Figuring things out while doing a project

[Roger Chandler]

I have noticed that I am a bit oriented towards trying a lot of different forms. I do things that are new to me or that it has been a good while since I have done one [excluding lidded boxes :D] a lot of the time. I do not know if boredom sets in or what, but doing a bowl, even a different shaped one, or whatever just is not what gets me going. I do a bowl every so often, but that does not spark my enthusiasm like learning a new form, or improving significantly on some previous form.

I have found myself liking to do wood combinations........things with lids, forms with flared out edges such as vases, and hollow forms with finials on occasion ........which all leads me to my point ...........

Many times in the process I have to stop and figure out the "how" of what I want to do........such as how I am going to hold this on the lathe to reverse.........what type of jam chuck do I need.......and since I like finishing while on the lathe.....how will I hold it so as to gain access to all parts [which sometimes has to be a two or three part process]

My question for you is .......when you do a project.........what percentage of the total time you spend on it is occupied with figuring things out [whatever that may be in your case?]

I would ask you to make a guestimate..............I think mine might go up as high as 15% on some multi-step projects. Does this sound reasonable to you, or are you one that turns mostly the same kind of form repeatedly and have it down to a science?

Or are you one of those analytical minds that have everything figured out in advance of ever chucking up a piece of wood on your lathe, like our esteemed moderator, John K, who sketches everything on paper and devises a plan before going to the shop?

[Brian Finney]

Roger,
Like you I want to do different every time. For me it’s the figuring out that is the interesting bit – to the extent that I rarely apply finish to anything, the interest has gone by the time sanding and finish are appropriate.
Take John Beaver’s recently posted basket weave bowl – a beautiful bowl, but for me the real beauty is working out how he did it.
Brian

[Dan Forman]

Sometimes it takes me longer to pick a piece of wood than it does to turn it. Same for figuring out how to do it. 15% would be very low for me if it was unfamiliar, depending on the type of project of course. :) Sometimes brushing up on skills is required as well, where would that count?

Then you have to take into consideration the added work time of fixing things or starting over because I figured out how to do it wrong. This may bring it back into balance, unless I have to select another piece of wood...

Oh, and does looking for tools (as in "where did I put that blankety blank gouge") count as work time?

Dan

[Brian Brown]

What Dan said....word for word.

[carl mesaros]

Hello. I have been enjoying this forum for almost three years and have learned a great deal from you folks. I currently turn on a Jet 1642. (lusting for a 2036 Oneway)
Roger your question sparked an interest that I have often thought about.
I have been turning for about 3 1/2 years and now woodturning consumes 80% of my shop time. I am always looking for new challenges and when I find a project that I find interesting , I usually make 8 to 10 of them. By the 10th one I usually have become quite proficient at creating it but I am also starting to become bored. I have made 75% of David Reed Smith's projects from Woodturning Design and his web site and love the challenge of making the assorted jigs that many of them require.
So the answer to your question is on the first piece of a new project may be 70% thought and as I reach the 10th piece it has become about 10% and boredom sets in.
I have in my shop a shelf of failures and blow ups, most intricate Christmas tree ornaments, David's eccentric trees come to mind, have suffered blow ups before I master a new technique. Sound familiar?
I'll try to be a better contributor in the future.

[Grant Wilkinson]

Since I started playing with open segmented pieces, my planning time has gone way up. First, it's planning and making up the cut list, then figuring out how to hold it in the lathe. I generally need to do some intermediate turning before all the layers are glued up, so I need to plan out how and when to do that. I've also done some pieces that are too big for my lathe, (lack of planning??), so I've then had to plan and build lathe mods.

I short, 15% would be quite low for me on many of the things that I try. On "regular" bowls and forms, I do pretty much no planning other than to visualize the shape that I want. Turning that shape is another story entirely.

[Jeremy Hamaker]

I would not say planning time so much as 'musing' time. And I don't know if it technically counts because it doesn't happen after I've selected my next project wood. What happens is, I stare at a piece of wood in my collection and try to decide just what the heck I even want to do with it. Do I cut it here and here and make a couple bowls? Try a big hollow form? Cut it this way and make some handles out of it, or goblets? I know, I'll just leave it there and think about it later... sigh.

[Wally Dickerman]

Good question Roger. To me, what you're doing is part of the enjoyment of turning. In my early days of turning (a looong time ago) I had to figure out how to do EVERYTHING. I knew no other turners, there were no websites, no videos, no clubs, etc. Many of the modern day tools, chucks, etc. didn't exist so I had to figure out jam chucks and jigs. Once in a while a a light would come on and I would come up with a better way to do something. That's why I have that bald spot over my forehead....it's from smacking myself in the head and saying...why didn't I think of that before. I think that perhaps turners today have things too easy. I see questions posted and I think...why doesn't he figure it out for himself?...To me, that's part of turning. I still use some of my old methods and tools because they still work for me.

When you're doing new things you need to do several...you'll learn something new on every one of them.

[Roger Chandler]

From the responses so far, it seems as if the type of turning does play a role .........especially segmenting. I'll just use myself as an example of what I am referring to..........

When I decide on what form I am going to do, and the piece of wood [s] then I go ahead and put it on the lathe. Then if I want to add a band of different wood, then the "how to do it" comes into play. What type of joint, for instance ...mortise and tenon, butt joint..... how thick should that joint be, how to hold it on till glue dries, CA or titebond? Then reversing..........jam chuck, vacuum chuck, or drag out the cole jaws and change them out on the chuck?

These things take time, and they certainly add to the overall project time......then there are the sanding questions.......all by hand, wet sand, power sand? Then finish techniques........how many coats? Pop the grain with shellac? These add to the overall project time............

I ask these questions to get a sense from other turners to assess how I compare in the use of my time, and do I need to approach things with more planning before ever starting a project? When one is limited on the amount of time they can devote to woodworking/turning..........time management is a good thing to take a look at.

What do you think your percentages are in these areas?

[Roger Chandler]

Good question Roger. To me, what you're doing is part of the enjoyment of turning. In my early days of turning (a looong time ago) I had to figure out how to do EVERYTHING. I knew no other turners, there were no websites, no videos, no clubs, etc. Many of the modern day tools, chucks, etc. didn't exist so I had to figure out jam chucks and jigs. Once in a while a a light would come on and I would come up with a better way to do something. That's why I have that bald spot over my forehead....it's from smacking myself in the head and saying...why didn't I think of that before. I think that perhaps turners today have things too easy. I see questions posted and I think...why doesn't he figure it out for himself?...To me, that's part of turning. I still use some of my old methods and tools because they still work for me.

When you're doing new things you need to do several...you'll learn something new on every one of them.

Thanks Wally..........I was typing my last post when yours posted, so I did not get to read it until mine was finished and uploading........I guess we do have it pretty good now ..........I have always had the philosophy to work smart first, then hard.........I don't think re-inventing the wheel every time I go at a new type of form is a wise use of available knowledge and resources..........

Guys like you have blazed the trail! I am grateful to have you and others give us upstarts the benefit of that wealth of knowledge you possess. I also do not want to weary others either, but wood turners by and large are a generous lot and have a helpful attitude.............thanks Wally!!! :)

[Mike Peace]

I have always been interested in turning something new, usually after seeing someone demonstrate or in a magazine article, book or DVD. I like to turn a wide variety of stuff, not just bowls or platters or whatever. I do hold things in lots of different ways and always made what I needed as I went along. So, I always have scraps for jam or friction chucks, I have several chucks with different size jaws and a vacuum chuck. As a result, how to hold the wood is not a big mystery to figure out.

Seldom do I do the finish on the lathe. So when I start a new project, it is seldom do I have to come up with a new way to hold it. Here is a Youtube video of a demo I did on how to hold wood on a lathe. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=aUXil-5dEeo Be advised it runs almost an hour and a half.

[charlie knighton]

its probably 85 % planning for a multi-axis wallhanging, and yes i have had to start over, the discards are used for practice before committing to the new wallhanging, the turning part is mostly figured out but the rest is still evolving