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View Full Version : Spraying JD Lockwood water-based dyes



Shannon York
05-16-2013, 5:59 PM
I've just ordered some 1 oz samples from JD Lockwood to begin some testing. My goal is to be able to use these water-based dyes in a production setting. Currently, we use mostly wipe stains or, for a few finishes, we use a two step process: dye stain then wipe stain. The wipe stains are pretty "forgiving" for our finishing crew.

I really like the clarity of dyes (vs. stains), so I want to try every known "tip and trick" to allow us to be successful with dyes. I recognize we may need to "up our game" in how we do our finishing (spraying techniques, etc.), but I'm certainly willing to try.

We are not just going to be using browns, etc., but we'll be doing some colors such as reds, greens, pinks, oranges, etc.

We use a pre-cat Sherwin-Williams lacquer for our top coats.

We don't have an oven or other drying facility, so drying time for water dyes is a potential issue. We would prefer (in fact, we can't) not to have to wait 12 or 24 hours between application of the dye and putting on the lacquer.

I want (prefer) to use our sprayer system to apply the Lockwood dyes, not brushes or rags.

Some specific questions/areas of concern that I sure would appreciate some "tips and techniques" on:

1. I understand that getting an even saturation and coating with a sprayer may be a challenge. Particularly on pieces with curves (e.g. turned legs). And, also larger surface areas like dining table tops, headboards of beds, etc.

2. Is mixing some alcohol with the water a prudent approach to reduce the drying time? Is there a ratio of alcohol/water that is too much? I do recognize, of course, that there is trade-off between the goal of reducing the drying time and having the dye solution "flash" so much that it becomes a challenge to work with (dries too fast).

3. We work with Red Oak, White Oak, Maple, Cherry, Walnut, Ash and some Pine.

4. Other tips, suggestions, warnings, etc.

Thank you. Thank you.

Cheers,

Curt Harms
05-17-2013, 7:51 AM
It looks like most dyes except blue can be dissolved in alcohol instead of water. Alcohol dries fast, too fast? I think there are less commonly available alcohols that evaporate slower then ethanol/methanol. I don't know about mixing alcohol and water, never tried it. Maybe use mulitple coats of a weaker solution to even out color variations?

John TenEyck
05-17-2013, 9:06 AM
I use Transtint dyes, which are soluble in both water and alcohol, available many places or directly from Homestead Finishing. I use alcohol almost exclusively for two reasons; it dries quickly so I can move on with subsequent finishing steps within an hour if I want to, and there are no grain raising issues like there are with water based dyes. This is especially important on oak and similar woods. Alcohol soluble dyes are supposedly not as light fast as water soluble ones, but I haven't noticed any fading in the 5 years I've been using Transtint; granted, that is not a long time frame but I'm not building period reproduction furniture either.

I haven't had any problems applying Transtint in straight DNA, either by hand or by spraying. By hand, I just wipe it on with a paper towel, working quickly but not in a hurry, and I haven't had any problems with lap marks, etc. Spraying works great, especially if you use multiple spray coats to build to the desired hue. The stuff dries so quickly you can just about start with the next coat after finishing with the prior.

John

Erik Christensen
05-20-2013, 5:47 PM
I have used the Lockwood dyes on maybe a dozen projects or more. I topcoat with water based poly - everything applied with a sprayer. I have never had to wait more than 2 hours before I could apply the first topcoat - not sure if a pre-cat lacquer would be as happy on that finish schedule but never had any issues with either water poly or shellac. What I like about dyes, besides how they make the wood look, is that they are more forgiving of inconsistent application - go back over the piece and smooth any drips with a brush and you are done. As long as you don't let a puddle dry the color is consistent even if the dye coverage was not perfect - color depth is determined by the strength of the dye and not the amount applied.

Keep in mind lockwood makes great stuff but their dye formulations are not that UV resistant - If you want a water soluable dye that is better under natural light look at TransFast.