PDA

View Full Version : Epilog Fusion



John J Wang
02-22-2013, 2:57 PM
Are there any information on the Epilog Fusion? How is it different from the Epilog Helix/Legend laser? I saw the borchure but can't figure out how it is different. Thanks.

Mark Sipes
02-22-2013, 3:22 PM
It's our new concept in laser system design, featuring:


32" x 20" engraving area
Our new standard for motion control design
Better flame-polished edge cuts
Our highest engraving and cutting speeds
Large viewing door with LED lighting
Engrave items up to 14.25" in material height



The Helix 24 features a 24" x 18" work area
and a 8.5" z-stroke, for engraving large/tall items


There are 2 big differences table size , Z height and most likely the table lighting/door

Joystick contol on panel, air assist, ethernet capable,

Tim Jasper
02-25-2013, 10:19 AM
Just for full disclosure, I am the distributor for Epilog in WA and OR and have been an awards shop owner in CA since 1995 until selling last Oct. We started with a 25 watt LMI laser and then added an Epilog 75 watt 32EX in 2001 and then a 75 watt EXT in 2007. I try to monitor this forum every once in a while just to keep up with what is going on.

There are a lot of differences between the Fusion and the Helix besides the engraving area. The Fusion may be configured with either a Co2 laser source or a Fiber Laser Source. The Fusion now has a project manager application which can completely control the laser from the computer. You are now able to move the laser head with a mouse along with job completion time based on the settings and engraving area to name a few things. The servo motors have been beefed up and are faster than the Helix at completing the same job without losing quality. The table assembly is able to lift 100lbs. to focus. The "box" has been redesigned to be very strong and weighs in at about 500lbs. The exhaust plate is removable for cleaning. There are easy access panels on all sides. The Joy stick is really cool. It will move the head to wherever you need to on the table. It will also allow you to actually fire the laser with the doors closed using the joy stick. Let’s say you just need to rough cut materials for something, this will allow that without having to send a job from the computer.

I did have the opportunity to use the Co2 Fusion and Fiber Fusion at the ARA show. The smoothness of the cuts on acrylic and wood is unmatched by any Co2 laser out there. The edge of the acrylic was better than anything I have ever seen in my 18 years of being in the laser business. And the speed in completing a job without losing any of the quality is something to look at. In comparing the Helix to the Fusion, using the same 60 watts, completing a job on the Helix took a little over 8 minutes and the Fusion took a little under 7 minutes. This is based on 600 dpi on both and included both raster and vector settings.

This is a short list I came up with, but of course there is a lot more information on the web site.

Tim Jasper

Dan Hintz
02-25-2013, 11:33 AM
And the speed in completing a job without losing any of the quality is something to look at. In comparing the Helix to the Fusion, using the same 60 watts, completing a job on the Helix took a little over 8 minutes and the Fusion took a little under 7 minutes. This is based on 600 dpi on both and included both raster and vector settings.

And what was the reason for the difference in time? Has Epilog increased their drive rate?

Jeff Belany
02-25-2013, 11:53 AM
The easy access panels were mentioned but having a pass through feature will be very useful. I have been asking Epilog if they were ever going top have job control software that will tell you estimate times without running the laser. Now they do in the Fusion. Unfortunately, that ability will not be available for any existing machines I am told. Just FYI -- a 75W Fusion runs about $33M -- but still something to dream about. Maybe I'll be able to get a used one in 5-6 years, if I live that long.

Jeff in northern Wisconsin

Tim Jasper
02-25-2013, 10:16 PM
The speed rate has been increased in vector cutting and the quality is still beyond anything out there.

Tim Jasper

Mike Null
02-25-2013, 10:46 PM
Tim

How do you know the vector quality is better than the Trotec 400? I'll need to see that to believe it.

Gary Whitehair
02-26-2013, 6:38 AM
"A 75W Fusion runs about $33M"

$33M !! Do you mean $33K ?

Dan Hintz
02-26-2013, 7:44 AM
"A 75W Fusion runs about $33M"

$33M !! Do you mean $33K ?

M is often used for 1,000 (particularly in material quantities), but yeah, I threw the same wide-eye look for a second, too.

Mike Null
02-26-2013, 8:07 AM
M comes from Roman numerals and thus would precede K in usage. The use of K is likely associated with "kilo".

Walt Langhans
02-26-2013, 8:42 AM
M is often used for 1,000 (particularly in material quantities), but yeah, I threw the same wide-eye look for a second, too.

When I read that, I went back and re-read it but that time I did it with my best Dr Evil voice inside my head... I crack me up :D

Jeff Belany
02-26-2013, 10:21 AM
Sorry, I was a printer most of my life. 'M' = 1000 and FWIW -- 'K' = 1024 not 1000. So, if the price is 33K it is $33,792.

Jeff in northern Wisconsin

Dan Hintz
02-26-2013, 10:56 AM
and FWIW -- 'K' = 1024 not 1000.

Only when discussing memory... and even then it falls back to 1000 when discussing hard drive space (according to manufacturers).

Rodne Gold
02-26-2013, 11:19 AM
K is for Kilo , 1000 in metric terms .. Kilometer , kilolitre , Kilogram

Bill Cunningham
02-26-2013, 8:07 PM
I guess that makes more sense than 33Black :D

Gary Whitehair
02-27-2013, 7:35 AM
K is for Kilo , 1000 in metric terms .. Kilometer , kilolitre , Kilogram

Hmmm, you are correct except when used with dollars, use only when preceded by dollar sign and one or more numbers; use no space between number and K (e.g., $3K = $3000 or three thousand dollars) as you will note the poster that started all of this, preceded his amount with a dollar sign ($) consequently it would result in $33.000. $33M would result in $33,000,000 US Dollar!

Jeff Belany
02-27-2013, 10:59 AM
"$33M would result in $33,000,000 US Dollar!"

I always thought MM was a million. But after checking Google some say a 'M' with a bar over it is a million and MM is 2000. No definitive answer.

Jeff in northern Wisconsin

Mike Null
02-27-2013, 11:04 AM
Gary

what is your source for this info? It's the first I've heard of it. Hopefully the last.:)

Gary Whitehair
02-27-2013, 11:31 AM
Gary

what is your source for this info? It's the first I've heard of it. Hopefully the last.:)

Mike,

My "source" is my 45 years of experience in operating corporations, finance, mergers & acquisitions. This is standard in business, accounting & finance. But if you need a outside confirmation how about this from Goggle:
Input question to Google: How much is $33M in dollars?
Answer:
33000000 US Dollar

25252524.00 Euro

And I agree, I too hope that this is the end of it. Wow, I never thought that I would create such a issue by asking a clarifying question.

Mike Null
02-27-2013, 11:40 AM
Gary
Thanks. It's not the first time I've heard of $33M refer to millions but didn't regard it as common practice.

Gary Whitehair
02-27-2013, 11:46 AM
Gary
Thanks. It's not the first time I've heard of $33M refer to millions but didn't regard it as common practice.
You are certainly welcome. As I mentioned I was certainly surprised by all of the "dust up" over the clarifying question that I posed. And i would like to thank you for all of the helpful advice that you provide to this Forum, I know that i have found your comments and insights very usefull.

Mark Sipes
02-27-2013, 6:20 PM
I'm sure there is a good joke brewing in this discussion..... A printer, a computer nerd and a money man were tasked to develop a rocket to land on the the planet Mars. Each was tasked to develop parts of a solution to the speed, altitude and targectory of the landing module called "Fusion" The rocket was built, launched, and as we all know crashed upon the planets surface. "I was using meters to calculate distance" said the printer, "Meters! we use feet here in the old US" said the computer guy. "Meters! Feet ! I thought We were trying to figureout the cost of the Mission?" said the money man.


Who know what a nano second is?????? besides my attention to this bickering

I'll give you a hint ..... It equals 11.8 inches


representing how far electricity can travel in one nanosecond (1 billionth (E-9) sec)


and BTW k stands for spring constant or even kelvin with M= Mass

David Rust
02-27-2013, 7:06 PM
You guys crack me up.... It could be $33GC's! (33 Grover Cleveland's)

edit: can't spell

Jesse Anderson
03-04-2013, 1:41 PM
$33m HAs any one took note that it might of been a Typo ??? The M is Pretty Close to the K on a qwerty keyboard.... Ant Onr Knoe whay I mear ???

M= Millions
M= Thousands
M= Mentos
M= Mature Content
M= Mmmmm K ???
M= And anything else starting with a M

I just thought i would throw my 2 cents in. Since we were all getting trivial. Maybe he actually meant $33 dollars in Mentos ? That would be a pretty decent price IMO !

Jesse Anderson
03-06-2013, 10:19 PM
I always thought M stood for Mentos ... $33 Dollars in Mentos... That would be a good buy.

John J Wang
03-19-2013, 9:14 PM
The speed rate has been increased in vector cutting and the quality is still beyond anything out there. Tim JasperHow are they able to improve the vector cutting quality. I am under the impression that when it comes to vector cutting, a chinese laser is just as good as a ULS/Epilog/Trotec. Are there images where we can see the difference? My coworkers all seem to favor Trotec, but I'm a bit biased toward domestically made machines so it's again down to ULS or Epilog.

Dan Hintz
03-20-2013, 6:38 AM
I am under the impression that when it comes to vector cutting, a chinese laser is just as good as a ULS/Epilog/Trotec.

While I cannot speak for the manufacturers themselves, this would be a bad assumption to make. There are multiple reasons for one machine to be better than another (and I'm not mentioning one manufacturer over another or pitting domestic versus Chinese). For example, if you can control the tube's output to a finer degree, you get a better cut... this is almost always the case with metal tubes compared to glass (due to both better QA and design). All things being equal, a better power vs. motion control speed algorithm will show improved results... again, this is typically a nod towards domestic machines due to better algorithm design from in-house R&D rather than copying (literally) what everyone else is doing (though to be fair, I do not think some of the domestic manufacturers get this even CLOSE to correct, and proving it is easy).

Scott Shepherd
03-20-2013, 8:33 AM
How are they able to improve the vector cutting quality. I am under the impression that when it comes to vector cutting, a chinese laser is just as good as a ULS/Epilog/Trotec. Are there images where we can see the difference? My coworkers all seem to favor Trotec, but I'm a bit biased toward domestically made machines so it's again down to ULS or Epilog.

Yes, there is a difference with some. Looks like Epilog and Trotec are both doing it. With Trotec's new job control, it can send bezier curves over instead of how most lasers handle it. The end result is a very smooth cut which is most notable on acrylics. Would you notice the difference on wood? Probably not. Acrylic? Most certainly.

Kim Vellore
03-20-2013, 12:05 PM
Does it mean a servo motor driven system will have better edge compared to stepper driven systems on an acrylic cut?. It will be interesting to see the acrylic edges cut with different machines.

Kim

Scott Shepherd
03-20-2013, 12:19 PM
Does it mean a servo motor driven system will have better edge compared to stepper driven systems on an acrylic cut?. It will be interesting to see the acrylic edges cut with different machines.

Kim

It has nothing to do with servo vs. stepper, it's the method in which the graphic is sent over to the laser. It's essentially sending a much better quality product to the laser, so it can then cut.

If you haven't seen acrylic cut with this technology, you're in for a treat. I can't speak for the Epilog, I've never seen it, but I imagine it's the same type thing Trotec is doing. Trotec calls it "Enhanced Geometry" and you have to change some things in Corel to make it work.

Rodne Gold
03-20-2013, 1:42 PM
Regardless of the tube or laser or motion control , you still stand the chance of getting striated edges as this is also a function of air assist and melt ejection.

http://www.synrad.com/search_apps/application_briefs/3-1.htm

Flame polishing using a Oxygen/Hydrogen torch is way better than any laser output I have seen

Scott Shepherd
03-20-2013, 2:30 PM
Regardless of the tube or laser or motion control , you still stand the chance of getting striated edges as this is also a function of air assist and melt ejection.

http://www.synrad.com/search_apps/application_briefs/3-1.htm

Flame polishing using a Oxygen/Hydrogen torch is way better than any laser output I have seen

Flame polishing also requires a lot more time/effort, which makes the price go up. The quality coming off the Trotec's is as good as any flame polishing I've ever seen or done. It might not match flame polishing in every case/material, but I can tell you from first hand experience, what they are doing is a LONG way ahead of anything else that's been out there in the mainstream.

Scott Shepherd
03-20-2013, 2:35 PM
You might also look at this article from Synrad (noting the previous document was 14 years old, when it said you couldn't do anything great with the edges).

http://www.synrad.com/search_apps/application_briefs/43-1.htm (which is still 11 years old).

Tim Bateson
04-25-2013, 9:08 AM
...Just FYI -- a 75W Fusion runs about $33M*... *($33,000 US)

Jeff, I assume that was the Co2? Can someone message me the price of each? Also the Trotec equivalent.

Anyone else have any experience with the new Epilog Fusion laser(s)? My new workshop is nearly ready and I'm pre-shopping. :D