Are 2" wide face frames too wide?

[Rich Engelhardt]

The plans I have for making a 36" cabinet call for a 2" wide face frame.
I'm thinking that's a bit on the wide side and would look odd.

If I alter the width and make them 1.75" instead am I going to run into problems with the drawers and the full overlay doors?

[peter gagliardi]

Depends, if just flat stock, then yes too wide. If ,on the other hand your doing beaded face frames, 2" is my standard go to size. Also, on the flat you should factor in if there is any overlay, and how it impacts the look. On flat face frames I have been using 1 1/2" stock for 20-25 years and it works well.
Peter

[Don Jarvie]

Also figure out what type of hinges you are going to use. If your using ones that wrap around the face frame they come different sizes depending on how much overlap you are planning for.

This sounds trivial but important once the cabinet is built and the hinges you bought wont work.

[Alan Bienlein]

Here is a picture of a cabinet I built with 2" face frame stock.
263063263062

[glenn bradley]

These are 36" wide, 2" frame on the left, 1-3/4" frame on the right:

263065

SketchUp is your friend.

[Jeff Duncan]

Go with what you like the look of. To me 2" is too wide, especially if it's flat, not to mention if your doing full overlay it does not really provide any real benefit. In actuality it only uses more wood while making the cabinet less useful!

I use different size stiles for different projects but for inset my typical is 1-1/2" for the verticals, with wider on the horizontals.


good luck,
JeffD

[Rick Potter]

I always use 2" face frames, unless it is going to be a small cabinet. The overlay doors will reduce the visual size anyway. My raised panel doors are usually 2 3/8", which when used with cope and stick cutters makes the visual width 2".

Rick Potter

PS: When in doubt, I use some old plywood strips and make a real quick face frame, so I can visualize it better.

[guy knight]

depends on the hinges you are using if using euro hinges 2" minimum and then you will probably cut into the dado of the door a bit for euro i use a 2 1/4 " frame

[Ole Anderson]

Funny how just a quarter inch in width of the frame can make a significant difference in the look of the piece.

[Kent A Bathurst]

I generally use 2" stiles and top rail, and 2-1/2" bottom rail. EIther flat or raised panels, depending.

My stuff is typically in the Arts + Crafts genre....and those frequently have "beefy" design cues.

Walnut + QS Sycamore blanket chest. Center rails are 2", legs 3", long rails on top are 2-1/2", end rails are bigger than that to allow for the curve.



263113263114

[Jay Jolliffe]

I think it depends on what look your looking for. If you have over lay doors or inset doors. I make most of my cabinet sides from 3/4'' birch plywood. When you have two boxes side by side that only leaves you with a 1/4'' on either side of the 2" face frame on the inside of the cabinet. I like a little more space than that so I might go with a 2 1/2'' FF...All depends what look your looking for....

[Rich Engelhardt]

Funny how just a quarter inch in width of the frame can make a significant difference in the look of the piece.Ain't that the truth!

Like my bro Kent mentioned, A&C and/or Mission has a "beefy" look where 2" or better - is what looks good.
But - you put 2" on Shaker stuff and it looks horrid.
Even 1.75" on Shaker is pushing it. (IMHO)

This particular piece I'm looking to make is in a sort of Contemporary limbo....where 2" could go either way.
The plans call for full overlay doors so I should be ok w/2" face frames.

[Julie Moriarty]

I just made 35 cabinet doors. All have 2" wide rails and stiles. They range in width from 11-1/2" to 20-1/2". Here's a sampling. Judge for yourself.

http://i867.photobucket.com/albums/ab233/jules42651/Woodworking/Kitchen%20Cabinets/finishedfront_03_zps277944e2.jpg
Door widths:
Top from left top right: 13", 13", 14-1/2", 14-1/2"
Bottom from left to right: 17-1/2", 17-1/2", 20-1/2"

[David C. Roseman]

My view is it depends very much on how the rails and stiles are profiled and joined, and to some extent on how the center panels are constructed. E.g., if you are using 4/4 stock milled to 3/4", with a full ogee on the outer edges of the frame, and a cope-and-stick cutter to form a small quarter-round along the inside edges and to cut the joints, then a 2" width will look quite balanced, even on narrow cabinet doors. If you are not profiling the rails and stiles at all (leaving them flat and square, or maybe with a modest round-over), it can look too wide. If the center panels are raised and floating, this, to my eye, calls even more for 2" or 2-1/8"-wide, profiled rails and stiles.

That said, if the rails and stiles are to be profiled on a router table using small router bits, instead of on a full-sized shaper or with large router bits, I can see how that would call for 1-1/2" or 1-3/4" rails and stiles, as the finished relief would likely be less pronounced.

David

[Darius Ferlas]

I'm not sure the OP has doubts about the width of rails and stiles. 2 inches seems like somewhere between the sweet spot and narrow-ish.

Now, 2" face frames seem like much to me.

[David C. Roseman]

I'm not sure the OP has doubts about the width of rails and stiles. 2 inches seems like somewhere between the sweet spot and narrow-ish.

Now, 2" face frames seem like much to me.

Darius, I think this is just a matter of terminology. I've always known the horizontal and vertical components of the frames of paneled doors as rails and stiles. Unless it's a door with glass windows ("lights"), in which case the members separating the glass are usually called muntins and mullions.

"Face frames" I think of as being the frame trim used on the front of case construction, over which the doors are typically mounted. But I've seen the term used to describe door frames too.

David

[Jeff Duncan]

I think some started to get confused as the thread went on.....OP asked about face frame widths being 2" and somehow it got mis-interpeted as door parts towards the last few posts. Face frame is indeed a part of the cabinet attached to the face. The terms stiles and rails can be used for both face frames and doors, so maybe that's where some of the confusion is stemming?

JeffD

[Julie Moriarty]

FWIW, Marc Sommerfeld recommends 2-7/16" wide rails & stiles when using his router bits. They cut a 7/16" profile leaving 2" of "flat" surface.

[David C. Roseman]

I think some started to get confused as the thread went on.....OP asked about face frame widths being 2" and somehow it got mis-interpeted as door parts towards the last few posts. Face frame is indeed a part of the cabinet attached to the face. The terms stiles and rails can be used for both face frames and doors, so maybe that's where some of the confusion is stemming?

JeffD

Yep, Jeff, I think you're right. I went back and reread Rich's original post, and he clearly asks about face frame width with overlay doors, not door frames. Things got muddled in the replies, although it makes for an interesting thread. Sorry Rich and Darius! :o "I see, said the blind man, as he picked up his hammer and saw."

So, to give my two cents on the actual question, :rolleyes: I think 1-1/2" to 1-3/4" is usually better for the outside rails and stiles of cabinet face frames that will have overlay doors, if the amount of overlay is about 1/4" to 3/8". Overlay will vary with type of hinge. If the outside edges of the face frames are to be profiled rather than square, I think 2" may be fine, as the profiling will ease the apparent width of the face frames relative to the door stiles.

If there will be face frame stiles between the doors (e.g., for stability, where the doors are particularly wide), the width will depend on the width of the doors themselves, and be whatever is necessary to achieve an overlay roughly matching that of the hinged side.

David

[Rich Engelhardt]

I think some started to get confused as the thread went on.....OP asked about face frame widths being 2" and somehow it got mis-interpeted as door parts towards the last few posts. Face frame is indeed a part of the cabinet attached to the faceYep - the 2" I asked about is the frame around the face of the carcase.
Not to worry though - the other posts (and pictures) were both informative and interesting.