Pea-shooter or Magnum?

[Roger Chandler]

At the last meeting of our club, the demonstrator passed around a chuck..........he had two at the demo.....one a Oneway Stronghold which he says he likes..........the other, a Vicmarc 120 which he says he LOVES! I have taken a look several times at the vicmarc chuck and really liked it, but could not see myself getting one at the price since I have 5 supernova chucks and a wide assortment of jaws.

I have had numerous occasions when I wanted jaws bigger than what my SN2's had, and even though I have the power grip jaws, they only go to 3" in compression mode. I have gotten some 4" bowl jaws for it as well. I wanted something in the 5" range........so, I took the plunge yesterday and made an order......you know,......once in a while we need the power of a magnum! :rolleyes:

I ordered the HTC 125 chuck. From what I can tell, the insert is identical to the Vicmarc, and a better system in my opinion than the SN2's inserts. The chuck is a slightly larger version of the Vicmarc 120 and is about 9 lbs.

Although I do not intend to change brands like Mike Cruz did, because of the prior investment I have in all these, I was willing to try the large chuck and add it to my arsenal of chucks to give me the added capabilities of a chuck that looks to be top quality and is a real bargain at the prices that Steve Fulgoni is selling them for.

I am looking forward to getting it in a couple of days, and when I have an opportunity to use it, I will be glad to share my impressions.

[jwjerry w kowalski]

Roger, isn't it amazing how we can talk ourselves into a new tool, the rationalization would give Einstien a headache, but it sure is fun and makes us happy and that's what it's all about anyway, hope you enjoy!

[Harry Robinette]

Why not go to the Titan from Nova bigger chuck and us the same jaws. I have one and love it.

[Roger Chandler]

Why not go to the Titan from Nova bigger chuck and us the same jaws. I have one and love it.


I wanted to try a different brand Harry. I really like the insert on this chuck....like the vicmarc, and about a third of the price.

[Bernie Weishapl]

Be anxious to see what you think of it Roger. I have been looking at get a couple of them. The smaller and larger one.

[robert baccus]

No one should have to justify a new tool or piece of wood but what are you turning that you need a larger chuck than a SN2? 100#+ vases on a single screw/glueblock/SN2 or ring type-3 screw dovetail faceplates/glueblocks on green endgrain give me no trouble at all. The Vicmarks are pretty but try polishing and compounding the old SN2 and buying some gorgeous wood for giggles.

[John Beaver]

Lots of good choices out there. Personally I prefer Vicmarc's. The one thing I recommend is making sure all your chucks lock and unlock the same direction. Too easy to make a mistake turning one the wrong way.

[Mike Cruz]

Roger, I doubt you will be disappointed. I look forward to seeing your thoughts...good or bad. As I've said before, I have no stake in Steve's company, nor do I get kickbacks for giving my opinion about the chucks here (or anywhere). When I ordered mine (the first one), I told Steve that I'd be posting a review...an HONEST review when I got it. If I didn't like it, I told him to be prepared... I liked it so much, as you stated, I switched over completely to HTCs.

When he comes out with his larger jaws, like he has been saying that he's had "in the works", I'll be getting another chuck with the larger jaws.

I will warn you, though... when you first mount it onto the lathe, drape a paper towel over the chuck when you first turn the lathe on. There is a fair amount of oil (or something) that flings out of it. :D

[Roger Chandler]

Roger, I doubt you will be disappointed. I look forward to seeing your thoughts...good or bad. As I've said before, I have no stake in Steve's company, nor do I get kickbacks for giving my opinion about the chucks here (or anywhere). When I ordered mine (the first one), I told Steve that I'd be posting a review...an HONEST review when I got it. If I didn't like it, I told him to be prepared... I liked it so much, as you stated, I switched over completely to HTCs.

When he comes out with his larger jaws, like he has been saying that he's had "in the works", I'll be getting another chuck with the larger jaws.

I will warn you, though... when you first mount it onto the lathe, drape a paper towel over the chuck when you first turn the lathe on. There is a fair amount of oil (or something) that flings out of it. :D

Thanks for the heads up on the oil slinging out Mike.........that could be a messy proposition. That internal lube should make the jaws work easily. Just looking at the videos and then seeing the vicmarc........they look almost identical to me..........I think that a person cannot go wrong for the price.......of course long term is what matters.

I got the 5" serrated jaws as an extra set when I ordered this......they are both supposed to be shipped at the same time. Maybe they have gotten the jaws in as of now? Worth checking into, Mike.

[Richard Jones]

What's so special about an insert?

[Mike Cruz]

Roger, last I checked they weren't in yet...but I keep checking in!!!

Also, a lot of people have mentioned the similarity to the Vicmarc. I, too, saw that. Steve commented once in one of the threads to this effect, and I also spoke with him on the phone about it. While there are similarities, there are a number of differences. Steve does not feel that the HTCs are a Vicmarc knockoff. If you, or anyone else for that matter, cares to know the differences, PM him, and I'm sure he'll be glad to let you know what they are. Off the top of my head, the only thing I can think of is that they use different kinds of keys, but I know there are more.

Richard, I'm not sure what Roger (or maybe someone else) meant about the inserts being special. But they are much like a Stronghold insert (very very close, but not exactly) but with three set screws not two (like the Stronghold).

Look, bottom line (for anyone, or should I say "those" who keep wondering "why the hubbub?") is that this really is a quality chuck for a very reasonable price. It is priced as well, or under, any other chuck of equal or better (not saying others are better, or that it is the best...I don't know enough about chucks to make that determination...I'm not an engineer, and I didn't take the chuck apart) quality. No, it doesn't leap tall buildings in a single bound. It won't make you a better turner (not any more than any other quality chuck will). But it is a good product sold by a good guy. Simple.

[Roger Chandler]

What's so special about an insert?

Richard........my Nova inserts thread in to the chuck body..........the machining on each insert is not completely consistent. I have some inserts that are a tad longer than others.......and one of them has more run out than others. Threading may vary from one run to another ........at least that has been the case with my 5 Nova chucks.

I think the insert design of the Vicmarc and the HTC are more easily kept within specs as they are not threaded into the chuck body with 1-1/2" tpi threads like the Nova, but are held in the chuck body by screws into holes that mate the insert to the chuck body, and to me that will give a truer, more consistent marriage of the chuck and insert, and when thinking of tolerances the male/female design seems to me to be better controlled as to tolerances than threading.

[Michael Stafford]

I think the insert design of the Vicmarc and the HTC are more easily kept within specs as they are not threaded into the chuck body with 1-1/2" tpi threads like the Nova, but are held in the chuck body by screws into holes that mate the insert to the chuck body, and to me that will give a truer, more consistent marriage of the chuck and insert, and when thinking of tolerances the male/female design seems to me to be better controlled as to tolerances than threading.

Roger, Vicmarc inserts screw into the chuck body just like the Nova inserts. The screws that you are referring to are to lock the insert in the body so that it cannot unscrew by itself if you are turning in reverse. I don't know anything about the HTC. I don't know anything about " to me that will give a truer, more consistent marriage of the chuck and insert, and when thinking of tolerances the male/female design seems to me to be better controlled as to tolerances than threading." I have absolutely no idea what you are talking about since your premise is in error in the first place. I have several Vicmarcs and the inserts screw into the body just like the Nova.

[Roger Chandler]

Roger, Vicmarc inserts screw into the chuck body just like the Nova inserts. The screws that you are referring to are to lock the insert in the body so that it cannot unscrew by itself if you are turning in reverse. I don't know anything about the HTC. I don't know anything about " to me that will give a truer, more consistent marriage of the chuck and insert, and when thinking of tolerances the male/female design seems to me to be better controlled as to tolerances than threading." I have absolutely no idea what you are talking about since your premise is in error in the first place. I have several Vicmarcs and the inserts screw into the body just like the Nova.

Thanks for setting the record straight Mike, regarding the Vicmarc......all I have seen up close already had the insert in them, and the video I watched on Youtube of the HTC looked to be held in by the screws.......perhaps I missed something! I did not know that the inserts also threaded into the Vicmarc.........the advantage you mention about the insert not unthreading when reverse turning is a good one for sure. Again, to everyone.......my misunderstanding was not intentional, and my apologies.

When I get my HTC in, then I will be able to give a fuller and more complete assessment.

[Roger Chandler]

Okay, after Mike's post above, I went back and searched for the videos again on youtube.......according to Steve, the adapter that fits into the HTC chuck is a tapered adapter that is seated into the recess by the screws.......like the stronghold [what he said] he also did mention the Vicmarc threads into the chuck body like the Nova chucks.

I just wanted to set the record straight and not confuse anyone........my thinking is that the tolerances will be better with this than the threaded on adapters, that my Nova's have, will remain to be seen. All I know for sure at this point, until I can personally view and use the HTC chuck is this.....the adapters for my Nova's are inconsistent........some are shorter, and not everyone of them seats into the chuck body the same.........hopefully, this will not be the case for the HTC 125 I am getting.

[Mike Cruz]

Roger, you are correct that the adapter is a taper lock, like the Stronghold. The stronghold just uses two screws where the HTC uses 3. Advantage or disadvantage to either? I don't know... All I can say is that when you are installing the HTC adapter, two things: I found it was easier to have three allen wrenches in use at the same time (maybe because I am just impatient). That way, with one wrench in each screw, you don't have to keep taking the wrench out and putting it back in with each adjustment/crank of the wrench; And secondly, make very small adjustments with each turn of the wrench...maybe an 1/8 of a turn with each one, and make them consistent with one another. This is, of course, just how you would do it with a Stronghold...no different.

As for why your Nova adapters aren't consistent or why they may have runout vs the Vicmarc adapters... Maybe that's the difference between a Vicmarc and a Nova and the price you pay. ;) Not necessarily the kind of/method used for the adapter.

As for the whether one of the kinds of adapter (taper lock vs threaded) is better or worse than another... The major difference is that a threaded adapter relies on a shoulder or bottoming out to end up true to the chuck. If there is dirt on either the shoulder of the chuck, or on the mating surface of the adapter at the time of installation, you might get runout. With the taper lock, you don't rely on a shoulder. You rely on the both the male and female surfaces that are mated to be milled exactly the same. Again, there must be no dirt on either. AND it must be cranked in very evenly.

Whether one method is "better" than another is not for me to say. The major difference would be that the threaded method relies almost solely on fabrication tolerances (and only slightly on the end user's making sure there is no dirt on the mating shoulders). Whereas the taper lock method relies not only on the fabrication tolerances and the lack of dirt on the end user's part, but also on the end user not "rushing" the installation and installing the adapter cockeyed.

[Roger Chandler]

Good info Mike.........in the videos, Steve shows the process.......a little turn on each screw in sequence will get you correctly seated......sort of like the proper way to mount a spare tire ......you go opposite lugs to get the wheel where it does not wobble on the hub.

One thing about the nova inserts.......some were made before the move of manufacturing to China, and others after.......some are designed a little different.......the corners are a bit rounded on the hex part......some are not, and that is the nova inserts.......not to mention the wood river inserts from WC...........

The machining is all important........if the factory which does the machining is 9001 ISO certified........it seems better quality control exists.......

[Mike Goetzke]

Glad to hear you like the HTC chuck. I'm new to turning and just seeing the chance to have some free time to attack some of the project kits I bought. I bought a Supernova2 but never installed it on my lathe. After reading Mike Cruz's review on the HTC's I saw they had a HTC 100 chuck packaged with 8 jaw sets for a great price so I purchased it. The quality is excellent - I took out all of the jaws and they all fit perfectly and the machining is excellent. They even include mounting screws with every jaw set. For a beginner like me it was nice to get this package deal. If I stuck with the Nova I would only be able to buy half the jaws for the same price.

Mike

[Robert Henrickson]

One thing about the nova inserts.......some were made before the move of manufacturing to China, and others after.......some are designed a little different.......the corners are a bit rounded on the hex part......some are not, and that is the nova inserts.......not to mention the wood river inserts from WC...........

I know the local Woodcraft has a prominent sign saying that Wood River inserts should be used ONLY in Wood River chucks -- not with any other company's chucks

[Roger Chandler]

I know the local Woodcraft has a prominent sign saying that Wood River inserts should be used ONLY in Wood River chucks -- not with any other company's chucks

That is true now, Robert, but was not the case early on! They actually sold the WR insert for the nova chucks until they found so many complaints from customers........I know this first hand! Got that information from an employee! Now the Nova inserts are still manufactured in the PRC......I have 5 SN chucks.......and I am by and large a satisfied customer........I know however of a number of issues that different turners had with them, and my inserts are not all the same........inconsistent machining.

[Michael Mills]

That is true now, Robert, but was not the case early on!

You may still have a non Nova made insert from WC even though it is not one made for WC chucks.

There is the WR insert made for WC chucks but sold at one time for Nova chucks, usually $10 (there may be a sign posted that they are not to be used with Nova chucks).
There is also the real Nova insert made by Nova for Nova chucks.
There are also Nova Inserts made by Woodcraft for Nova chucks.
On my LAST purchase there I asked three times.
When I asked about the letter turned on its side the sales rep only replied that that‘s the one they have sold for the last two years.
When ask why it was not in a Teknatool box (it was in a baggie) the sales rep stated Teknatool only packaged the smaller inserts in a box. What??? They are all the same outside diameter.
Most of the time the real Nova insert has rounded corners and the bogus doesn’t.
The WC made Nova insert had run-out of .018. I ordered a real insert from the service center and run-out was .004. On the attached page the first insert should be a Nova insert (Notice the L is upright).
Note it says “Nova RH Insert”
The third insert has the letter on the side (D). This is not a Nova made insert. Note it says “…Screw FOR Nova Chucks”
All letters on Nova made chucks will be upright and in a red Teknatool box.

So watch out for the word games….

http://www.woodcraft.com/search2/search.aspx?query=nova%20chuck%20insert (http://www.woodcraft.com/search2/search.aspx?query=nova%20chuck%20insert)
In the following they show the WC insert FOR Nova chucks at $24.95 and right below it the real Nova Insert for $22.99 (and has the rounded corners).
http://www.woodcraft.com/search2/search.aspx?query=1x8%20chuck%20insert (http://www.woodcraft.com/search2/search.aspx?query=1x8%20chuck%20insert)

[Roger Chandler]

Micheal.........your information is correct! I have 4 Teknatool inserts and one made by woodcraft for the nova chuck and one Wood River insert just laying in a drawer..........you are also correct about the rounded corners on the hex head.......those are the genuine inserts! I did not know about the amount of runout........thanks for those figures........

Inconsistent machining!!!