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View Full Version : Have plywood prices gone way up?



Brian Elfert
04-05-2013, 8:52 AM
Last year I bought a bunch of BC plywood for a project. I recall the 3/8" plywood I bought was around $10 a sheet. I need to buy more plywood to continue the project this spring. The price for 3/8" BC plywood today is over $16 a sheet! The price has gone up by 60%! Has the increased home building caused materials prices to increase?

Scott Shepherd
04-05-2013, 9:50 AM
I don't think it has anything to do with increased home building, but the prices have skyrocketed. I have a repeat job for a customer that is made from 19/32" OSB. A year ago, it was $11.95 a sheet. Today it's $19.95 a sheet.

Then again, what used to cost $5 for lunch, now costs $8, so my guess is it has nothing to do with housing.

Brian Elfert
04-05-2013, 12:02 PM
I haven't noticed the cost of lunch increasing by nearly that much in just the past year, but the prices of eating lunch out have certainly gone up over the past several years. The cost of food in general has gone up quite a bit so I am not really surprised.

Maybe the economy is now doing well enough that there is no longer a glut of wood products. A lot of logging companies shrunk dramatically or closed during the recession plus a number of sheet good mills closed too. I'm not going to go broke paying an extra $100 for my project, but I certainly have better things to do with $100.

David Weaver
04-05-2013, 12:09 PM
There was just a post here not too long ago about a tariff or something on chinese plywood.

Ken Fitzgerald
04-05-2013, 12:20 PM
Has it ever occurred to someone to just ask a person in charge at a lumberyard why the price has increased?

Most of what you will get here is skeptical personal opinions with little unbiased facts to back up the opinion.

When we saw an increase in our cable television and internet service, we called the provider and they told us why the rates went up.

David Weaver
04-05-2013, 12:35 PM
Duty on chinese plywood - 22.63% to 27.12%

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/02/27/us-usa-china-trade-idUSBRE91Q1CE20130227

http://www.aa-hp.org/#!news/c73g

(see the top article at the second link for the duty charged to two different groups).

The second link is the american alliance for hardwood plywood. Note by the dates on the articles how current this issue is. That would explain why price increases are recent.

Brian Elfert
04-05-2013, 12:38 PM
Has it ever occurred to someone to just ask a person in charge at a lumberyard why the price has increased?


Do you think the $8 an hour workers at Home Depot or Menards have a clue? There are no retail type lumberyards I know of to ask.

David Weaver
04-05-2013, 12:38 PM
Most of what you will get here is skeptical personal opinions with little unbiased facts to back up the opinion.



I must be reading a different forum. While those exist, the right answer is usually in a discussion thread, even if the armchair types refuse to recognize which answers are backed up by fact (you can lead a horse to water...).

David Weaver
04-05-2013, 12:40 PM
Do you think the $8 an hour workers at Home Depot or Menards have a clue? There are no retail type lumberyards I know of to ask.

I would agree with that. It took me much less time to piece together a prior discussion (which was accurate) and go find a link than it would've taken me to find someone at any yard I'm aware of. I could've called the local commercial plywood supplier here to ask them, but I'm not making an order from them any time soon, and it would be kind of rude to waste their time if I'm not.

Ken Fitzgerald
04-05-2013, 12:43 PM
I haven't bought lumber, plywood or hardwood at Menard's or Home Depot in years..I buy my wood several local lumberyards...I said quote "someone in charge at a lumberyard". I don't think the $8/hour guy is in charge either.....Talk to a department manager or store manager at Menards or Home Depot. They might know.

However, a couple years ago I was in HD locally, the plywood they were carrying was manufactured in this country.

David Helm
04-05-2013, 1:45 PM
Sheet goods prices are very volatile. They change dramatically with world conditions. When a hurricane causes damage, sheet goods prices go up. When things are stable, prices go down. Sheetgoods may be the most classic example of supply and demand pricing.

Lee Koepke
04-05-2013, 1:54 PM
Dave's links are correct regarding the tariffs on hardwood plywood. The chinese hardwood plywood is generally 'paint grade' sheets, domestic hardwood plywood is the stain grade types. Of course as the imported prices rise, the domestic prices are sure to follow. The part of the 'other' sheet goods (OSB and pine plywood) pricing stems partkt from that, but we do have an increased market now for multifamily and single family new starts. A hotel we are working on is migrating its design away from wood construction due to the rising labor and material costs.

Unfortunately the price seemed to JUMP rather than creep.

Matt Meiser
04-05-2013, 2:28 PM
Do you think the $8 an hour workers at Home Depot or Menards have a clue? There are no retail type lumberyards I know of to ask.

http://www.hiawathalumber.com/
http://www.siweklumber.com/
http://www.youngbloodlumber.com/

I've actually been to the first helping my brother buy materials for a project. Seems decent.

Ken Fitzgerald
04-05-2013, 2:40 PM
I must be reading a different forum. While those exist, the right answer is usually in a discussion thread, even if the armchair types refuse to recognize which answers are backed up by fact (you can lead a horse to water...).

While in this instance after I made my statement, you did post some links pertaining to this topic Dave....I would suggest that a vast majority of what is posted especially in the OT Forum is personal opinion without any unbiased facts to support the statements. Just because one can find "information" on the internet, doesn't mean it's unbiased, doesn't mean it's not a one-sided, narrow view of a multi-dimensional problem and therefore it is not necessarily completely true or factual.

All I am suggesting is that one can gather information from the someone "in the know" at the source rather than spreading rumor or speculation at a website on the internet.
What is wrong with asking the manager of HD or Menards...."Why has your price on plywood or any other materials risen so much, so quickly?" rather than asking here inviting a wide range of speculation........ most of which is inaccurate, rumor or personal opinion without any or a complete factual basis?

While the internet can be a good source of information, the internet is also the largest source of misinformation the world has ever seen. JMHO.

David Weaver
04-05-2013, 2:49 PM
Ken, I agree, it's nice to get something from where you know it's the right answer. In a case like this, though, the topic was covered elsewhere already. It wasn't so much your comment that sent me looking for proof as it was laziness that didn't send me there on the first post.

I think topics like this are one of the most valuable parts of the general WW and discussion forums, because I wouldn't have ever looked for anything about ply prices having just spent $1,500 on ply a couple of months ago, my orders are few and far between. But it was an interesting topic, and I'd rather know it if for no other reason than just to know it.

There's all sorts of aspects left uncovered by this, but there's enough there now that we know that the price increase isn't just one of those "big oil" kind of conspiracy things. Things we didn't touch on (and I have no reason to really track down):
* is the price increase across more than just hardwood plywood
* if there is a 22-27 percent tariff, then why do the price increases seem to be more like double that (maybe some suppliers were expecting to get more than what was shown in the most recent stories).

All that said, I personally like these kinds of topics, someone usually finds some factual information and with a little glint and squint, we can usually tell if the source is a credible source or if it's just an opinion article. Of course, I looked through the source that I posted to make sure it wasn't an advertising agency, I doubt much more credible could be found.

The one thing that would be worse than sifting through a few sources and using our minds would be dismissing everything immediately and not using them at all.

Brian Elfert
04-05-2013, 3:20 PM
However, a couple years ago I was in HD locally, the plywood they were carrying was manufactured in this country.

I was just at Home depot two nights ago. They have both birch and oak plywood that is marked made in the USA on it. A friend of mine is doing a project for me and he buys his oak plywood at Home Depot because they will cut it up on their panel saw into manageable pieces. Myself, I probably wouldn't buy oak plywood at Home Depot.

For ordinary construction grade plywood it is just too hard to buy at the few local lumberyards that still exist. If you're not a contractor the local lumberyards won't give you the time of day. They don't want to deal with the guy who wants to buy a half dozen sheets of plywood. I've tried and it just doesn't work out so I go back to Home Depot or Menards.

Brian Elfert
04-05-2013, 3:32 PM
http://www.hiawathalumber.com/
http://www.siweklumber.com/
http://www.youngbloodlumber.com/

I've actually been to the first helping my brother buy materials for a project. Seems decent.

I've purchased hardwood plywood from Youngblood before. They close promptly at 3:45 pm and are really set up for delivering product by the truckload rather than retail sales of a few sheets of construction grade plywood. Siwek Lumber tends to be really hard to deal with. I have bought from Siwek on some specialty stuff. I've never been to Hiawatha Lumber because it is too far away.

All three of the above are really too far away for everyday purchases. Siwek is a 30 mile round trip. If it was easy to deal with a local lumberyard as Home Depot or Menards I would shop there.

I shouldn't have said there are no lumberyards locally. There are just none that are easy for someone buying a few sheets of plywood to deal with. Not being open evenings and weekends doesn't help.

Matt Meiser
04-05-2013, 3:33 PM
What is wrong with asking the manager of HD or Menards...."Why has your price on plywood or any other materials risen so much, so quickly?"

I'd put odds on "We get our pricing from corporate." being the answer. Heck, the manager at my Home Depot didn't know what the warranty process on a fluorescent light bulb that went bad in less than a week was, despite the fact that it said to return it to your nearest Home Depot for replacement on the back. Do you really think he understands the intricacies of commodity lumber pricing?

Ken Fitzgerald
04-05-2013, 3:33 PM
Brian,

I live in a relatively remote area. While we have HD, I haven't shopped there for lumber in at least 5 years.

We have 3 local lumberyards.

One is very small local version of "Menards or HD". The quality of lumber they sell is so bad that and their attitude toward customer is so bad, I refused to accept about $100 worth of badly warped framing lumber after they loaded it in my pickup. When they told me I couldn't pick and choose my own, I told them to unload my truck while went back in for a refund. I haven't been back. This and HD are the only lumber supplies available on Sundays. I often wait until Monday to shop elsewhere if I need lumber.

We have 2 other lumberyards.

One is closed on Saturday and Sunday. They have a good quality oak plywood I use for cabinets. Their hardwood supply is limited and I seldom buy there unless I am finishing a project and just need a small amount. I buy most of my construction lumber here too.

A lumberyard across the Snake River in Clarkston, WA is open on Saturdays and I buy there when necessary.

My hardwoods I typically drive 30 miles north to Moscow, ID to purchase or drive 110 miles to Spokane, WA.

Hardwoods are expensive here as our forests are primarily coniferous.

Matt Meiser
04-05-2013, 3:41 PM
I've purchased hardwood plywood from Youngblood before. They close promptly at 3:45 pm and are really set up for delivering product by the truckload rather than retail sales of a few sheets of construction grade plywood. Siwek Lumber tends to be really hard to deal with. I have bought from Siwek on some specialty stuff. I've never been to Hiawatha Lumber because it is too far away.

All three of the above are really too far away for everyday purchases. Siwek is a 30 mile round trip. If it was easy to deal with a local lumberyard as Home Depot or Menards I would shop there.

I shouldn't have said there are no lumberyards locally. There are just none that are easy for someone buying a few sheets of plywood to deal with. Not being open evenings and weekends doesn't help.

Yep, that's a different story. The lumber yard that was 5 miles from me preferred to only deal with contractors and were open 8-5 M-F. Guess what happened to them when they stopped building houses? Its a nice feed store now--with evening and Saturday hours. I've grown tired of local business complaining about people buying from big boxes when they aren't open hours that support buying from them. I have the same issue with my local Napa store that closes at 7 at the latest. If I get off work about 5, eat dinner, and start on a project, I'm lucky to know what I need by 7. They did start opening on Sundays. Then there's the local coffee shop I've never been to because they close about 1PM that is probably bitter about the new Starbucks kiosk in our Kroger that I've hit at least once a week in the last 6 weeks.

Mark Bolton
04-05-2013, 3:42 PM
The tariff doesnt go into effect until the fall though it doesnt mean some unscrupulous outlets may not start profiteering early, and as the OP has stated this is domestic construction grade material. The correct answer (in my opinion) lies in the market volatility mentioned. Wood products are priced like crude oil. A butterfly flapping its wings on the limb of a sapling in Oregon can cause the price of lumber to move. As stated, with large volume items like OSB you can see swings on a weekly basis at times.

Looking at prices as compared to a year earlier, especially the past year(s), will only bring you heart ache.

It brings a new clarity to the fact that US corporations, while numbers are supposedly down, are sitting on larger cash reserves than ever in history. Prices will continue to rise while riches are being made.

Mark Bolton
04-05-2013, 3:47 PM
Then there's the local coffee shop I've never been to because they close about 1PM that is probably bitter about the new Starbucks

Thats gotta be something in the coffee shop/bakery industry? We have a bakery in town that is not open on sundays, closes early, and so on. Every time I think, man, business has got to be good when you can turn your nose up at the sunday morning crowd and have such short hours.

But then I get to thinking, do the masses really go out to pick up baked goods for the weekend/sunday morning anymore? Fresh bagels? Dad gets up and runs to the bakery or goes to the coffee shop to sit with the guys? I really wonder if that stuff happens any more for the vast majority.

I cant tell you how many small business around seem to have a pretty comfy interpretation of hours/schedules and after that dont want to work the hours themselves but hire help and are crushed under the burden of payroll.

I really do notice it though in the bakery/coffee world... its weird.

David Weaver
04-05-2013, 4:09 PM
The tariff doesnt go into effect until the fall though it doesnt mean some unscrupulous outlets may not start profiteering early, and as the OP has stated this is domestic construction grade material. The correct answer (in my opinion) lies in the market volatility mentioned. Wood products are priced like crude oil. A butterfly flapping its wings on the limb of a sapling in Oregon can cause the price of lumber to move. As stated, with large volume items like OSB you can see swings on a weekly basis at times.

Looking at prices as compared to a year earlier, especially the past year(s), will only bring you heart ache.

It brings a new clarity to the fact that US corporations, while numbers are supposedly down, are sitting on larger cash reserves than ever in history. Prices will continue to rise while riches are being made.

You can look at their financials if you want to confirm that, though. If I go out and look at a staple supplier, and they're making a 10% margin, I'm not inclined to tell them they should halve prices.

As far as the pricing for future increases, one of the things I would speculate earlier on if I wasn't so lazy about 70% price increases tied in with 22-27% tariffs is suppliers may have expected that there would be additional tariffs applied to imported plywoods, and the volatility associated with that would lead one to price at the expected price plus a little.

One of the things that a lot of us like to do when a good is based on fluctuating markets is complain only when the prices go up, but when manufacturers or option holders take a loss, we don't like to recognize that. I don't begrudge them the chance to make a buck. I wouldn't want to be in a business that couldn't do that.

Long ago, I was buying a gibson guitar. It was $1065 cash, I still remember the number because it was such a large amount of money for me in 1996. I told the dealer I wasn't sure I wanted it and I might be back in a couple of weeks. He let me know a price increase was coming with the flip of the calendar year, and I said "why would the price of the ones on the shelf increase, you already bought them." You probably know his response..."because when I sell that, I have to be able to afford to buy the next one". He was a good guy, sold 40 couple percent off list, which back then was barely making anything. I hope his prices are a little higher off his cost now.

David Weaver
04-05-2013, 4:12 PM
All of our traditional bakeries are like that. They start around 1 or 2 am, and they can't afford to pay someone to stand around for a few afternoon customers, and they also can't afford to have a bunch of leftovers on hand. So they make what they expect will sell that day, and they close when it runs out. They work 5 or 6 days a week on that schedule and take one off. Here, it's usually monday, tuesday or wednesday, but for some it's Sunday so they can go to mass.

Chris Padilla
04-05-2013, 4:57 PM
$31 for 3/4" American-made ply at HD is what I paid a few weekends ago. I found that it would be perfectly adequate as carcass material for cabinets and I might just pick up a few more sheets. I remember 1/2" drywall was $4...now it is like $10-12/sheet.

Brian Elfert
04-05-2013, 5:56 PM
I've been to a few small town lumber yards during my travels and most of them have been very good to deal with. I needed leveling blocks for my camper at one place and they just pointed me to a big scrap bin and said to take what I needed. Totally different attitudes than at the big city lumber yards near my home.

I was just shocked at how much plywood prices had gone up, although I thought the prices were pretty low last year.

Kevin Groenke
04-05-2013, 8:35 PM
I've purchased hardwood plywood from Youngblood before. They close promptly at 3:45 pm and are really set up for delivering product by the truckload rather than retail sales of a few sheets of construction grade plywood. Siwek Lumber tends to be really hard to deal with. I have bought from Siwek on some specialty stuff. I've never been to Hiawatha Lumber because it is too far away.

All three of the above are really too far away for everyday purchases. Siwek is a 30 mile round trip. If it was easy to deal with a local lumberyard as Home Depot or Menards I would shop there.

I shouldn't have said there are no lumberyards locally. There are just none that are easy for someone buying a few sheets of plywood to deal with. Not being open evenings and weekends doesn't help.


Hey Brian,

I've been buying lumber from Youngblood for 15 years and I've usually not bought more the 6 sheets or 100 bd ft at a time. Yes, they send out trucks everyday, their hours are inconvenient for "the working man" and the yardmen can be a bit gruff, but they do sell retail and they are open Saturday mornings. Youngblood actually caters somewhat to small craftsmen, they've always offered wholesale pricing to members of the MN Woodworkers Guild (http://www.mnwwg.org/) and have been strong supporters of the Northern Woods (http://www.mnwwg.org/docs/nwcatalogs/2012.pdf) show.

If you're on the east side, you might check out Forest Product Supply (http://www.forestproductssupply.com/index.php?option=com_frontpage&Itemid=1) - they are a shop that sells stock up in Maplewood. Really nice guys and an interesting inventory. The last time I was up there the sold off-cuts by the pound really reasonably, a great way to play with different materials and to build up some stock.

I think in some ways we're all a bit spoiled by the convenience of big boxes, we can't handle having to talk to people anymore. The few local lumberyards that haven't closed are probably still in business because of long-term relationships with shops and contractors, a niche market and/or good customer service.

I get most of our sheet stock from Industrial Lumber, and Plywood but they're wholesale only, pricing hasn't changed that I've noticed.

If you get out of town a bit, there are mills in the area and it nice to get stock from the source.

Where exactly are you and what are you looking for?

-kg

Brian Elfert
04-05-2013, 9:21 PM
If you're on the east side, you might check out Forest Product Supply (http://www.forestproductssupply.com/index.php?option=com_frontpage&Itemid=1) - they are a shop that sells stock up in Maplewood. Really nice guys and an interesting inventory. The last time I was up there the sold off-cuts by the pound really reasonably, a great way to play with different materials and to build up some stock.

Where exactly are you and what are you looking for?


I've been to Forest Product Supply a number of times because they are nearby. I have purchased mostly Baltic Birch plywood and also had them cut some parts on their CNC cutter.

I'm in Shoreview and right now I'm just looking for construction grade plywood. Construction grade plywood has gone up a fair bit. I've not noticed price increases nearly as steep on cabinet grade plywood.

Brian Elfert
04-08-2013, 10:58 AM
I bought a whole big stack of plywood from Home Depot on Saturday. I unloaded a bunch of it from my trailer yesterday and noticed that about four of the dozen 1/2" are warped pretty badly. The employee who helped me at Home Depot actually set aside a number of pieces because they were warped. The stack at Home Depot seemed to be nice and flat so no idea why they just some were warped.

I don't know if a local lumberyard would be any better. I bet they probably would have just given me the first 12 off the stack without a choice.

Jeremy Hamaker
04-08-2013, 11:18 AM
The one thing that would be worse than sifting through a few sources and using our minds would be dismissing everything immediately and not using them at all.

Yeah, no kidding. If the correct answer to the questions on this forum were "Go ask someone in the industry instead of these biased people who post here" then it would kind of make you wonder why this forum even exists in the first place, huh?

Matt Meiser
04-08-2013, 1:09 PM
$31 for 3/4" American-made ply at HD is what I paid a few weekends ago. I found that it would be perfectly adequate as carcass material for cabinets and I might just pick up a few more sheets. I remember 1/2" drywall was $4...now it is like $10-12/sheet.

That stuff seems to be pretty nice stuff. I used a sheet of oak on the kitchen for some almost-invisible panels beside the appliances where I didn't care about rotary cut grain and a sheet of birch to make my cutting grid which involved ripping lots of 4" strips which gave me a good peek at the core--I think I only found one void which isn't bad.