Most user friendly veneer softener?

[David Kuzdrall]

I will soon be applying Imbuya burl veneer to my speaker baffles and despite being stored flat in its shipping box with some weight on top it is developed some waves...I fear that I may have to take the time to soften it before use.

Most of what I have read outlines a multi day process of drying, clamping and changing out newspaper sheets which will be difficult / impossible with my schedule. Are there alternative methods that require less babysitting?

I am using unibond 800 for the veneer work, are there any compatibility issues with this adhesive and the various veneer softeners on the market?

thx

[Chris Padilla]

http://www.veneersupplies.com/products/Super-Soft-2-Veneer-Softener-Conditioner.html

I've used this and only this so I don't know what else is out there or works. Follow the directions...has worked as advertised for me but it takes a day or two of prep which doesn't sound like will work for you. Email joe@joewoodworker.com and ask him if there is anything on the market faster (he runs the above site).

I've used it with their Better Bonds veneer glue as well so I cannot comment on compatibility but I don't imagine it would be an issue with the Unibond.

[David Kuzdrall]

http://www.veneersupplies.com/products/Super-Soft-2-Veneer-Softener-Conditioner.html

I've used this and only this so I don't know what else is out there or works. Follow the directions...has worked as advertised for me but it takes a day or two of prep which doesn't sound like will work for you. Email joe@joewoodworker.com and ask him if there is anything on the market faster (he runs the above site).

I've used it with their Better Bonds veneer glue as well so I cannot comment on compatibility but I don't imagine it would be an issue with the Unibond.

Thanks for the link; I noticed this in the description, andif accurate may be the perfect solution....

"Due to the unique formulation of Super-Soft 2, it may also be dried with a household clothes iron on the low/medium setting for instant veneer flattening."

[Alan Lightstone]

I use that also. I've used it both with Better Bond and Unibond 800. Both no problem.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

http://www.veneersupplies.com/products/Super-Soft-2-Veneer-Softener-Conditioner.html

I've used this and only this so I don't know what else is out there or works. Follow the directions...has worked as advertised for me but it takes a day or two of prep which doesn't sound like will work for you. Email joe@joewoodworker.com and ask him if there is anything on the market faster (he runs the above site).

I've used it with their Better Bonds veneer glue as well so I cannot comment on compatibility but I don't imagine it would be an issue with the Unibond.

+1, this stuff is superb. BTW, it also works well to spray it on gnarly grain on something that is not playing nice with a handplane. Makes figured wood a lot more agreeable to plane.

[thomas eaves]

I have always used Pro- Glue for my flatting and it’s half the price of Joe’s. I also think it’s a bad idea to take a hot iron to any chemical without first reading the msds. Only bad things happen when trying to taking short cuts. Tom

[Bill White]

Have not used it on veneer, but a glycerin and water solution will work. Cheap too.
Bill

[David Kuzdrall]

I picked up some of the stuff from Joe and will give it a shot with the iron method.

here is a thought...what would this softener do to veneer already glued? Would it be any less chip prone to trim the burl veneer flush after applying the softener or would this cause adhesion issues?

thx

[Mike Henderson]

I picked up some of the stuff from Joe and will give it a shot with the iron method.

here is a thought...what would this softener do to veneer already glued? Would it be any less chip prone to trim the burl veneer flush after applying the softener or would this cause adhesion issues?

thx
If your veneer is properly glued, it won't chip when you trim it. The only way it can chip is if the glue does not hold the veneer to the substrate.

[This is assuming you use a "hard" glue such as urea formaldehyde, and get enough around the edges.]

Mike

[Kevin Jenness]

Mike, I would dispute your contention that veneer cannot chip if well glued- it depends on the species. Some woods, and some burls among them, are shortgrained or squirrely enough that they can chip out without special care. I just finished a several hundred square foot wenge panelling job, and had random minor chipout on the endgrain trimcuts using a square edge and a 5 degree carbide downshear piloted bit, both new and sharp, even with climbcutting at a very slow speed. The veneer wasn't necessarily pulling from the substrate, but splintering within its thickness and leaving a void at the surface. Finally solved the problem using a HSS downshear spiral end mill with about a 15 degree downshear and a fence mounted pilot. The idea of pretreating laidup burl with a flattening solution is worth trying out. Oftentimes just wetting the surface of a recalcitrant workpiece with water can improve its cutting properties.

To the original question, I have had success flattening wavy burls with GF20 sourced (I think) from Veneer Systems. I think it is mainly water, alcohol and glycerin, and I added yellow glue to it at Darryl Keil's suggestion to improve the longevity of the process. It took several days to dry the leaves out using paper, fiberglass screening and a vacuum press. The directions on the bottle leave out the drying process, but that is dead wrong, shortcutting will lead to later checking. Scott Groves' book Advanced Veneering has a good description of cutting the process down to 24 hours and is worth the book's price alone, quite aside from the amazing spiral seaming he demonstrates. I would recommend it to anyone interested in veneering.

[David Kuzdrall]

First off, thanks for the replies.

Just a quick update in regard to this thread. I have been using the Super Soft 2 as recommended and using the iron technique and so far so good. I made a test panel deliberately simulating a worst case scenario of not enough soak time and not enough drying to see what would happen. Nothing bad happened, adhesion was as good as untreated veneer and once in the press, the panel came out flat as the substrate with no signs of cracking or stress.

That was 2-weeks ago, the test piece still looks good and I have finished 3 of 5 burled panels using the iron technique. The total time required to soften using this method is about an hour. Spray, soak, iron then sticker and wait 45 min or so for the burl to normalize a bit back to shop conditions.


Highly recommended.


Thx