Water Heater Elements

[Dennis McDonaugh]

How do you tell which element, upper or lower, is not working in a water heater without taking them out?

[Don Abele]

Dennis, if you have a multimeter you can check each of the elements:

Turn off all power to the heater and ohm the heating elements. If a heating element is bad, there will be no continuity or an infinite ohm reading (the meter may display "no reading" or "open").

Of course, the answer I got to this question when I asked several years ago was to just replace both the elements. They are fairly inexpesive and easy to replace. Be sure to ask if the element needs a special socket to remove it, it'll save you a second trip back to the store (DAMHIKT).


Be well,

Doc

[Jerry Clark]

AND IF YOU DRAIN THE HEATER---- DO NOT TURN THE POWER BACK ON UNTIL THE TANK IS FULL! :eek:

[Von Bickley]

If you have a small amount of hot water (maybe 1 short shower) your top element is good.

If you have no hot water, your top element is gone and maybe the bottom one also.

If I was going to replace an element, I would replace both of them. :cool:

[Lee Schierer]

Sometimes the element will short to the element casing, which gives a continuity reading when you check across the terminals. Check for continuity between the terminal and the mounting surface for the element. It should read infinite or open as well. If you see continuity it means the element is bad.

[Boyd Gathwright]

.... You may want to take a look at this thread and consider it also.


.... Ref: http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=15656 (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=15656) ;)


Boyd
.

How do you tell which element, upper or lower, is not working in a water heater without taking them out?

[Dennis McDonaugh]

Thanks for the help guys.

Von, there is hot water for 5 or so minutes, then cold water so I guess the top element is good.

We have very hard water in San Antonio so we purchased a water softner almost the day we moved in. The tanks are also supposed to "swirl" the water so sedement doesn't gather in the bottom so I'm thinking lime buildup isn't a problem. This heater is in our garage apartment and it doesn't get used unless one of the five kids is visiting so I'm not sure how long it was out. It's only four years old and probably hasn't been turned on more than 90 days in that time.

Boyd, thanks for the tutorial, it'll help make it goe easier.

I'll go ahead and replace both tomorrow.

[Dennis McDonaugh]

Bought two 4500 wattt elements at Home Depot, the label on the heater said both the top and bottom elements were 4500 watts. When I took them out, the top was 3500 and the bottom 4500. Is this going to make any difference?

[Don Abele]

Dennis, the heater that I repaired and a couple I've helped with since all had matched elements. Sounds like someone replaced just one in the past and used the wrong one. 4500 watts is pretty much standard.

Be well,

Doc

[Dennis McDonaugh]

Thanks Don

[Bill Lewis]

Don,

If after you replace both elements and if you still experience the same conditions, then you will need to replace the dip tube too. The dip tube supplies the cold water to the bottom of the tank so the water has time to heat up before exiting the tank at the top. Here's a link on dip tube (http://www.ci.wilsonville.or.us/departments/pw/water/diptube.htm) failures.
You may also want to check out or replace your sacrificial anode as long as you have to drain the tank anyway.

BTW there are only three manufacturers of water heaters in the US. They also happen to be listed in the above link.
Ok, the link lists 5 makers, I've only heard of three of them, and have heard for years that there were only three, so make of it that what you will. The bottom line is that whatever name is on your water heater, it was made by one of these companies.:eek:

[Sparky Paessler]

Dennis

You might want to check the fill tube also. They are using plastic fill tubes now and I have worked on two different hot water heaters that the tube had deterioated to where it was only 2" or so long. You can check it by removing the cold water supply line. It sits down in the hole and you should be able to stick a finger in it and pull it out. If you have one that swrils the water it will have a bend at the end. It directs the cold water into the bottom of the tank. If it is gone then you will get cold water mixing with the hot at the top of the tank. I replaced mine with a copper pipe that I flaired the end of. Just another thing that you might check. Oh we also had been getting a lot of whiteish grit in the screens on the faucets.

Sparky

Just noticed the previous post said the same thing! Should have read all the way through before replying. :rolleyes:

[Boyd Gathwright]

.... Noted ;).




Dennis

You might want to check the fill tube also. They are using plastic fill tubes now and I have worked on two different hot water heaters that the tube had deterioated to where it was only 2" or so long. You can check it by removing the cold water supply line. It sits down in the hole and you should be able to stick a finger in it and pull it out. If you have one that swrils the water it will have a bend at the end. It directs the cold water into the bottom of the tank. If it is gone then you will get cold water mixing with the hot at the top of the tank. I replaced mine with a copper pipe that I flaired the end of. Just another thing that you might check. Oh we also had been getting a lot of whiteish grit in the screens on the faucets.

Sparky

[Dennis McDonaugh]

A few months ago I was having problems with the hot water heater in my garage apartment. The water was hot coming out of the fauct but lasted only 5 minutes or so. I replaced both elements and it worked fine for awhile. Now, I get no hot water at all, its luke warm and doesn't last long. There is 240 bolts on the top element and zero volts on the bottom element and the water outlet pipe is cold. There is continuity between the two contacts on the elements and no continuity between either contact and case so it appears to be okay. Any other troubleshooting ideas?

Thanks

[Boyd Gathwright]

Hi Dennis,

.... Refer to the last paragraph on page 2. It should give you a better understanding of how heating elements work in tandum.
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=15656 (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=15656)

.... What you most likely need in conjunction with your hot water heater is a WATER SOFTENER. I recommend "WATERBOSS", http://www.waterboss.com (http://www.waterboss.com/) . I have been using them for years with very good success. Just installed one recently and may consider doing a "POST" in the future.

Good luck to you ;).

Boyd



A few months ago I was having problems with the hot water heater in my garage apartment. The water was hot coming out of the fauct but lasted only 5 minutes or so. I replaced both elements and it worked fine for awhile. Now, I get no hot water at all, its luke warm and doesn't last long. There is 240 bolts on the top element and zero volts on the bottom element and the water outlet pipe is cold. There is continuity between the two contacts on the elements and no continuity between either contact and case so it appears to be okay. Any other troubleshooting ideas?

Thanks

[Randy Meijer]

.....There is 240 bolts on the top element.....

You are going to have a heck of a job getting that element out of the heater!!!:D

[Dennis McDonaugh]

Hi Dennis,

.... Refer to the last paragraph on page 2. It should give you a better understanding of how heating elements work in tandum.
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=15656 (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=15656)

.... What you most likely need in conjunction with your hot water heater is a WATER SOFTENER. I recommend "WATERBOSS", http://www.waterboss.com (http://www.waterboss.com/) . I have been using them for years with very good success. Just installed one recently and may consider doing a "POST" in the future.

Good luck to you ;).

Boyd

Boyd, I have a good watersoftner and a filter so that's not the problem. I removed the top element and it had a hole in the side like it had a blow out. I had replaced both elements a month or so ago and they worked fine. Then I unplugged the heater for about four weeks and when I plugged it back in, it got warm, then stopped. Does turning it on and off affect the life of the elements?

Thanks,

[Frank Hagan]

BTW there are only three manufacturers of water heaters in the US. They also happen to be listed in the above link.
Ok, the link lists 5 makers, I've only heard of three of them, and have heard for years that there were only three, so make of it that what you will. The bottom line is that whatever name is on your water heater, it was made by one of these companies.:eek:

That's true of tank-type, gas fired water heaters (either natural or LP gas), but not of electric heaters. There are a few small companies out there making them (Coates is one, for instance). Plus the imports. And AOSmith just bought State, so we're down to four domestic tank manufacturers of that type (I work for one of the other three!)

Electric water heaters may not have dip tubes or anodes; it depends on the size of the tank. Many have small stainless tanks and heat "nearly instantaneously".

Another way to test the elements is to do an ohms resistance test, but you have to find out the normal ohms resistance. When I worked for a company that owned a small electric heater company our elements generally ran 9 - 11 ohms resistance. You could have one "going bad" that would still have continuity but have very high resistance.

[Frank Hagan]

Boyd, I have a good watersoftner and a filter so that's not the problem. I removed the top element and it had a hole in the side like it had a blow out. I had replaced both elements a month or so ago and they worked fine. Then I unplugged the heater for about four weeks and when I plugged it back in, it got warm, then stopped. Does turning it on and off affect the life of the elements?

Thanks,

If the hole is near the top on the side, it may have been an air bubble trapped in the tank. The elements will burn out very quickly if exposed to air while heating. Cycling will eventually wear out an element, but not as quickly as you experienced. Has the tank been moved, or any other change happened that might allow air to become entrapped next to the elements?

The manufacturer may have a technical desk you can call, and sometimes their websites will have troubleshooting information available.

[Boyd Gathwright]

Dennis,

.... Could you post some pics of your heating element with that "blow out". It may help to better make a determination. Was there any buildup on the heating element itself? What usually happens is, the element becomes completely incrusted with calcium deposits and the water surrounding the element cannot carry off the heat fast enough and an eruption occurres.
.... Some thoughts, though you have a watersofterner it may NOT be effective? When was the last time you tested your water? Your water could be highly acidic. You could, and I am assuming you still can, buy a complete water testing kit at Lowes for about $30.00.
.... The watersoftner I told you about before (last post) has a built-in twenty micron screen filter which is cleaned with every backwash, hence, NO water pressure drop and NO filters to buy.

.... Let us know your findings :).

Boyd


Boyd, I have a good watersoftner and a filter so that's not the problem. I removed the top element and it had a hole in the side like it had a blow out. I had replaced both elements a month or so ago and they worked fine. Then I unplugged the heater for about four weeks and when I plugged it back in, it got warm, then stopped. Does turning it on and off affect the life of the elements?

Thanks,

[Dennis McDonaugh]

Boyd, I already tossed the element--it looked brand new except for the hole in the side where it looked like the exit hole of a tin can shot by a 22. We don't have acidic water here in south Texas, but it is very hard hence the water softner. I should mention we have two hot water heaters and haven't had any problems with the other one, but its never been turned off.

[Frank Hagan]

Was the burn out hole near the top, where an air bubble might have collected?

[Jerry Clark]

Sounds like the power was turned on before the tank was full-- the element was not submerged in water.:cool:

[Frank Hagan]

Sounds like the power was turned on before the tank was full-- the element was not submerged in water.:cool:

That can happen, but often the problem is that the trapped air does not evacuate with normal water pressure because of the shape of the tank and its orientation. I had a case where the guy went through 3 elements, and the problem was that even though he was dutifully purging the tank just like we told him, and running water through it for up to five minutes, it was not level. We finally figured out that caused an air bubble that was locked in the top of the tank. The solution was to ensure the tank was completely full of water by making the outlet the highest point (in this case, re-aligning it to be level again).

[Dennis McDonaugh]

Was the burn out hole near the top, where an air bubble might have collected?

Yeah, that's where it was at end where the element makes a 180 degree bend. Maybe it wasn't full when I plugged it in. But I have to wonder about that because it produced hot water for a week or so before I unplugged it and wouldn't make any the next time I plugged it in.

[Frank Hagan]

Yeah, that's where it was at end where the element makes a 180 degree bend. Maybe it wasn't full when I plugged it in. But I have to wonder about that because it produced hot water for a week or so before I unplugged it and wouldn't make any the next time I plugged it in.

You might have a case where air is collecting in the system, which can happen at the pump on a well system or in cases where a small leak allows the water that usually "stands" in the pipe to drain down. Something to look for, anyway.

Sometimes, though, I'm convinced some heaters are simply possessed. :rolleyes: