How much more sanding could I possibly do?

[Michael Dunn]

Hey guys!

So I started putting some GF Brown Mahogany Gel Stain on these Baltic Birch table tops I'm making for a restaurant. I sanded the entire surface at a rate of approximately 1ft/sec for about 3-5 minutes using my ETS-125 sander. I used 120, 180, and 220 grit (3-5 minutes on each grit)

After the first coat of GF stain I'm seeing a TON of marks horizontal to the grain. I'm guessing its marks from the drum sander at the mill.

How much more sanding can I do? I used 18MM 60X60 RUSSIAN BIRCH B/BB. The sales lady told me I had two good faces. I thoroughly inspected each piece before choosing which side would be the actual visible table surface. These lines were not at all visible to me until I applied the first coat of gel stain.

I doubt this will become less apparent with each coat of stain or clear coat.

Has anybody come across this after what 'should be' adequate sanding? Should I not use this brand of plywood? She said it was formaldehyde free so I went for that. Columbia, I think was the brand.

What can be done about this issue today? As well as in the future.

[Grant Wilkinson]

I can't speak to the kind of plywood you used. One foot/sec seems fast to me Did you wipe the piece down after each grit. What did you have in the way of dust collection on the sander? I've read that with too much suction on that sander, you can actually scratch the piece badly since the sander sucks itself down onto the piece and applies too much pressure.

I agree that the scratches will not improve with more stain or clear coat. You need to sand them out before doing any further finishing. When you think it is good, wipe it down with mineral spirits. While it's wet, the scratches will be more obvious. It flashes off quite quickly.

[bobby milam]

I've used Baltic Birch that I just bought at a box store because they had it cheap at the time and never had a problem with it. I'd like to see a picture of what it is doing to you though. I am by no means an expert but when I have problems with anything close to what you are describing, it always happens to me when I use gel stain. I love using gel stain for my work but I have to really be careful about choosing to use it. Do you have a scrap piece left over that you could try a non gel stain and see the results?

[Michael Dunn]

I'm using a CT22E with my ETS-125. Yes, I wiped with MS between each grit.i set the CT22E until there is no suction cup effect on the workpiece. Which is pretty much on the lowest setting.

[Mel Fulks]

I'm no finisher and its been several years since I've seen any Baltic birch plywood. Most of the time when I see it ,seems to be unstained and clear coated. Is it possible it's rotary cut and permeated with too much glue to take stain well ? I can't think of any other reason why the marks did not show earlier.

[Michael Dunn]

I'm no finisher and its been several years since I've seen any Baltic birch plywood. Most of the time when I see it ,seems to be unstained and clear coated. Is it possible it's rotary cut and permeated with too much glue to take stain well ? I can't think of any other reason why the marks did not show earlier.

I hate, absolutely HATE to say it, but, this sure seems like a viable reason.

Any thoughts for how I can overcome this?

3 more of the 9 table tops I've made are of this same Baltic Birch ply from the 60"x60" 18mm sheets. The others were 3/4"x4'x8'. Just due to the dimensions of them.

[Richard Coers]

Some baltic birch is horrible, and water based stain makes it 10 times worse. I'm not sure that there is true baltic birch making it into the United States anymore. Think I read somewhere that stopped years ago. The stuff you buy now is a cross between a corn cob and, well I don't know what else. As you have seen, it's no good for furniture. Drawer sides maybe, but even then it can snag clothes if they are put in it. If you absolutely had to use it, rough sand it, then wipe it down with a wet cloth, then move to the finer grits. Apple ply is a far superior product. http://www.appleply.com/

[Michael Dunn]

I know about Apple Ply. Beautiful stuff. Haven't worked with it yet though. My local lumber yard is an Apple Ply dealer. I never got the price though.

I'll have to call my sales person to see what she thinks about my issue.

[Ty Williams]

My thoughts, from having an ETS-150/5 and using it to sand real baltic birch (1.5m square panels, not the 4x8 panels of weird chinese "birch" ply from a big box store) and getting very acceptable results:

1) Try one inch per second, not one foot.
2) Don't press down on the sander at all, that makes it angry. Just kind of guide it around with your finger tips.
3) 3-5 minutes per grit would work out to no more than 4 square feet of project for me.

Along with the annoying possibility that the wood is contaminated with something (like the glue used to make it) and won't take the stain, as previously mentioned. I have to say I've gotten consistently terrible results with GF Gel Stain, it and I just don't get along.

[John Coloccia]

Let me just say that you'd better start experimenting on a test panel or you will sand right through the paper thin joke of a top layer that passes for plywood these days.

[Chris Fournier]

Let me just say that you'd better start experimenting on a test panel or you will sand right through the paper thin joke of a top layer that passes for plywood these days.

John is right, you don't have a lot of veneer to play with. Baltic birch is at best blotchy and really more of a substrate than a show face kinda product. The veneer has an open and closed face usually, look for the closed face and that is your show face.

I'd say that your sanding speed is way too fast, move the sander along in a methodical path at 1/12 the speed. 120 is the key grit as it will take out the heavier scratches, the other grits will just bring you up to a consistant finish. Don't sand too fine or staining will be a problem. No need for MS between grits if you have good dust extraction at the sander. Vacuum between griits.

[glenn bradley]

No real help here but, your recent experience mirrors mine with plywood products. I power sand at about 1 inch per second on solid woods but, that could be hazardous on plywood. Also power sanding ply can remove softer areas and leave harder areas creating a "lumpy" appearance. This is probably a direct result of my inexperience with ply products.

Applying the finish to plywood is when you get to see all the glue, core irregularities and so forth telegraph through the thin top layer. I avoid plywood but, when I have to use it I seek out veneer plywood with a decently thick show face. Using a non penetrating stain can lessen the telegraphing issue but, I have switched to using only clear finishes on plywood products. I will spray a thin shellac barrier coat and then top coat.

My preference is to avoid ply altogether except for shop cabinets or carcass structural interiors. We have folks on here who do wonders with sheet goods so, it can be done. I am always glad to see posts by these folks since I always learn something new from them.

[Michael Dunn]

John is right, you don't have a lot of veneer to play with. Baltic birch is at best blotchy and really more of a substrate than a show face kinda product. The veneer has an open and closed face usually, look for the closed face and that is your show face.

I'd say that your sanding speed is way too fast, move the sander along in a methodical path at 1/12 the speed. 120 is the key grit as it will take out the heavier scratches, the other grits will just bring you up to a consistant finish. Don't sand too fine or staining will be a problem. No need for MS between grits if you have good dust extraction at the sander. Vacuum between griits.

So should I try sanding again at a slower rate? I called the lumber yard. They offered to give me 4 more sheets ASAP. I told them that's great, but it doesn't really help with my clients deadline. Since I'd have to start all over and lose out on the time.

My sales rep is contacting the vendor sales rep to see if he can offer some advice as to how I can overcome this.

[Michael Dunn]

It seems to be more apparent with the GF Brown Mahogany than the GF Georgian Cherry. These are some test pieces that were only lightly sanded. This was done over a week ago.

FWIW, not like it matters. I really wanted my client to go with the Georgian Cherry.

[Howard Acheson]

Yup, that can be a problem with Random Orbit Sanders. As the abrasive rotates some of its grits are going to be working across the grain. That's the reason in my classes I used to insist that the final sanding be by hand moving in the direction of the grain. That will tend to remove the cross grain marks left from the prior grit.

Be careful machine sanding plywood. The veneers are very thin and are easy to sand through. Plywood is machine sanded at the factory to about 180 grit so sanding does not need to be at any lower grit unless there is some defect you are trying to deal with.

Here is something I wrote a number of years ago for a local woodworking club news letter. It may help.

Sanding wood--hard or soft--beyond 220 does little more than burnish the wood making staining difficult. This is particularly true if you are using a pigment stain which sits on the surface and relies on "nooks and crannies" to impart color. Softer more porous woods can be sanded to to 220 but harder less absorbent woods may stain best if only sanded to 150. The best compromise is to aim for 180 grit.

A number of years ago a large cabinet/custom furniture shop I was involved with did series of adhesion tests with various finishes and sealers. As part of this test we explored adhesion based on sanding grit. We found about the same adhesion up to 180 - 220. Beyond 220 adhesion dropped off due to burnishing of the underlying wood particularly when non-linear machine sanders were used. This was tested on birch panels. We also found that the resulting smoothness of the first coat of finish was not materially affected by the smoothnes of the underlying wood for sandpaper grits between 150 - 220.. The smoothest surface substrate for final finishes was obtained by sanding lightly after the first coat of finish was applied and dry. Which makes the case for a thinned first coat of finish.

So our conclusion was that sanding beyond 180-220 was not necessary and could be actually detrimental.

But, most important was that there was a big appearance affect if the surface was not HAND sanded in the direction of the grain using the highest grit used on the sanding machine. A flat pad sander produced a much flatter surface than a ROS. However, both required final hand sanding with the grain for optimum appearence. If not hand sanded, swirl scratches could show. Final hand sanding using a sanding pad in the direction of the grain is a must.

To carry it one step further, sanding at 320-400 grit after the first coat and subsequent coats was the optimum. No improved appearence was noticed by between coat sanding beyond 400 for varnish. 400 was the sweet spot for thinner finishes. Between coat sanding was always done by hand whether for flattening or for adhesion.

I think you will find similar thoughts in the popular finishing books but YMMV.

Finally, the first coat of ANY finish will soak little shards of wood and cause them to raise whether the surface was sanded, planed or scraped. When the first coat of finish dries these hardened shards are what causes the surface to feel rough. Sanding with 320 paper will remove these hardened shards and subsequent coats will go on smoother. So, smoothness counts after the first coat of finish, but not much before that.

The finish left by the sizing machine determines the starting grit. Jointers, planers, belt sanders etc, should leave a finish that allows starting with 100 grit. From there, go to 120 grit and sand until the marks from the prior grit are gone, then move to 150 and finish at 180 grit.

Plywood is factory sanded to 180 grit. Therefore, it's best to not sand plywood except with 180 grit and sand by hand. Get the first coat of finish on and then sand with 320. That way you are sanding the finish, not the wood. This avoids sanding through today's very thin surface veneer.

A final note, there is no need to wait until you are applying the clear coat to see that you have a sanding miscue. Wipe your sanded area with mineral spirits, naphtha or alcohol and it will not only preview the color but show up sanding problems or glue marks.

[Michael Dunn]

Here's a pic. I thought I uploaded one last night, but I did not.

I don't believe this is from my ROS. Perhaps I didn't sand enough or slow enough. I'm just trying to figure out how to overcome this. I need to get these tops done ASAP. I'd like to install them Friday or Saturday the latest.

[John Coloccia]

Can you feel the lines? Do they appear the instant you apply stain or does it take a little while? I'm sure there's at least a couple of folks that know where I'm going with this.

[Michael Dunn]

Can you feel the lines? Do they appear the instant you apply stain or does it take a little while? I'm sure there's at least a couple of folks that know where I'm going with this.

There are two fairly wide line which I may be barely feeling. The rest are pretty narrow and I can't feel a thing. I'm thinking that no matter how much I sand these are NOT going away.

[Richard Coers]

I'm almost certain you have voids or imperfections in the veneer under the face veneer. It's called telegraphing. On cheap plywood, they don't butt the inner plies tightly together. You get a gap that lets the water based stain soak deeply through the face veneer at the void, and not in the adjacent surfaces. It gives you that dark line. It's never going away. If these are scrap, you could stick a pin through the face veneer to varify. Only way to salvage would be to add a ton of toner to a clear coat and basically paint the surface. Crap plywood, crap results.

[Michael Dunn]

I'm almost certain you have voids or imperfections in the veneer under the face veneer. It's called telegraphing. On cheap plywood, they don't butt the inner plies tightly together. You get a gap that lets the water based stain soak deeply through the face veneer at the void, and not in the adjacent surfaces. It gives you that dark line. It's never going away. If these are scrap, you could stick a pin through the face veneer to varify. Only way to salvage would be to add a ton of toner to a clear coat and basically paint the surface. Crap plywood, crap results.

Duely noted. By toner do you mean dye? Would more coats of the gel stain even out the light/dark spots from the lines?

[Grant Wilkinson]

With those pics, it seems clear that your issue is not the ROS sanding process. Those aren't sanding swirls. It looks to me that you are actually "seeing" through the veneer layer into the substrate. I would suggest that, short of starting over, Robert's suggestion is the only way to fix it. You need to cover it with something opaque.

[Richard Coers]

Toners are used in the clear coat. You can't add anything more to the wood, it will never change. The lines will always be darker. You have to seal off that color, and build on top of the clear. Behlens and Mohawk make an aerosol toner, or you can use TransTint dyes in shellac, lacquer, or water based clears. You should prepare a sample board to play with. You don't want more mistakes on the table tops. Sand a piece of your plywood and stain just like you have now. Then put on a clear coat to the sample board, then add some tint to your clear coat. Start building layers until the color gets to where you want it. Add at least two just clear on top of that. Watch for manufacturers maximum film thicknesses as you build them up. When you are comfortable with the sample board, start working on the table. I would put on at least one clear coat, with no color. Then start building layers. Maybe a denser color on the first coat, but if you keep the tint quite dilute, you can control the color as you build. I assume you know I am talking about spraying the finish. Spraying is the only way to do this. Brushing moves the color around and makes it impossible to lay down an even tone.

[Michael Dunn]

I just saw the last reply... Before seeing that I decided to give sanding one last shot. I can't tell if it made an actual difference or if I just REALLY want there to be a difference.

What do you think?

I have a Husky HVLP gun. I've sprayed some laquer before with good results. Are you saying I should spray the stain? Or just the clear coat? I feel like such a noob now. Where do I get the tint? Can I have one of the big box stores tint a clear coat?

[Chris Fournier]

Only you can answer this question by looking at the ply thickness. Given the fact that you sanded very quickly I'd say that you can indeed back up and have at it again, start at 150 grit perhaps. You have nothing to lose really. ROS sanders do not leave lineal scratches, rather they leave tiny circular scratches. The images you've posted are pretty much spot on what BB looks like when you colour it with a dye stain. If you wanted an even colour over BB you'd have to use a toner in the applied finish after sealing the BB with a clear coat. As you are learning, BB is not really suited as a "show wood". You'll be okay, just back up an resand with caution.

[George Gyulatyan]

I see the same exact thing on my current batch of BB, and I don't have to apply any finish or stain to see them. These "ridges" are visible under raking light just fine, so you don't have to experiment with stains to see it.

I am wondering if these are lines left by the knife used to cut the veneer. I disagree with the folk that think that this is telegraphing of voides or glue contamination. The pattern is way too regular.

At the moment I don't know what the solution is, other than applying veneer - crossgrain.

I am thinking of sanding a panel crossgrain with 80 grit paper and see what that ends up looking like. Luckily I don't have any deadlines and I am just making some shop stuff with this batch for it to matter at the moment.

[Jeff Monson]

I'd agree it looks like knife marks. It appears in your pics that you have sanded out the marks in some areas (like some of the edges). They may sand out, but you are flirting with disaster with that thin veneer. Maybe a bad suggestion, but try starting with 80g on a couple sample pieces and see where it takes you.

[Richard Coers]

Wow, cross grain with 80 grit. I'd try wetting the raw plywood veneer really wet and see if that will swell up all those lines and then wait a couple of days, and then sand. Maybe even a wet cloth and a hot clothes iron on that. With that method you are steaming the veneer and the water won't sink in so deeply. Not too much though because the adhesive may suffer. Any stained plywood will not work with the wetting. 80 grit is like rocks. Are you sure the veneer thickness will take that? I would try a card scraper before I went to that aggressive of sandpaper. I looked at the other two pics and enlarged them. They do look like burnish marks, or dull veneer knives. I had only looked at the far right pic when I made my conclusion.

Michael,
I don't like to spray stain. I was talking about the toner and clear coats. TransTint is available at Rockler or Woodcraft. Either local or online order. Homestead Finishing for all finishing supplies too. Their new web site says they are the manufacturer of TransTint. http://www.homesteadfinishingproducts.com/
and a good video on toner http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cC1cHxUf8kc

[Sam Murdoch]

Oh man - I can so relate - deadlines and commitments and you have work that does not reflect your effort and intent. :( Michael, you need to take a breath and regroup. Forget the weekend delivery. "Flirting with disaster" if you keep sanding. There is already color in the surface and more work will not obscure the lines. I am with those who suggest veneer or an opaque finish.

Have your client look at what you have. Maybe in the quality of light of their final home this will not be an issue. If they balk, just tell them that you agree - give them a few options and be clear that you will make it right but that you need another week. No one can beat you up for trying your best and having things go badly in spite. They might surprise you and say that a good paint will be fine.

Also your sander is too much of a light weight for this kind of work. Since you have Festool try the ETS 150/3. Yes it will make a world of difference. Howard's advice in post # 15 is good to heed.

[Michael Dunn]

Well, before I saw these last three posts I went ahead and sanded it all again. I started with 120 and then... 60, yes... 60. I didn't have 80 or 100. I then went to 120, and then 180 and stopped for the night. I'll wipe it down with MS and do 220, then MS, then start staining. I think it'll be alright.

Not exactly a close up pic, but it looks great in person. We'll see tomorrow.

Thanx for the tips guys!!!

[Michael Dunn]

Oh! And I think I may be buying that ETS-150 too. You're totally right. This would've been much easier with it. I can get it used on amazon for $280 shipped.

[Mark Carlson]

Michael,

Seems like the RS2E half sheet sander would be perfect for this job. It was the last festool sander I bought but the one I use 90% of the time. Not sure why this sander isn't more popular.

~mark

[Michael Dunn]

Michael,

Seems like the RS2E half sheet sander would be perfect for this job. It was the last festool sander I bought but the one I use 90% of the time. Not sure why this sander isn't more popular.

~mark

Yup!!! I needed that about 2 hours ago!!! So, IF (who am I kidding?!?!?) WHEN I get another Festool sander. Which should I get? The ETS-150? Or the RS2E?

Does it still have the oval dust port? I read that it doesn't connect to the normal hose. I hope that info is incorrect.

[Phil Thien]

Skip-sanded plywood?

Maybe the thickness out of the press was too close to the final thickness they desired, so the sander was just skimming the face?

I think sanding the snot out of them should help a great deal. Except for the lines, it looks like decent quality BB plywood to me (no glaring voids, consistent ply thickness, faces about as thick as inner ply thickness).

Let us know how the piece you sanded the stain off of takes the next coat.

Your supplier owes you some free plywood.

(Edit to add: It could be knife marks, but in that case if it is rotary cut, the knife marks would be going in the opposite direction, right? Maybe the veneer isn't rotary cut, and it is knife marks. Is the veneer used in BB plywood rotary cut?).

[Mark Carlson]

Yes it has a oval dust port but the festool hose easily slips on. I also have the Rotex and the ETS-150 but the half sheet is my favorite. Its great at sanding large surfaces and getting into corners. Its pretty much fool proof because you cant tip it like with a ROS, you pretty much just direct it. If your going to build a lot of table and cabinets I would get the RS2E. You can also use any sander paper, if you get the plate that punches the holes. I'm kinda partial to Vitex paper.

~mark

[Michael Dunn]

[QUOTE="Phil Thien;2117842"])Let us know how the piece you sanded the stain off of takes the next coat.

Your supplier owes you some free plywood./QUOTE]

That's what I'm talking about! I asked for a refund on 8 sheets even though this project used 4 with the other 4 for another project that was painted. I requested all 8 be refunded since I've wasted two days trying to resolve this issue.

I'll show what it looks like tomorrow after the first coat.

[johnny means]

Micheal, what your seeing is not a staining issue. I coat a few hundred sheets a year of baltic nirch with opaque waterbourne lacquer and get the same issue when my sanding is inadequate. What you're seeing is surface irregularity from the production process. Baltic birch is not sanded to the same semi finished state as other plywoods as it is sold mainly as a substrate. I sand my baltic birch starting with 80 or 100 grit wich will actually level the surface. No I do not get sand through. Unlike the veneer on cherry, maple, or mahogany plywood baltic birchs outer layer is the same thickness as the inner plys. What would be the point of using two thin plys of birch to cover 11 more layers of birch?

[Michael Dunn]

Update...

I sanded to 180 last night and 220 this morning. Wiped with MS, let it flash, then applied one coat of Gel Stain. It's not totally dry yet, but the lines are gone. Who'd've think I only needed to sand for another 2 hours!?!?!?

I think one more coat of stain should do. Hopefully... Then clear coat. It's looking like Monday for the install.

[Jeff Monson]

Maybe a RO150 would be a better compliment to your ETS125. Glad you figured out the problem.

[Prashun Patel]

Congratulations. It aint time wasted if you learned something. I know i did just reading this thread.

[Pat Barry]

Good work Mike! Never say never.

[Alan Bienlein]

I've found the best and most consistent while sanding was to be consistent. I start going across the grain overlapping by 50% over the complete surface in on direction. When I reach the other end I then go back over at a 45 degree angle to the first pass with 50% overlap over the whole surface. I then go back over it again at a 45 degree oppisite to the pass I just did at 45 so they crisscross. The final pass is with the grain. I blow off the dust between grits. Since I've been doing it this way I find sanding rather enjoyable as I no longer worry about if I sanded an area enough or if I missed any spots.

[Sam Murdoch]

So glad you worked your way through to a satisfying conclusion. Congrats on your persistence and results. I was sweating for you :eek: but now, I'm happy for you :D.

[George Gyulatyan]

60 grit eh? Nice! Good thing is the face veneers on BBs are pretty thick so getting aggressive isn't necessarily asking for a disaster.

Glad you got the issue resolved!

[Chris Friesen]

Let me just say that you'd better start experimenting on a test panel or you will sand right through the paper thin joke of a top layer that passes for plywood these days.

This is baltic birch, all layers are the same thickness, and they're roughly 1mm thick.

[johnny means]

Micheal,

Sanding, IME, is usually the most time consuming part of any job. It is also often the most neglected step in a job. I would probably budget a half an hour of sanding for any one of your tables. Starting with a courser grit will greatly reduce sanding time. Another mistake often made by less experienced guys is milking a sheet of sandpaper. A mentor of mine told me "Sandpaper is cheaper. Labor is expensive." As soon as a sheet starts to loose its toothiness, toss it.

[Chris Fournier]

Micheal,

Sanding, IME, is usually the most time consuming part of any job. It is also often the most neglected step in a job. I would probably budget a half an hour of sanding for any one of your tables. Starting with a courser grit will greatly reduce sanding time. Another mistake often made by less experienced guys is milking a sheet of sandpaper. A mentor of mine told me "Sandpaper is cheaper. Labor is expensive." As soon as a sheet starts to loose its toothiness, toss it.


Well said!

If you're going to be a woodworker then you need to approach every process with integrity and vigour. Do I like sanding? Not too much but it is a critical part of most projects and it can make or break a project. How much sanding is required? You need to be watching and evaluating this every moment that you are sanding and you'll know how long.

On maple and BB that will be stained I would not sand to 220 grit.

[Kevin Jenness]

Most baltic birch I have seen has deep checks as the result of poor slicing of the thick face veneers, and is not suitable for staining. It sounds like you were able to sand down through the checks to get an acceptable job. You can often see similar checking effects in the core veneers of plywood by looking closely at the cut edge of the panel. Most face veneers are sliced thinner for economy, and one side effect is that it is easier for the mill to get a checkfree surface with appropriate compression from a pressure bar next to the knife during the slicing process. There is a good illustration of this in Hoadley's "Understanding Wood."

[Michael Dunn]

Update...

Well, it's not perfect, but its looking pretty good overall. I was hoping to avoid tinting the clear coat and resolve the issue. As of right now I have two coats of Brown Mahogany gel stain on. Some spots it just isn't taking very well and are therefor much lighter than other spots.

I'm fairly pleased considering how terrible the large table looked on Wednesday.

[Michael Dunn]

Well said!

If you're going to be a woodworker then you need to approach every process with integrity and vigour. Do I like sanding? Not too much but it is a critical part of most projects and it can make or break a project. How much sanding is required? You need to be watching and evaluating this every moment that you are sanding and you'll know how long.

On maple and BB that will be stained I would not sand to 220 grit.

Are you saying you'd stop lower? Say, 180? Or higher? Like 320? I'm guessing lower. I've read that sanding to too high of a grit can block or close the pores and affect the materials ability to absorb stain. Perhaps I should've stopped at 150?

[Michael Dunn]

Micheal,

Sanding, IME, is usually the most time consuming part of any job. It is also often the most neglected step in a job. I would probably budget a half an hour of sanding for any one of your tables. Starting with a courser grit will greatly reduce sanding time. Another mistake often made by less experienced guys is milking a sheet of sandpaper. A mentor of mine told me "Sandpaper is cheaper. Labor is expensive." As soon as a sheet starts to loose its toothiness, toss it.

I hear ya on that. I have gone through many sheets of m Festool sandpaper. As soon as I start feeling like I want to start pressing down I change the pad. Sometimes blowing the dust of with some compressed air helps a bit. Not when it's too far gone though.

Good advice!!!

[Richard Coers]

What is going to be your next approach to hide the still showing cross grain lines? They are clearly visible in photo 2. Sending lower grade work to your Aunt is one thing, but second quality just should not be sent out on a commercial job. There is nothing more important to a small business than it's reputation, and you have to learn when to start over and deliver a quality product. Maybe they will accept a lower quality for a discount, but that does not speak well of your workmanship for future work.

[Ethan Melad]

i have to say i agree with richard. while the tops look much better than they did originally, the lines are still there...
for better or worse, sometimes pictures show things you dont see too well yourself - similar thing happened to me this week. i thought i had sanded out all the snipe on a couple drawer fronts, but after taking a picture i can see its still there. one step back...

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