IS400. That or I'd make a jig and load my IS6000 with a bunch of plates and run it and leave it.


Ross makes a good point about the screen printed logo but laser sub is done at lower temps than dye sub so it may work. You can run 8.5 x 11 sheets pretty quickly.

First, I only do laser sublimation WITH the clear protective sheet still on the brass/aluminum. Any time I have done it differently, the results have been unacceptable. Maybe different toner reacts differently but the stuff I use, this is the case. If they printed something on the plates, the protective sheet is likely to be gone.

Second, I've tried to sublimate on a Barhill plate with a screen printed boarder. The boarder peeled off when I removed the paper/clear protective sheet. This was done at 350 degrees for roughly 30 seconds. I'm not saying it can't be done. I'm just saying there is a real possibility that it won't work.

[Paul Phillips]

So for those of us who know nothing about Laser sublimation, is that the same thing as Alumamark, and if so would something like Alumamark work for Steve in this case? Correct me if I'm wrong but doing these on the IS200 one at a time would be probably the slowest possible method available. Depending on the font wouldn't you have to do a diamond drag etch into the Brass and then hand brush each one with some Brass black etching acid, then rinse with water to neutralize, then dry and if using as exterior possibly clear coat over that to seal it? Seems like laser is definitely the way to go here.

[Kathy Madan]

It is a one up kind of job if the nameplates are already all cut out. You can run it as a sheet and cut them out after engraving which would speed things up, but I am guessing the company already owns the individual pieces. You can diamond engrave, burnish or rotary engrave them depending on your customers needs. If you are rotary cutting them, you will need to know how to run lubrication to cut down on burrs. My guess is they are diamond or burnish engraving them. We do a lot of these, but never 5,000 in one job! We use a Q-tip to apply the oxidizer, let set and wipe off. We do not rinse/dry them. It will be a somewhat tedious job that I would probably hire my teenage kids to do.

[Mike Null]

Ross' points are all worth checking out but I would test all other options before going to a 1 at a time diamond drag job like this.

If you have some blanks with the logo I'll be happy to run a few tests for you.

Ross--with my previous toner I had to remove the plastic first to get a sharp image. With my new toner, supposedly 1200 dpi toner according to my supplier, I can reduce my press time to 15 seconds and leave the plastic on. I also press at 350. I do get a sharp image with this process and no toner clean up.

[Steve Clarkson]

Thanks Mike!