Couple/three questions about a coping sled

[Rich Engelhardt]

Is 3/4" ply too thick to use?
I have a scrap piece of 3/4" that's the perfect size - 15" x 12".

I plan to put a runner on it and use the miter slot on the router table.
How far from the center of the router should the edge of the sled be?

I don't have the router bits yet for rails/stiles.
Am I better off waiting until I pick them up before making the sled?

[Joe Scharle]

Is 3/4" ply too thick to use? YES, the bit's shank may be too far out of the collet to be safe.
How far from the center of the router should the edge of the sled be? This Q. assumes a slot mounted sled.

I have a scrap piece of 3/4" that's the perfect size - 15" x 12". Too big for me.
I plan to put a runner on it and use the miter slot on the router table. Don't add complications by forcing you to square the fence to the miter slot.

I don't have the router bits yet for rails/stiles. Ah ha! This is step 1.
Am I better off waiting until I pick them up before making the sled?

Actually, this is one of those jigs that I recommend buying. MLCS for one, has a low cost unit. The sled base slips under the cutter, so I also recommend buying/making a setup block, since the cut is referenced higher than the table.
That's JMTCW and wish you good luck...

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Rich,

I use one I bought from Rockler. It is about 3/8" thick. It doesn't use the miter gauge slot but is designed to ride against the fence. It locks the material to the sled quite well.

While I have not bought a MLCS coping sled, I am a big fan of their bits and their service.

[Bill Huber]

I am with Joe and Ken, by a sled or make a clamp down sled. I bought one form Eagle America and found that when I clamped it down it would bow the jig, the base was 3/8 phenolic, now I may have been setting my clamps to tight but it did bow and cause problems. I rebuilt it with 1/2" phenolic and had no problems after that.

I have seen videos where the person just used some scrap as a backer and held both parts together, that just did not work for me, the rail or stile would slip so that is when I bought the sled.

Here is my sled after I rebuilt it, I turn the handle a little so that you are pushing the jig to the fence.

255879

[George Bokros]

I am with Joe and Ken, by a sled or make a clamp down sled. I bought one form Eagle America and found that when I clamped it down it would bow the jig, the base was 3/8 phenolic, now I may have been setting my clamps to tight but it did bow and cause problems. I rebuilt it with 1/2" phenolic and had no problems after that.

I have seen videos where the person just used some scrap as a backer and held both parts together, that just did not work for me, the rail or stile would slip so that is when I bought the sled.

Here is my sled after I rebuilt it, I turn the handle a little so that you are pushing the jig to the fence.

255879

How was it bowing the sled? I have one from Eagle America, a less expensive model and I do not get any bowing.

George

[pat warner]

" 3/4" ply too thick to use? I have a scrap piece of 3/4" that's the perfect size - 15" x 12".
************************************************** *****
Probably a lot of false starts here but well worth the while to make one out of your materials.
That first iteration, working or not, will tell you about all you need to know to make one that does what you want.
This one (http://patwarner.com/images/router-X-cut-jig.jpg) has 5 generations ahead of it.

[Bill Huber]

How was it bowing the sled? I have one from Eagle America, a less expensive model and I do not get any bowing.

George

When I would clamp it down the middle of the sled would bow up, as I said I may have been putting to much pressure on it but I like things clamped so they don't move.

[Rich Engelhardt]

This one (http://patwarner.com/images/router-X-cut-jig.jpg) has 5 generations ahead of it.Wow!
Pat, I'm forever in awe with your abilities to make fixtures.
That sled is simply a thing of beauty.

[Mitch Hrycan]

I just made my first cabinet doors and thought of making a sled. In the end, I just used a clamp to hold the piece to a backer peice to prevent chip out. (you don't need a ton of clamp pressure, just make sure both your rotuing peice and backing piece stay falt on the table) If you do go with a sled, I'd avoid anything that slides in a mitre slot. Have it slide against the fence instead. Otherwise, if you're mitre slot and fence aren't set perfectly aligned, it'll give a bunch of trouble using the mitre slot design.

[Alan Bienlein]

Here is a picture of my coping sled I've been using since 2005. 1/4" plywood for the base with some peel and stick sand paper and a toggle clamp. It just rides along the fence.
255935

[Stephen Cherry]

A famous woodworker once said:
"There are two different types of people in this world, those who cope against the fence, and those who cope using the slot; and I don't talk much to those who cope from the fence."

(just joking- this is from a show I once saw about bbq- the old guy made a character distinction of people who sauce druing and after cooking)

Anyway, that would be a big choice when making a jig. For my shaper I use the slot. It's a simpler jig, and, because the cope cutter uses a center cutter, you can set the fence position based on the cut wood by making a full cut and adjusting the fence to the wood. To cut against the fence, you would need a top part of the jig to contact the fence. With a shaper, for the pattern cut you would generally use an outboard fence and make a full cut.

However, with a router, because the router bits have bearings, I would look for a jig that cuts using the fence. It seems that you would want to use a one piece fence with a hole cut in the center for the cutter, and then use a strait edge on the fence and bearing to set the fence position. THis way you would only need to worry about one thing when setting the fence- that the bearing is in line with the fence. Using a slot guided jig, you would need to line up the fence with the bearing, and also make sure that it is parallel with the slot.

[William C Rogers]

When I made my first set of doors for refacing my kitchen cabinets I was having a hard time doing the stiles. Note I am only making flat panel doors. I bought the Rockler coping seld and it worked quite well. Since this was my first attempt I used a Woodline set that was around $100 for six bits and they were OK. Now I am building my kitchen cabinets for the new house and I am using the Sommerfeld bits. With those bits to take advantage of changing over without resetting everything it is not practical to use a coping sled. I love the way I can change bits back and forth without having to re-calibrate everything. So now I just use a large push block. The key is to make sure it is as square as you can make it. I usually make a couple when aligning my table saw. I haven't had any problems using this method. Maybe just increased skill level. My coping sled will now go to the yard sale items when I get ready to move.

[Joe Scharle]

Actually, I used the scrap block and 2 fisted Armstrong clamp for 40 years up until 6-8 years ago.
Until one day the rail and scrap block flew apart in a blizzard of splinters!
Even though I didn't lose any blood, I've since been content to place a $25.00 sled between me and the cutter.

BTW, using the fence also provides a quick stop block for the rail end.

[Bob Wingard]

I've tried sleds ... both home-made and purchased ... never been happy with any of them ... SOOOO ...

I make my own disposable "hold-downs" as needed ... ... ... made from scraps, usually 1 piece of 3/4" ply for the base .. approx. 5"X10" .. another for the top .. approx. 7"X10". Glue & screw them together such that three sides are flush & square, leaving a cantilevered piece about 2"X10" overhanging the front edge. Glue a chunk of old mouse pad to the underside of the cantilever.

Slide your stock up against the fence ... slip the jig over it and let it square itself up, also against the fence ... press down ... push forward ... DONE !! No bowing .. no twisting .. no dangerous over-extending of the router bit .. built-in zero clearance backup at the end of the cut. Jig can be custom built to suit your stock in just minutes, and can be disposed of without regret as needed. An additional advantage is that, since the cut is enclosed in almost every direction, your dust collection will be very efficient.

[Ray Newman]

Allen Bienlein is on to something with his coping sled.

The sandpaper helps prevents the work from shifting while the clamp is adjusted to hold the work in place.

A few months ago, I bought a pair of Besey Auto-Adjust clamps for a jig. They work, and work well! The clamp self-adjusts for the thickness of the work. This clamp would be the cat’s pajamas for a coping sled.

Besey Auto-Adjust – 2.75” max. work thickness:
www.woodcraft.com/product/2083524/34014/bessey-autoadjust-horizontal-toggle-clamp-high.aspx

Auto-Adjust – 2.0” max. work thickness:
www.woodcraft.com/product/2083524/34013/bessey-autoadjust-horizontal-toggle-clamp-low.aspx

Auto-Adjust in-line toggle clamp:
www.woodcraft.com/product/2083524/34015/bessey-autoadjust-inline-toggle-clamp.aspx

Besides being very economical, another benefit of a shop made jig is that you can easily fabricate a jig for each profile and keep it for reference/later use.

[glenn bradley]

I went shop made and also think 3/4" base material will put you into looking for "special" bit sets or a collet extender. The extender comes with its own problems. I run mine in the slot which does require a single pass method. I can see value in running one against the fence and stepping into the final depth. This one is 1/2" BB ply, no flexing, Incra Miter Slider for the bar and the two clamps hold the blank and the backer simultaneously. I would build an ugly one and take a few runs. this will confirm your preferred handle positions, feature desires and so forth. Once you've got a good feel for it, buy one that meets those needs or build one in an hour or so. Other than getting the miter bar straight (if used) and the stop block perpendicular to the right side, there's not much to them. Simple, useful and pretty inexpensive to buy or build.

[Rich Engelhardt]

Thanks gents!

I believe I may have a solution that will work and allow me to use the 3/4" piece I already have.
After reading a ton of posts here on sleds, a lot of people said what Bill did about having stability problems with too thin a sled.

Since the 3/4" plywood I have is less than 3/4" thick to begin with, I believe I can plow out part of it to form a bed in the sled that will put the rails and stiles down lower.
I can also plow out a rabbet along the edge that rides along the fence.

Since I already have the clamps and materials, all I'm out will be time if it doesn't pan out like I hope.

I guess the first step is to decide on what bits I want.

[Ole Anderson]

I made this sled from a 1/4" aluminum plate and some aluminum scraps and an extra PC drill side handle. works off the miter track. Yes you do need to adjust the fence parallel.

[Mark Burnette]

I already have a Delta coping sled with miter bar. Since it has a steel baseplate would I be asking for trouble (destroyed cutter if something goes haywire) to remove the bar & use it as a free-floating slider? Mine would be shared between the router table & shaper.


@ Ole: What's the half-circle cut-out for near the front of your jig?

[Pat Barry]

I like Bob's method. It is very simple and secure for holding the parts. Toggle clamps just seem like an unnecessary expense after thinking about Bob's idea. My only regret is that I did not think of this myself.

[Alan Bienlein]

Allen Bienlein is on to something with his coping sled.

The sandpaper helps prevents the work from shifting while the clamp is adjusted to hold the work in place.

A few months ago, I bought a pair of Besey Auto-Adjust clamps for a jig. They work, and work well! The clamp self-adjusts for the thickness of the work. This clamp would be the cat’s pajamas for a coping sled.

Besey Auto-Adjust – 2.75” max. work thickness:
www.woodcraft.com/product/2083524/34014/bessey-autoadjust-horizontal-toggle-clamp-high.aspx

Auto-Adjust – 2.0” max. work thickness:
www.woodcraft.com/product/2083524/34013/bessey-autoadjust-horizontal-toggle-clamp-low.aspx

Auto-Adjust in-line toggle clamp:
www.woodcraft.com/product/2083524/34015/bessey-autoadjust-inline-toggle-clamp.aspx

Besides being very economical, another benefit of a shop made jig is that you can easily fabricate a jig for each profile and keep it for reference/later use.

Why thank you Ray.

I don't even worry about the backer board as I always cut my copes first. Any blow out gets taken care of when I run the stick cut. Once that cut is done I then rip the stiles and rails to finished width.

As for the expense of the toggle clamp I think I paid $3 or $4 for it at harbor freight back when I made this jig.

[Ole Anderson]

Ole: What's the half-circle cut-out for near the front of your jig?

That is so I can use the turning handle in the Woodpecker lift to, uh, lift it. Otherwise it was under the plate when I had the test stick lined up with the router bit.

I would be kind of nervous with a steel plate sliding fractions of an inch under my spinning bits. Even aluminum. Wood, Plexiglas, phenolic OK though.