Mark Kay
04-08-2013, 7:13 PM
Does anybody have any experience with "Okoume" or Gaboon, and is it a Mahogany?
My neighborhood deep-discount lumberyard doesn't do much in hardwoods, especially rough stock--they usually sell finished/s4s lumber. What caught my eye was "mahogany" that was only available as 1x6 and lengths 12-13 feet long or more. They also sell "3/4" mahogany" plywood at really low prices, so a few months ago when I went to get some baltic birch ply, I bought a sheet of 3/4" mahogany as well as one mahogany board.
The board seems to have a course grain (to the touch, not really as much to the eye, and the edge almost gave me a sliver) and when I compared it to an article about the different mahoganies in a major woodworking magazine, with pictures like from a deck of cards (mostly kings & queens), it looked the most like "Honduran" Mahogany. The article also had Cuban Mahogany, Khaya African Mahogany, and a couple others I think. I have also read that Luan/Lauan is called Phillipine Mahogany. My only experience wit it was in the metric form of 1/4" plywood and it was brown, closer to walnut color than, say, cherry or maple colors.
When I got the 3/4 mahogany sheet inside, I stood it up with the Baltic sheets. It had a pinkish, reddish color to it, and when I touched it, it felt like it was prefinished or presanded. When I looed at the other side, it had a few football plugs, and some type of tan-pink filler near an edge, like the sheet was in an accident, so I took it back and picked out a replacement myself that had no damage nor any plugs on either side.
Back to the 1x6, it has a straight grain and completely clear. Because of doing a kitchen and undecided on species, I e-mailed the place and asked what sizes & how many they had and what species are they selling in case they run out... he replied:
HI, THANKS FOR YOUR INQUIRY.... THE 1 X 6 MAHOGANY WE CURRENTLY STOCK IS IMPORTED BRAZILIAN OKEME SPECIES... IN 12' AND 13' LENGTHS ONLY @2.30 PER LIN. FT. THANKS, JOE
......................................
So I know Brazil is in South America and that mahogany should be a "genuine" mahogany, but I couldn't really find much on that name on the internet. I also know that that comes out to about $4.60/board foot. So I e-mailed him back:
"Can you tell me the Latin scientific name of your mahogany? I can't find any info on Brazilian okeme. I hope this isn't lauan which is sometimes called Philippine mahogany. I bought both boards and plywood."
......................................
The next day I got this reply:
HI MARK, WHEN DID YOU BUY THIS AND WHAT LENGTHS DID YOU BUY? PLEASE GIVE US YOUR DOCUMENT # AND DATE OF PURCHASE SO I CAN RESEARCH THE SPECIES YOU PICKED UP. THANKS, JOE
......................................
So I told him and got a reply from the owner:
"Hello Mark, i think the board u purchases maybe from the Aucoumea-Klaineana family it hard to pin point the link below may help"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aucoumea_klaineana (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aucoumea_klaineana)
......................................
I think other common names are Okoume and Gaboon, if I searched that name. So I asked:
"Are you saying that the plywood you sold me as 3/4 Mahogany is Gaboon, or the 1x6x12 you sold me as Mahogany is Gaboon? Or both?"
......................................
The owner replied back:
"you can not sell philippian mahogany - the family of trees are all called mahogany but we never sell real Mahogany only lumber & plywood from the same family of trees - you can sell philippian mahogany in the USA"
......................................
I think he got his facts or countries wrong, or both. Actually the reply is confusing, like two no's... can not can's.
So I sent him a long reply, hope it's correct:
I need you to explain that to me better. Phillipian mahogany is "fake" mahogany, or Luan/Lauan. Real or true Mahogany is from central & south America, including Brazil where it was overharvested. "Real" Mahogany is available for sale everywhere in the USA I believe, it just costs more.
Here's a good explanation of the mahogany confusion, there are only 2 real species plus an African relative from a different genus:
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20genuine.htm (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20genuine.htm)
It was found here, http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/#letterM (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/#letterM)
which shows hundreds of woods, including:
mahogany, african (228/174/67) with fact sheet
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/_thumbs/mahogany,%20central%20american%20thumb.jpg (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20central%20american.htm)
mahogany, central american (10/8/2)
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/_thumbs/mahogany,%20cuban%20thumb.jpg (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20cuban.htm)
mahogany, cuban (20/13/1)
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/_thumbs/mahogany,%20genuine%20thumb.jpg (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20genuine.htm)
mahogany, genuine (46/41/26)
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/_thumbs/mahogany,%20honduran%20thumb.jpg (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20honduran.htm)
mahogany, honduran (134/110/52)
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/_thumbs/mahogany,%20misc%20thumb.jpg (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20misc.htm)
mahogany, misc (173/76/13)
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/_thumbs/mahogany,%20philippine%20thumb.jpg (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20philippine.htm)
mahogany, philippine (77/62/44)
mahogany, royal --- see tambran, wild
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/_thumbs/mahogany,%20santos%20thumb.jpg (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20santos.htm)
mahogany, santos (65/51/39)
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/_thumbs/mahogany,%20south%20american%20thumb.jpg (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20south%20american.htm)
mahogany, south american (40/23/11)
and
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/_thumbs/gaboon%20thumb.jpg (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/gaboon.htm)
gaboon (54/31/10) with fact sheet
I still would like to know a definite answer to what I have that was sold as 1x6x13ft mahogany and 3/4" mahogany plywood. My family and friends & neighbors have been buying from you since the 1960's and know you will make good on these problems. I actually am looking to buy 100 board feet of something--hickory, hard maple, mahogany--but I can't afford to be eating $28 1x6's nor $40 plywood sheets."
......................................
So guess what his reply was? Yeah, that's right, he didn't reply.
HAS ANYBODY HERE USED THIS AND IF SO CAN YOU ADD ANYTHING ELSE ABOUT IT, AS WELL AS WHAT I SHOULD DO? AND IS THE PLYWOOD LAUAN OR GABOON OR OKOUME? (WHICH I HEARD IS PRIZED FOR BOATBUILDING, but I'm only doing a kitchen...)
My neighborhood deep-discount lumberyard doesn't do much in hardwoods, especially rough stock--they usually sell finished/s4s lumber. What caught my eye was "mahogany" that was only available as 1x6 and lengths 12-13 feet long or more. They also sell "3/4" mahogany" plywood at really low prices, so a few months ago when I went to get some baltic birch ply, I bought a sheet of 3/4" mahogany as well as one mahogany board.
The board seems to have a course grain (to the touch, not really as much to the eye, and the edge almost gave me a sliver) and when I compared it to an article about the different mahoganies in a major woodworking magazine, with pictures like from a deck of cards (mostly kings & queens), it looked the most like "Honduran" Mahogany. The article also had Cuban Mahogany, Khaya African Mahogany, and a couple others I think. I have also read that Luan/Lauan is called Phillipine Mahogany. My only experience wit it was in the metric form of 1/4" plywood and it was brown, closer to walnut color than, say, cherry or maple colors.
When I got the 3/4 mahogany sheet inside, I stood it up with the Baltic sheets. It had a pinkish, reddish color to it, and when I touched it, it felt like it was prefinished or presanded. When I looed at the other side, it had a few football plugs, and some type of tan-pink filler near an edge, like the sheet was in an accident, so I took it back and picked out a replacement myself that had no damage nor any plugs on either side.
Back to the 1x6, it has a straight grain and completely clear. Because of doing a kitchen and undecided on species, I e-mailed the place and asked what sizes & how many they had and what species are they selling in case they run out... he replied:
HI, THANKS FOR YOUR INQUIRY.... THE 1 X 6 MAHOGANY WE CURRENTLY STOCK IS IMPORTED BRAZILIAN OKEME SPECIES... IN 12' AND 13' LENGTHS ONLY @2.30 PER LIN. FT. THANKS, JOE
......................................
So I know Brazil is in South America and that mahogany should be a "genuine" mahogany, but I couldn't really find much on that name on the internet. I also know that that comes out to about $4.60/board foot. So I e-mailed him back:
"Can you tell me the Latin scientific name of your mahogany? I can't find any info on Brazilian okeme. I hope this isn't lauan which is sometimes called Philippine mahogany. I bought both boards and plywood."
......................................
The next day I got this reply:
HI MARK, WHEN DID YOU BUY THIS AND WHAT LENGTHS DID YOU BUY? PLEASE GIVE US YOUR DOCUMENT # AND DATE OF PURCHASE SO I CAN RESEARCH THE SPECIES YOU PICKED UP. THANKS, JOE
......................................
So I told him and got a reply from the owner:
"Hello Mark, i think the board u purchases maybe from the Aucoumea-Klaineana family it hard to pin point the link below may help"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aucoumea_klaineana (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aucoumea_klaineana)
......................................
I think other common names are Okoume and Gaboon, if I searched that name. So I asked:
"Are you saying that the plywood you sold me as 3/4 Mahogany is Gaboon, or the 1x6x12 you sold me as Mahogany is Gaboon? Or both?"
......................................
The owner replied back:
"you can not sell philippian mahogany - the family of trees are all called mahogany but we never sell real Mahogany only lumber & plywood from the same family of trees - you can sell philippian mahogany in the USA"
......................................
I think he got his facts or countries wrong, or both. Actually the reply is confusing, like two no's... can not can's.
So I sent him a long reply, hope it's correct:
I need you to explain that to me better. Phillipian mahogany is "fake" mahogany, or Luan/Lauan. Real or true Mahogany is from central & south America, including Brazil where it was overharvested. "Real" Mahogany is available for sale everywhere in the USA I believe, it just costs more.
Here's a good explanation of the mahogany confusion, there are only 2 real species plus an African relative from a different genus:
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20genuine.htm (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20genuine.htm)
It was found here, http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/#letterM (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/#letterM)
which shows hundreds of woods, including:
mahogany, african (228/174/67) with fact sheet
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/_thumbs/mahogany,%20central%20american%20thumb.jpg (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20central%20american.htm)
mahogany, central american (10/8/2)
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/_thumbs/mahogany,%20cuban%20thumb.jpg (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20cuban.htm)
mahogany, cuban (20/13/1)
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/_thumbs/mahogany,%20genuine%20thumb.jpg (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20genuine.htm)
mahogany, genuine (46/41/26)
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/_thumbs/mahogany,%20honduran%20thumb.jpg (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20honduran.htm)
mahogany, honduran (134/110/52)
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/_thumbs/mahogany,%20misc%20thumb.jpg (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20misc.htm)
mahogany, misc (173/76/13)
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/_thumbs/mahogany,%20philippine%20thumb.jpg (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20philippine.htm)
mahogany, philippine (77/62/44)
mahogany, royal --- see tambran, wild
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/_thumbs/mahogany,%20santos%20thumb.jpg (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20santos.htm)
mahogany, santos (65/51/39)
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/_thumbs/mahogany,%20south%20american%20thumb.jpg (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/mahogany,%20south%20american.htm)
mahogany, south american (40/23/11)
and
http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/_thumbs/gaboon%20thumb.jpg (http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/gaboon.htm)
gaboon (54/31/10) with fact sheet
I still would like to know a definite answer to what I have that was sold as 1x6x13ft mahogany and 3/4" mahogany plywood. My family and friends & neighbors have been buying from you since the 1960's and know you will make good on these problems. I actually am looking to buy 100 board feet of something--hickory, hard maple, mahogany--but I can't afford to be eating $28 1x6's nor $40 plywood sheets."
......................................
So guess what his reply was? Yeah, that's right, he didn't reply.
HAS ANYBODY HERE USED THIS AND IF SO CAN YOU ADD ANYTHING ELSE ABOUT IT, AS WELL AS WHAT I SHOULD DO? AND IS THE PLYWOOD LAUAN OR GABOON OR OKOUME? (WHICH I HEARD IS PRIZED FOR BOATBUILDING, but I'm only doing a kitchen...)