Major Gloat(s)

[Robert Tarr]

Well, my bride and I finally found a place that she and I would like to call home. It is an older place with a little bit of property and and wonderful outbuilding that will get me out of the 6'4" basement shop (I am 6'3") so it is a bit cramped. I thought I would post a couple pictures of the new shop space and see what the wonderful gang here thought :D The shop already has a sub-panel and water to it. The space is 30X30. with doubled flooring running in opposite directions (over 1 1/2" thick) and I have already had an structural engineer out to look it over and I am at less than 28% of load, including tools I don't even own (or not sure I will....)

The plans are to use spay in foam insulation and to sheath the walls with plywood or OSB. I already have plans on upgrading the electrical service to the house and up-ing the juice to the shop (100 amps at the least, maybe 200.) We are planning to put in radiant hot water heat and to also run central air (gets a bit humid here in the Summer.) It has some very neat tilt in windows that were spec'd with the building, but those may (probably) get replaced to zip up the building. I lucked out and the building already has a chimney for the boiler. I also plan to replace the side door with a prefab insulated unit that will also look like an old barn door (darn it is expensive to find stuff that looks old and cheap!!!!)

I will post pictures of the progress of the build out of the shop. FWIW, I plan to use a forklift to get my machinery up on the second floor.

Also attached is another gloat, a picture of my new "lawn mower" that I am certain will get a real workout on the property. I have already fallen in love with it.

What do you think?

Robert

[Maurice Ungaro]

I hate you. No, not really, but your space IS twice what i have. I see your drill press is marking it's turf.

[Richard Wolf]

That looks like it will make a great shop. Always some what of a concern with the second floor, but its never perfect, is it? Best of luck!!

Richard

[Robert Tarr]

The double doors to the outside are exactly 10 feet off the deck. So, if I back my truck up beside the building and stand a 4X8 sheet of plywood up on the 8 foot side, it is not too bad to haul up (unless it is a full sheet of MDF...). I also plan to put in some sort of electric winch to bring stuff up and more importantly, get finished pieces down.

The amount of natural light in the space is amazing! I have a ton of T-8 fixtures from being in such a short basement shop, so this is going to be easy to light.

Thanks,

Robert

[Alan Turner]

Robert,
That look like wonderful space. Any chance for an opening skylight to let the steam out in the Summer?

[Karl Laustrup]

Robert,
Any chance for an opening skylight to let the steam out in the Summer?

Yes, that would be ideal. One on each side. They have powered ones with mini blinds sandwiched between the glass. More light and hot air out in the summer.

And I think that is a spectacular place for a shop.

[Mark Riegsecker]

Robert,
That look like wonderful space. Any chance for an opening skylight to let the steam out in the Summer?

A sky lite is a great idea to do now while you're in the initial stages. I've got a huge window that lets in so much light that I sometimes don't need overheads. The problem is it takes up a lot of valuable wall space. Sky lites will eliminate that problem and as Alan points out, help with the air flow. I doubt you ever regret that decision.
My uncle has an shop over his garage with an elevator. You may want to think about that.

[Tim Farrell]

ENVY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Congrats. I want to see some great pics of what comes out of that shop soon.:)

[Ryan Ricks]

Robert -

I am jealous of the shop space. As for the "Lawn Mower", I have had the BX2200 (Predecessor to the BX2230) for several years, makes short work of the lawn!!:D And to keep this on topic, I have used the loader to haul several tools from the truck into the garage.


Ryan

[John Shuk]

Robert,
Looks like the new shop is going to be great.I'm not a big fan of skylights. I personally would go for a vent fan. I've found that it is difficult to control the climate in a roomm with skylights. I may be biased towards no sunlight however. You've seen me, I'm nearly albino. By the way Fine Woodworking's winter 2004/2005 Tools & Shops issue has a good writeup on a second floor shop. It is worth looking at. Best of luck with the new home.
John

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Am I envious?......NO! Not in the least......WELL......MAYBE....



Congrats! and enjoy the process!

[Kelly C. Hanna]

WOW! Nice shop and mower!

We're getting geared up for a move a few miles east, hopefully to an old home (1900-1930) with a shop...hope I do as well as you did!!!

PS....skip the OSB idea and spend the few extra dollars for plywood...you'll thank me later...:D

[Ted Shrader]

Robert -

I hate you, too! :) I'm guessing there is a house somewhere on the property also. But you have priorities.

Congrats on the new place. Looks like a great setup. Is there a trap door or other sort of lift to get the heavy items up to the shop? I see a door in the end of the building, but no I-beam. Maybe it is there, but doesn't show up in the picture.

Congratulations,
Ted

[Kurt Voss]

Robert, great looking shop space - I think I'd work the angle that an attached garage would be far more "convenient" to park the vehicles in and that the "old, musty building" is really only fit for a shop and just take over the whole thing! BTW, I"ve got a BX2200 also and have put over 250 hours on it the last couple of years. Hands down, one of the best "tools" I've ever bought. Kubota (IMHO) is the Festool of small tractors!!

[Frank Pellow]

Congratulations Robert. It looks like you have a lot of fun in store for you.

I would be concerned about access to the second floor. I know that you mentioned tilting sheet goods up through the double doors, a fork lift, and a winch. How about some sort of elevator?

You say that there is a lot of natural light but it does not appear that way to me in the pictures. Like Alan, Karl, and Mark, I suggest considering some skylights. One can never have enough skylights -I put 3 into the shop that I built last year and I really wish that I had installed 4 or 5.

I am very much looking forward to progress reports.

[Fred LeBail]

You have a great space there and it will certainly be a pleasure to work" up there" and not be in anyone's space. I have worked in a similar shop (32x22) for the last 25 years. I use 1/2 of the lower portion for lumber storage and a furnace room. My dust collection box is also down there so all the leads run under the shop floor. Nice.
The only draw back that I can see is you have to design everything so it can be brought down. But the smaller peices are easier on the old back, and easier to get help to get them down.

Congrat's Fred

[Robert Tarr]

Well the building has two windows at the top of each end of the structure and I forsee a fan up there to draw out the super heated air. I also see central air in my future, thus the expense of the sprayed foam insulation (also moisture/vapor barrier.) As for sky lights, I don't think they will be in the future. This place has a slate roof and I think it would be a shame to mess with the roof line (not to mention the additional expense.) This space has 18 large double windows in it and gets a ton of light. The camera does not pic it up well, actually gets blinded by the light a bit and comes out darker than it should.

BTW, thanks for all the well wishes and I will post pictures of my progress.

[Jerry Olexa]

You are a fortunate man! Great and interesting space. My Dad had a 2story Barn like structure like yours in NE Pa. which could hold 4 cars on the first floor (they were never in the garage) and a complete upper level like yours. He devoted BOTH floors to his shop! I loved his priorities and have always wished for that. I'm stuck in a conventional home and my shop is in the basement. The older homes are the more interesting ones! Good for you. I'm full of ENVY!!!! By the way, did a house come with that?:D How big is your lot for that tractor?Enjoy your new place!!

[Jim Becker]

'Bout time you posted these pictures, Mr. Tarr!! I've been in that space twice now and still can't get all the drool off my shirt!! And yes folks, that new shop space is even better than it looks! And it has a wood floor. ;)

[Dan Forman]

Sure would be nice to have that much unobstructed space. Have fun putting it together.

Dan

[scott spencer]

Wow....a truck, a tractor, a nice big shop space, and a new bride.....go fill that house with kids to keep you out of the shop and life will be complete! ;-) Congrats....that looks like a dream I had a couple of months ago.

[John Hart]

I'm going to have to vote for hating you too Robert. Man! with a shop like that, my new bride would be filing for divorce!:D Congratulations! and good luck to you both in all you do.

[lou sansone]

It looks like a great space. As you probably know I am a big fan of wood floors in shops ( if you haven't seem my shop just look up all of my shop tour posts ), as well as the having lots of natural light. I am sure you know about north facing windows and color rendition so I will not go into it here.

Having it on the second floor is sort of a pain, but not the end of the world. I agree with you on thumbs down on the sky lights. They stink IMHO, especially on an older style building.

I have a friend that did the spray insulation and was happy with the outcome, but the contractor was sloppy with the thickness variations.


best wishes
lou

[Matt Meiser]

Nice space.

Too bad you got the wrong color tractor though. :rolleyes: Becker must have rubbed off on you.

[John Renzetti]

Hi Robert, That is going to make a great shop. Congratulatons.
take care,
John

[Mark Riegsecker]

Nice space.

Too bad you got the wrong color tractor though. :rolleyes: Becker must have rubbed off on you.

I was going to mention that as well in my first post but decided not to. But since you mentioned it... The correct color is GREEN of course :D

[Jim Becker]

Too bad you got the wrong color tractor though. :rolleyes: Becker must have rubbed off on you.

Three times as much Orange in this area than there is Green...three great Kubota dealers--who always have large inventories--and one good Deere dealer, but the latter concentrates mostly on the smaller Deere "lawn tractors", even though they do a big pro business on Zero Turn machines from various manufacturers. They usually only have one or two CUTs on the lot as compared to a dozen or so at each the Orange dealers. And since both brands are manufactured off-shore, at least for parts...dealer location, service, selection and price make the deal. (Robert's dealer is a whole mile up the road from his new "ranch"...)

[Matt Meiser]

And since both brands are manufactured off-shore, at least for parts...dealer location, service, selection and price make the deal.

Actually, that's exactly why I ended up with green. Tractors were close in price, but the dealers weren't even comparable.

[John Bailey]

Robert,

Good lookin' area. Mine is still a mass skeleton of trusses and framing, so I'm envious of the enclosed nature. Keep the pictures rolling as the project goes on.

John

[Jeff Sudmeier]

Robert, Looks like you will have a great shop! Congrats on the new space

[Corey Hallagan]

Wow, congrats on the new place and especially the shop, what a cool place. It ain't going to be fun getting that equipment up there. Good luck and can't wait to see the shop set up!

Corey

[Bob Marino]

Robert,

What a great start for a shop and it has something hard to buy - character!
Looking forward to seeing the progress pics.

Bob

[Jim O'Dell]

I agree with all the others GREAT SPACE! All "acquired" shop buildings have their own special quirks and tradeoffs. But you'll make it work to your advantage. I sure wish I had part of your headroom. Enjoy the process. Don't forget to post pictures of the trials and tribulations, as well as the situations that work out just right. Jim.

[Jim Becker]

What a great start for a shop and it has something hard to buy - character!

You should see the house, Bob...you'd really like the A&C/Bungalow style! Much character.

[Bob Marino]

You should see the house, Bob...you'd really like the A&C/Bungalow style! Much character.


Ok, Robert,

How about some pics of the house while your at it :D :D ?

[Robert Tarr]

I promise to post some pictures of the house once I get the home PC set up (it as the correct software on it.) to process the picture (they are currently too large...)

Here is a shot of the floor. It is oak for the main body with an accent strip around every room of two pieces of black walnut sandwiching a piece of curly maple.

More to come.

Robert

[Bill Lewis]

Robert,

What type of spray insulation do you plan on using? We used Icynene insulation in our current house, and on the addition to our last house. Spray foam isulations are, without a doubt, the best there is.

I have a similar situation to your barn. We have a finished room over the garage. It's really not more than a finished storage room. The installer recomended spraying the foam directly to the underside of the roof sheathing. If I was able to do it again, I would probably place a thin reflective blanket-type insulation between the foam, and the sheathing. As good as this insulation is, it still gets a little warm in that room. I think it might have helped, and it couldn't have hurt to try. Roof/Wall spaces are the hardest to insulate. In your case you, since you have "skip sheathing" you need to cover it before spraying. this will keep the foam from forcing itself out through the gaps, and possibly damaging that slate roof. At the very least cover it with rosin paper. If you do decide to use the mylar blanket insulation, you will probably have to cover it as well with rosin paper. The foam apparently doesn't react well when sprayed on other insulation materials.

Assuming you are installing one, do you plan on putting your DC system beneath the floor? I hope so, I think that it the absolute best way to go.

[Robert Tarr]

Bill,

I think that as a vendor, Icynene is going ot get the nod. They seem to be the most well respected and have the availability to do the job. I am going to have the attic space in the house done as well. The roof is T&G Beadboard (IN THE BARN and the house!!!) and the "featherboard edged" pine will need to be caulked and painted before we have them in to do the insulation....plenty of projects for the Summer. We also need to decide about the windows...I hate to take them out, but spending this kind of money on insulation etc. it would be a shame to let all of the BTU's rush out the windows.

Here is a shot of the backyard. Sat there with my dog on the flagstone patio...felt like a king for a while....time to get back to work.

BTW, I will selling a smaller Oneida cyclone to pick up a "gorrilla" and it will definately be in the downstairs space, with the main lines run under the floor. I will also have the filter in the upstairs space, to keep all of the heated or cooled air (meaning less humid) in the space.

Thanks,

Robert

[Bill Lewis]

Wow, they used beadboard sheathing, that is impressive. I couldn't tell from the pictures, it just looked like some form of skip sheathing.

We really love the icynene insulation. Very airtight and efficient stuff. Also it's fun to watch it being installed.

I'd still recomend the reflective insulation layer between the foam and the roof. Particularly on any south or SW facing section. The room over our garage is totally encapsulated on all sides with the foam insulation, but on a sunny day it can still be 15 degrees higher than the adjacent room (w/out the A/C on).

That's good that your're doing the DC system below. It really is the ideal setup. After all you've got gravity working in your favor, and think about how quiet it will be. Probably so quiet you'll forget to turn it off.

Keep us posted on your progress. BTW my lawn mower looks an awful lot like yours, 'cept it's green (JD2210).