Opinions on lathe......

[Daniel Atkins]

I'm a relative newcomer here, thrilled to have found such a wonderful forum. I'm looking for a new woodworking avenue to spend massive amounts of money that I don't have, and have become obsessed with the idea of learning to turn:). I'm interested in both bowls and spindle work, probably leaning more toward bowls, and I've been patiently looking for an opportunity to pick up an older lathe with a pretty limited budget, that will serve my needs for at least a while (you all have probably never heard that one before!). I just found a Powermatic 45258223 for sale for $500. I'd be grateful for more learned opinions and comments about suitability and price. Many thanks, Daniel

[Don Orr]

The older Powermatics are known to be solid, well built machines as are their newer relatives. The one in the picture appears to be in decent shape. It would be advisable to go and "kick the tires" if you can. Ideally you should at least see if it runs, check the bearings, belts, motor, speed adjustment, and head to tail alignment. These are relatively simple machines. If this came from a school shop it could be a little worse for wear. I don't remember the spindle thread pitch for these but it should be easy to determine either by measurement or internet search. I'm sure other will have additional advice.

Good luck and you are right about the massive amounts of money part. The lathe is just the beginning. Think about finding a local turning club for more advice and instruction. Turners tend to be a generous bunch.

[Robert Champagne]

The PM 45 is, from what I have heard, a lighter duty machine than the PM 90. I believe it is a Reeves drive machine. Low speed with probably be around 800 RPM. It is a 12" swing. If you are going to turn bowls, you will need to balance the blanks carefully before turning on the machine, ie, cut it as close to round as possible. If it is a 3 phase machine, you can get a VFD to slow down the rpm's. It will be a better spindle lathe, as most of the older lathes were designed for spindle work. With some modifications you could make it into a decent small bowl lathe. Either way, it should be a very nice machine to learn some things on.
Rob

[Jamie Donaldson]

It appears to be in much better condition than the green beast behind it! A Reeves drive lathe can be tolerated for an introduction to turning, until you either upgrade to a newer lathe or modify this one to VFD and new motor. If the Reeves drive is now useable, replacement poly V link belts can make a significant improvement in sound and function, and aren't difficult to install.

[Daniel Atkins]

Thanks for the replies thus far! I've gotten a little more info: It's apparently single phase, currently wired 110, and has the 4 speed pulley. I also inquired about the PM 90 that is in the background of that photo, and it's available also. The 90 is 3 phase, and has the variable speed drive. From what I've gleaned reading here, setting that up with a converter to run on single phase allows the possibility of a VFD which would allow me to operate at slower speeds for bowls. The 90 looks a little harder used, broken (with some repairs) banjos, etc. Is it worth $850, and is it a reasonable match for my use? 258234258235258236 Thanks for the support, Daniel

[Jamie Donaldson]

The 90 also has a Reeves drive as shown, so not any real advantage over the similar drive on the 45. It looks pretty rough, and I don't think worth that asking price.

[Thomas Canfield]

I started out with the little Jet 1014 belt and then 1014VS upgrading to a Jet 1236 and now my Powermatic 3520B. That said, the Jet 1236 is a reasonable lathe, 3/4HP reeves drive, that has more power than the little Jet minis, longer bed for spindles, but still has the limitation of slowest speed requires a fairly well balanced piece. Those can be picked up in the $300 to 500 range or so allowing some additional $$ to play with getting a sharpening system and tools. Having sharp tools really makes the difference and speeds up the learning process of turning and finishing.

[Daniel Atkins]

Thanks for the input folks! If the Powermatic 90 has a 3PH motor, can't I incorporate a VFD into the set up for phase conversion even with the reeves drive? I have a pretty good grasp of single phase, but 3 phase goes over my head. The lathes are at an equipment supplier that I've purchased new equipment from in the past, a couple hour drive away. It sounds like they've been sitting on the 90 for a while and would be open to an offer. If I could get it for $500, plus the expense of phase conversion/VFD so that I can run it, does that make any sense or should I continue to patiently look? I have 4 decent turning tools, but realize that I'll have a significant expense in tooling, and perpetual yearning! It looks in the photos like there are a few face plates with the lathe, but I'll be looking for banjo parts and rests right off the bat.

[Richard Coers]

If that 45 has the 4 step pulleys they say, what is that gear shift looking bar on the front? Looks like Reeves drive to me. You don't mention how much consideration budget puts into the equation. The new machines are light years better than these. You can get a VFD for them, throw some weight on the shelf, and then you have something that you will have trouble selling and will loose most of it's value. Buy a Jet 1642 and you have something with great resale value, but you may never sell it because it is so nice. It will cost you $2000 more than that noisey Powermatic, but then you may spend $500 on the VFD. Also consider the new Jet 1221. Very nice machine, $800. You will probably want a bigger machine some day, but I wouldn't be without a mini/midi around the shop. I have a Oneway 2436, Delta 46-460, Jet 10-14vs. I absolutely would not purchase any lathe without electronic variable speed.

[Doug Ladendorf]

Hey Daniel, I'm a newcomer here too and only started turning in the last year. For a while I was obsessed over finding a PM 90 since they are such solid machines. However I finally had to acknowledge that I wanted more than a 12" swing. Plus the fact that it gets expensive fast to pick up parts. That's not a bad deal for either, especially if you could get it down, but be honest with yourself about what you want to do. If it really is bowls you may wish you got something with 14", 16" or greater swing. Woodcraft has the Nova lathes on sale from time to time. Check those out they are pretty good. The Jet 1642 is widely regarded as an excellent lathe as well. If you find a smaller lathe used to get you started that's not a bad thing either. (What I ended up doing. :)) Good luck!

[Robert Champagne]

Assuming the 90 has a 1 hp or less motor, you can have a VFD shipped to your door in one day for about $180 - $200 new. Used ones also come up on Ebay. Richard makes some good points, but seems biased against older machines. I've never bought a new machine in my life (in fact my big lathe is probably from 1890 or so), so maybe I'm biased against the new ones. If you are just starting out, the PM 90 will be a great machine. I got a Yates J-170 when I started out, which is very similar to the Powermatic. The 90's are well regarded machines. They were also designed primarily as spindle lathes. Some folks around here have modified 90's to be pretty nice bowl lathes. I have an Oliver 159, which, in operation, would be similar to the 90 if you get it. It is a 12" lathe, so if you want to try anything bigger you will have to turn outboard. For teh 90, you would need a separate chuck adapter for the left handed threads. You will be using the lowest speed on the Reeves drive a lot of the time, using the vfd to adjust the speed. You'll use the Reeves drive alone if you want to go over the lowest speed. So you will be using two systems for speed adjustment. In my book, this isn't a huge deal. Would it be better to adjust the speed using just one dial? Sure. The 1 hp motor will do fine for most 12" bowls, but will slow down at very low speeds, and you might need to take light cuts to avoid getting an overload error on the vfd. The 90 in the pictures looks like a good place to start--2 banjo's, a tailstock, etc. I would throw out a lowball offer based on the condition and the 3 phase motor, which to most folks is a major deterrent. Around here in CT I have seen Powermatic 90's sell from $300 - $1000 or so, based upon condition.
Rob

[Roy Turbett]

I've restored three Powermatic 90's and am working on a fourth. The Powermatic 90 in the photo is a late 60's model where the motor is mounted in the lathe bed. This isn't usually a problem if the motor is running or just needs new bearings but can be a problem if it has to be replaced. The reason is the motor frame is uniquely designed to fit the space. Later models have the motor mounted in the cabinet with a jackshaft and have a slower starting speed (about 360 rpm vs. 600 rpm). Adding a vfd solves the speed problem and is very easy to do. Its also very easy to add riser blocks to get more swing but you won't want them to be more than 3" tall unless you're planning on buying a bigger banjo. While the headstock, tailstock, banjo and lathe bed are extremely sturdy, the sheetmetal cabinet isn't well suited for bowl turning because it is only 16" deep and will vibrate alot with a large out of round blank. I'm adding some 2" angle iron to the base on my current restoration to increase the footprint to 28" to help solve this problem and I've also filled the cabinet with sand. Price is very dependent upon condition, especially if its missing parts. Some parts can be hard to find and are expensive. For example, used tailstocks and banjos sell for $150 to $200. Check out the various threads on the Powermatic 90 at OWWM.org before you buy and you will have a better idea of what to look for and how much to pay.

[Daniel Atkins]

Thanks Roy, What a wealth of information. This forum is such a wonderful resource!