Delta DJ-20 vs Powermatic 54a?

[Jay Yoder]

Currently there are two Jointers in my vicinity that I have my eye on. Yes, I do realize that the Delta is an 8” and the PM is a 6”. I think both could be had for roughly 800-1000. The Delta is a 1990 model but has been lightly used and the PM is only 4 months old. My natural inclination is to go with the Delta (it also has mobile bas) over the PM based on size/reputation. Any input would be greatly appreciated. As both of these are on CL I appreciate any help you can offer. One concern I have is that I had a local dealer tell me that some of the parts are hard to come by on the older DJ-20’s due to Delta’s ownership changes. Is there any truth to that? Also as they are both used, any particular issues/problems inherent to either of these that I should check for, beyond cut quality and squareness? Thanks all…

[David Kumm]

Besides the longer tables, and additional width I prefer the parallelogram design over tables with the wedge attached. If both are close I would check each with a 6' level. If dovetailed tables are not co planar they are harder to adjust. I'd also check the outfeed table to insure that there are no humps in it with the level and a feeler gauge. Levels aren't perfect but good enough to identify any table issues. Most other stuff can be fixed and there isn't much proprietary stuff on a jointer anyway. Parts would not be a huge consideration as most will be cheaper so source elsewhere. Dave

[Cary Falk]

$800-$1000 for a used 6" jointer is ridiculous in my opinion. Delta parts supply makes me nervous but I bet most parts are interchangable with the Grizzly G0490.

[Jim Foster]

If the PM 54A is nicer than the old Delta DJ15 (which was a very nice jointer) it might easily be worth 600-800 to someone. But for most other 6" jointers, I would agree with you.


$800-$1000 for a used 6" jointer is ridiculous in my opinion. Delta parts supply makes me nervous but I bet most parts are interchangable with the Grizzly G0490.

[glenn bradley]

These things are open to opinion and everyone's got one. A 6" jointer was always just a bit too narrow for most things I wanted to do. An 8" has been wide enough for most things I want to do. You don't necessarily do the things I do :). Parallelogram beds were a must for me when I upgraded as was a helical head but, that's not in the discussion here. The DJ-20 runs a 1-1/2HP motor on the newer models. Other clones of this proven format machine run 2 and 3HP motors but. new motors aren't old motors and the user experience is likely the same.

The prices are quite high for used machines, especially the PM. Powermatic makes nice machines, they just aren't as nice as they think they are IMHO. It didn't take long online to find a few DJ-20's that looked good in the pics for under $800 and that is from a retailer, not a private party. An $800, 6" jointer would need to be darn near new, delivered and have a spiral head to get my attention.

Obviously these responses are based on personal experience in the geographical areas where the responders live. The used market for late model machines out here is pretty well supplied. On the other hand, classic, heavy, American iron hardly ever gets out here. My point is that location, current market and other factors will make your area different than mine, Jim's or Cary's. Take each response with a grain of salt and add it to what you know about pricing of used machines in your area. The used machines you mention however, are near new prices for equivalent machines. I would keep looking.

[Jeff Duncan]

Given they're in the same price range and roughly the same condition I think the 8" is a no brainer. I have the DJ-20 and it's a good solid machine, and unless you drop it or something equally drastic there's not much for parts you would ever need, bearings and belts are both standard off-the-shelf items. In general I would say that $800 is probably a decent price though not great for the Delta. I agree with Cary though on the 6" being over priced. I wouldn't go over $400 or so for a 6" jointer unless it was new in the box....and even then I wouldn't want to spend $800.....but that's just me;)

good luck
JeffD

[Jay Yoder]

Thanks for the great input! The PM has only been used twice and is in new condition. I am thinking 650 max? I had the 6" delta x series and didn't care for it. I like the quick set knives on pm. What price is brazil made dj-20 usually getting in other areas? How difficult to change knives in dj? I have never done it.

[Cary Falk]

I always see DJ-20's listed for about $900. What they sell for, I don't know.

[Paul McGaha]

Jay,

Just my $.02 but I don't think I'd buy either one. I'd spend a little more and get a new Grizzly with a Helical Head.

http://www.grizzly.com/products/8-Jointer-w-Spiral-Cutterhead/G0490X

About half of my shop is Delta (Unisaw, Shaper, Drill Press, Drum Sander). The new Delta seems to be having issues supporting their tools.

As for the Powermatic, I wouldn't go back to a 6" jointer.

Good luck with it.

PHM

[Cary Falk]

Jay,

Just my $.02 but I don't think I'd buy either one. I'd spend a little more and get a new Grizzly with a Helical Head.

http://www.grizzly.com/products/8-Jointer-w-Spiral-Cutterhead/G0490X



That was my initial thought also but that wasn't the question. Happy owner of a Shop Fox W1741 with a Byrd head for about $950.

[David Kumm]

Thanks for the great input! The PM has only been used twice and is in new condition. I am thinking 650 max? I had the 6" delta x series and didn't care for it. I like the quick set knives on pm. What price is brazil made dj-20 usually getting in other areas? How difficult to change knives in dj? I have never done it.

If the machine is in good shape and the tables are flat I would not worry about how much cheaper it can be had for. Tough to find jointers with flat tables anymore. the Invicta stuff was pretty well made and more highly regarded than the later Taiwan stuff so while the cheapest price is nice, good cast iron milled flat and not likely to move anymore is more important. I have no interest in a 6" so it's price would not be relevant to me. Blades on jointers are easy to set- 30-45 minutes is a lot to spend after you have done it a few times. Some like Byrd heads but I've got ESTA on mine and I like them. Once set they change out in about 10 minutes. Dave

[Jeff Duncan]

If your doing this as a hobby working the occasional weekend here and there figure 1/2 hour every couple of years at most to change your knives, as opposed to having 2" of extra width every time you use your jointer:rolleyes:

Prices vary wildly but I think I paid $550 for my DJ20 with the mobile base and extra set of knives included. I called the guy as soon as I saw the CL ad and told him I'd take it at his asking price sight unseen;) I would never presume to tell someone what to spend their money on, so instead I'll just say I can't imagine spending $650 on a used 6" jointer....but again.....that's just me.

JeffD

[Myk Rian]

Before I bought a Griz G1018 8", I had a Jet 6". Fit and finish on the Jet was a heck of a lot nicer than the Griz.
Sold the Jet for $350, and when I got a 1938 Wallace restored, I sold the Griz for $400.
I wouldn't own a new Delta machine, unless it was given to me. Customer Service has been terrible lately. They have ruined a good brand name.

[Gary Herrmann]

Price seems a bit high for both. That said, I'd go for the Delta. I had a 54a, and was very pleased with it, but that is a lot for a used 6" jointer.

[Jim Foster]

The PM is a $1000 machine or more w/shipping on top of that. If it's only 4 months old... how much value has it lost? A negotiation may yeild a better price. I don't disagree with the comments above, and I traded my DJ15 for a DJ20 years ago, but with much of the work I hope to be doing in the future, a 6" jointer would cover most of it. For some reason, I recall liking the compactness of the 6" quite a bit. I'm also ready to trade my jointer and planer in for a combo unit, so I'm tarnished with the idea of minimizing floor space, etc...

[Bob Grier]

Just for a reference point.

I recently bought on Craigs List a 1990 DJ20 Invicta model (parallelogram) with mobile base and 4 sets of knives (1 carbide) for $700. It had been used in a wood shop for a while but was a hobby machine for the last 15 years. There was a little rust and it needed tuneup. It was easy to adjust the table with straight edges and feeler gauges and it was easy to set the knives. Both tables were flat. The electrics had been modified to incorporate a magnetic switch. I am happy with the jointer. Wish I had helical cutters but .... I have a planer with helical cutters so can use it for surfacing difficult wood when necessary. I often see these or the wedge jointers on Craigs for $800 to $900 asking price.

When I buy lumber it is usually wider than 6".

[Jay Yoder]

The PM is a $1000 machine or more w/shipping on top of that. If it's only 4 months old... how much value has it lost? A negotiation may yeild a better price. I don't disagree with the comments above, and I traded my DJ15 for a DJ20 years ago, but with much of the work I hope to be doing in the future, a 6" jointer would cover most of it. For some reason, I recall liking the compactness of the 6" quite a bit. I'm also ready to trade my jointer and planer in for a combo unit, so I'm tarnished with the idea of minimizing floor space, etc...

Jim, that was my initial thought too. Plus the PM has indexing knives, which I figure should speed up replacement? There is no mobile base with it however. I do like the parallelogram features as well as the history of the DJ20. It also has a mobile base which is a must for me. I figure spiral heads can be had for both. I think it comes down to making a "final" joiner purchase. I don't want to go thru this search again. Obviously, nor does the LOML!

[Jay Yoder]

Just for a reference point.

I recently bought on Craigs List a 1990 DJ20 Invicta model (parallelogram) with mobile base and 4 sets of knives (1 carbide) for $700. It had been used in a wood shop for a while but was a hobby machine for the last 15 years. There was a little rust and it needed tuneup. It was easy to adjust the table with straight edges and feeler gauges and it was easy to set the knives. Both tables were flat. The electrics had been modified to incorporate a magnetic switch. I am happy with the jointer. Wish I had helical cutters but .... I have a planer with helical cutters so can use it for surfacing difficult wood when necessary. I often see these or the wedge jointers on Craigs for $800 to $900 asking price.

When I buy lumber it is usually wider than 6".

Bob, that was the price that I had in my mind for the Delta. Only concern is the replacement parts. Alot of people have complained about Delta service recently. I had a 14" Delta bandsaw and they were quite helpful, but that was 4 years ago. I have alot of Jet equipment and love it, and the PM is just a fancy Jet in my mind.