Dilemma: Two Mounting Options for Cast Iron Router Extension Table?

[Danny Thompson]

Experienced advice needed

The Mission:
Install a Bench Dog ProMax Cast Iron Router Extension Table and Triton TRA001 Router into a Jet JTAS-10XL Left-tilt Table Saw with 50" rails and a mobile base. Additional constraint: Stick to the shop half of the garage.

The Dilemma: On which end should the new Cast Iron Router Extension Table go, and how should it be mounted?

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Option 1: To the Left, bolted to the existing cast iron extension wing
The saw is Left Tilt, so the motor protrudes left. This means, the new addition cannot replace the existing extension wing. Instead, it would have to be attached outboard to the extension wing. The Router table would be bolted to the existing extension wing with no rail support, and would require new mounting holes to be drilled in the existing wing.

This option would result in 16" additional tabletop to the left, and allow the existing right-side melamine extension table to remain unchanged. But, due to space constraints would require the entire unit to be pushed against the right-side wall.

Can a factory cast iron extension wing support a cast iron router extension table (In this case a Bench Dog ProMax)?

These two pics show how the motor would interfere with router mounting if the existing wing was removed (unworkable); the approximate placement of the router wing if the existing wing stays.

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These three pics show the mounting point between the TS and the extension wing; the thinner outside wall of the extension wing; and some heavy washers Bench Dog includes to reinforce their mounting.
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Option 2: coming in the next reply due to pic constraints.

[Danny Thompson]

Option 2: To the Far Right, bolted to the fence rail, with an MDF/melamine bridge and leg support
This option requires a mod of the existing bridge (or a new one), new mounting holes in the fence, plus, a means to mount the existing legs to the router table. (I do not have the project time to build a full-blown cabinet at this time.) The only real downside, operationally, is this would leave me about 15 inches to stand between the end of the TS and the wall. Workable, but cozy. Of course, I could stand at the back of the saw (the infeed side of the router fence).

How would you mount the factory extension support legs to the router extension table? I can't stomach the idea of drilling through the router top.

The TS fence tube extends 4-inches beyond the fence rail. Do you see any problem with mounting the router table even with the tube, when attached to the fence rail and supported by legs (likely inboard 4")?

These pics show the router table in rough position on the right and the existing support leg (which is normally screwed to the mdf extension table).
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Here is the underside of the router extension and a leg position option. How would you connect the leg in this position?
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A second leg-mounting option would be to screw it into the J-hook mounting hole. Would that single screw be good enough? Maybe add an angled wooden stretcher that spans both J-holes and screw the legs to it?
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Your advice will be well-received. Any other alternatives you have in mind will be appreciated.

[Paul Incognito]

On my saw, I'd go with replacing the left wing. But my saw is a right tilt General. In your case, I'd probably go with far right, between the fence rails. As for how to mount the legs, I'd probably go with some angles attached to them at the base to keep them square and rigid and not attach them to the top unless there's a way besides drilling through it.
BTW, congrats on the Bench Dog top, I've had my eye on that but it's out of my price range.
Hope this helps,
Paul

[mreza Salav]

I'd put it on the right side but 15" between the TS and the wall is not enough (how would you operate when you are building rails/stiles or are routing across a long piece?)
As for the leg: it doesn't have to be at the far right, you can mount it to the wooden bridge right before the cast iron router table top.
You can also put it under the router table as shown in your 2nd last pic but rotate the leg 90 degree and then tie the two legs together using a wooden piece so that they don't rack.

[Danny Thompson]

You can also put it under the router table as shown in your 2nd last pic but rotate the leg 90 degree and then tie the two legs together using a wooden piece so that they don't rack.

Ah, I see. Right. I could tie the two legs together using the vertical part of the angle, then connect to the top ththrough the J-Screw hole. The key will be to align the legs with the mobile base, below. I'll give it a shot.

A also see your point about the 15". I'll look into bringing it inboard, a bit.

[Danny Thompson]

BTW, congrats on the Bench Dog top, I've had my eye on that but it's out of my price range.
Hope this helps,
Paul

Thanks! Yeah, The BD was a bit of a treat. I parlayed my birthday with a promise to free up enough garage space for at least one car. When I started looking at aftermarket router fences (commonly $200 or more), and router plates ($50-100), the BD at $350 - 20% ($270) at Rockler seemed like an easy choice. With Router Lifts $170 to $250, a used Triton felt perfect. Oh, and I sold off a few items.

This will be my first "real" router table. I can't wait to get it up and running.

BTW, I picked up some angle, and will see what I can do with it, tomorrow.

[John Piwaron]

My 2 cents - I'd make a new right side extension table and bolt the router table top to it. The combined width being equal to the existing extension table. In fact, I've done just that twice. Not for a router table but simply to have an extension table. That was for two different saws.

[johnny means]

Option 3
Make a separate router table. This would give you more flexibility with your space usage. Your saw is already a space hog, it needn't be any bigger. If you wanted a larger table you could always use a standard extension wing.

[Jeff Heath]

Option 3
Make a separate router table. This would give you more flexibility with your space usage. Your saw is already a space hog, it needn't be any bigger. If you wanted a larger table you could always use a standard extension wing.

You will come to learn that this option is, by far, the best. I spent the beginning 10 years of my woodworking business working out of my garage, and I can tell with heartfelt earnest that making the largest spacehog in the shop even larger is a mistake. Also, you will have instances where you will want to use the router table for longer mouldings, and having the ability to move it by itself out to the middle of your space will be high on the list of desirability.

Adding it to your existing saw configuration will only have it be in the way, and table saw fences make lousy router fences, anyway.

Jeff

[johnny means]

BTW, the CI BD tops make for a great stand alone machine. I'm really pleased with mine.

[glenn bradley]

This is a Ford vs Chevy, Left-tilt vs Right-tilt sort of argument. I would do what works best for you. No, wait . . . I would recommend that you do what works best for you. I would put it on the left side as putting it on the right makes no sense to me. Why reverse feed direction when you already have your tablesaw feed direction decided? Also, I would not want a wall at my back while I am using the router table BUT, I probably don't do what you do nor make what you make. Plus, we all have to make concessions to fit what we want in the space that we have ;-) Do what you feel works best for you.

[Carl Beckett]

It's only my preference, but I like the shorter fence. Had a 50" fence only one time, and just prefer the space I get from a shorter one (currently a 26" fence). As noted, a 26" fence and a separate router table still fits inside the foot print of a 50" extension table.

I would give myself more room in your situation. Rebuild the extension to include the router at the same length, or shorten your fence rails and add the router table, making the combined less than your current footprint.

[David Helm]

Why not Option 3? Bolt the router top extension to the saw on the right. You get more room and only have to make one cut on the melamine extension. You will still have all the right side extension space you need for cutting plywood etc.

[Danny Thompson]

Interesting options, all.

I am on the path to Option 2: the Far Right. I've solved the leg angle/racking issue and, for reasons that will become obvious, the end result will be 1" wider right than the existing table. I am leaving the existing extension table intact in case I change my mind. So keep those suggestions coming.

On the free-standing, mobile router table front. I can see how that would be a benefit. The truth is, I am moving from a separate router table, albeit a low quality one, because I need to reclaim some space and, with my new layout, there is no remaining wallspace and no remaining floorspace except on the infeed side of my TS. I am reserving that space for a woodworkers bench (thinking a smaller Ruobo, maybe 24" x 60", at this point.)

[Danny Thompson]

First, thanks for the various option 3's proposed. Ultimately, I didn't have the courage the shorten my rails; so the separate router table was out. The good news is, I can keep that option in my hip pocket for when I'm ready to build a nice cabinet (Sweet cabinet, Johnny!)

Incorporated into the solution were a bunch of your great ideas:


Angle added to prevent racking.
Stock feed direction the same as the TS enabled.
Dedicated router fence that stores out of the way when not in use.
As much space as possible preserved at the end of the table
Laminated bridge added (original saved, just in case)


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There were two significant challenges (read "hours of frustration and work") in the process: the legs and the alignment holes in the fence.

The Legs:
Mreza's feedback about racking and tying the legs together fed an idea to marry the attachment points of the two legs with a matching bit of angle, then tying the whole unit to the top using the J-hook connector. Not being a metal worker, this would be its own adventure. A quick check confirmed this arrangement would not interfere with the router, so the game was afoot. A 2"x2"x48" aluminum angle was procured from Lowes, cut to length with an angle grinder (just under 27", the depth of the TS/width of the BD), holes aligned with the J-hook holes in the legs, and drilled out on the drill press.

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All was well, except, as you can see, the J-hook was a bit too long to spin past the leg. A little more grinder work and, since I had a can of black Rustoleum in the cabinet, paint job, later, and all was well. The J-hooks are shorter, but long enough to serve their intended purpose--i.e., hang the fence, out of the way, when not in use.

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On to the alignment holes . . .

[Danny Thompson]

This took many hours. Aligning 3 independent tables proved to be a bear, particularly because of the immediate sag that resulted by temporarily disconnecting the legs. Lessons learned along the way, but the steps below were what worked.

Eight mounting holes were needed in the fence to mount the laminate extension table and router table. One pair of existing holes worked; six new ones had to be drilled. The existing holes and those in the Bench Dog were all centered at 1 1/8" below the tabletop height, which meant all of the mounting-holes in the rail could be aligned. So, I ran a pencil line down the rail based on the center of the first hole. Predrilled predrilled 5/16" holes, 1 1/8" down from the top and the same distance from each end of the laminate top as the holes in the previous extension. I transferred the span between the holes to the fence rail, and got to drilling. Normal drill bits did nothing, so a quick trip to Lowes and $20 later, Titanium bits did the trick. To help prevent the drill-bit boogie, I started small and progressed to 5/16". This required a lot of patience. Drilling went slowly.

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The laminate extension table went right in, no trouble, with 1/4" - 20 bolts, lock washers, and nuts (Bolts allowed a greater range of alignment than countersunk screws.) LESSON LEARNED: Take the time to align the laminate table to the TS top, now, before you mount the router table. Why? Sag.

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Then, I transferred the spacing for the router table mounting holes to the rail, using the laminate extension as the starting point, and drilled again. Given the tighter tolerance on the router table mounting holes (1/4"), the matching holes in the fence rail had to be bigger (3/8) to allow the necessary level of adjustability. The sag created by mounting the router table made alignment across the entire table difficult. What worked was to to make sure the joint between the laminate table and the router table was level and smooth and not worry about alignment with the TS top, yet.

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Attaching the legs brought everthing into rough alignment. Only slight misalignment remained. An extra set of hands made all the difference in the world during the final adjustment. A 4' carpenter's level got us 99.5% there. A small wooden block rubbed back and forthe across the seams took us the rest of the way. My assistant slid the block around while I shifted tables and tightened the bolts. It took 3 passes across all 8 bolts to eliminate the gaps and snags.

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[Jamie Lynch]

I liked th idea of adding it to the left wing. I wonder if any other creekers have done it already.
What you ended up with looks great.

[Peter Hawser]

You have to go on the left, you just have to. Otherwise you will create a feed direction imbalance in the universe which will increase the level of entropy contributing to space time instability. Do you really want that on your head?

[Danny Thompson]

There is no hole provided in the plate for the above-table height adustment lever. This must be drilled out by you, the end user. Don't drill this hole until you check the plate for flatness. The plate that came with the order is NOT FLAT. It crowns in the middle, so it cannot be mounted flush with the table top. I've opened an issue with Rockler. We'll see.

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[thomas d evans]

sounds like a good job, Danny. Enjoy it.

peace, T

[Danny Thompson]

You have to go on the left, you just have to. Otherwise you will create a feed direction imbalance in the universe which will increase the level of entropy contributing to space time instability. Do you really want that on your head?

Not so with the Bench Dog . . . Notice it has a second set of T-slots for the fence, which enable you to put the fence outboard of the bit, thereby making the infeed side for the router align cosmically with the infeed for the TS. It's like the BD guys called up Stephen Hawking and incorporated a Grand Unification Theory into their design!

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[Peter Hawser]

Not so with the Bench Dog . . . Notice it has a second set of T-slots for the fence, which enable you to put the fence outboard of the bit, thereby making the infeed side for the router align cosmically with the infeed for the TS. It's like the BD guys called up Stephen Hawking and incorporated a Grand Unification Theory into their design!

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Ah Danny my humor is a bit weird. I have this table and on the right and I love it. This topic, like so many others, seems to inspire absurd debates on the minuscule advantages or disadvantages of this or that leading to endless vascilatng by the poor op who is suddenly faced with the most critical decision of his life. For me the main advantage of the right side is unless I am cutting something wider than 20" I can use both my table saw and router table without disrupting either fence or set up. I wish I could come up with something witty to your hawking comment - funny!

[Mike Ruggeri]

Danny,

I made a very similar setup with my cast iron router table. First in the right extension, exactly like your new setup. I then built a cabinet for it while still in the tablesaw extension. Finally I separated the cabinet from the tablesaw setup so as to have a stand alone table like Johnny's. My favorite was the second verson with the cabinet attached to the tablesaw (picture your setup with a Norm type router table cabinet under the cast iron piece). I had to move to a stand-alone cabinet when I sold my Unisaw. Just to give you some ideas here are some pictures (not the best quality as these were ones I just happen to have on my computer).

Mike

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[mreza Salav]

Looks great Danny!

[Scott T Smith]

Danny, I did something similar to mine, and like you I chose "option 2". In my case, instead of extending the existing table further to the right, I simply incorporated the router into it.

The nice thing about this is that unless I'm breaking down wide sheet goods, I can have the router table and the tablesaw both functional at the same time.

[Danny Thompson]

[The router plate] crowns in the middle, so it cannot be mounted flush with the table top. I've opened an issue with Rockler. We'll see.


Progress report: Rockler just called (<24 hours later) and is going to send a replacement plate. Fingers crossed.

[Curt Harms]

It's only my preference, but I like the shorter fence. Had a 50" fence only one time, and just prefer the space I get from a shorter one (currently a 26" fence). As noted, a 26" fence and a separate router table still fits inside the foot print of a 50" extension table.

I would give myself more room in your situation. Rebuild the extension to include the router at the same length, or shorten your fence rails and add the router table, making the combined less than your current footprint.

That's me, too. Particularly with the advent of track saws for cutting large panels. I have a router plate on the right side of a Grizzly 1023 saw, the fence is 27" to the right, 15" to the left. I started out using the T.S. fence with an attachment as the router table fence but found I preferred separate fences. I was fortunate that the motor cover is low enough to permit the router to sit over the motor cover. I also built my own router fence that fastens to the T.S. fence rail on one end and and a clamp on the other end. I can have the T.S. fence and router fence both in position. I can rip about 12" with the router fence in working position.

[John Coloccia]

It's strange seeing my Triton sitting in a different shop. It's like running into an old girlfriend while she's making out with some other guy. LOL :D

[Carl Beckett]

It's strange seeing my Triton sitting in a different shop. It's like running into an old girlfriend while she's making out with some other guy. LOL :D


Ummm..... no, its not really anything like that.

[Danny Thompson]

Ummm..... no, its not really anything like that.

At least he didn't say "mounted".

[jim vancampen]

It's strange seeing my Triton sitting in a different shop. It's like running into an old girlfriend while she's making out with some other guy. LOL :D

Carl, you play a good straight man. I laughed even harder.
lol:D