Advice for beginner?

[Eric Goosman]

A good friend has had me over to do some basic woodworking with him in his well outfitted shop recently. We've made some end grain cutting boards, 3 keepsake/jewelry boxes, and are now making me a plywood workbench from a plan in FWW mag. Needless to say, i am hooked and would like to start learning more & doing some work at my house. The problem is that i have a smallish 2 car garage and the wife gets 1 side for her car (we live in Alaska). I have basic tools-drills, small Dewalt CMS, sander, etc, but trying to figure put where to put $ nex that will allow me to start doing full projects at home. I want to use a combo of hand and power tools, mainly d/t space and the need for good dust control. I can spend about $2,000-2,500 now. I would like to eventually make larger furniture, but want to start out making boxes and small pieces. On a personal note, i won't buy a table saw until i have the space and $ for a Sawstop. I work in the operating room and have seen lots of table saw injuries, so it's just my personal preference. Any advice is much appreciated. Sorry for the long post.

Eric

[Bill ThompsonNM]

Consider a bandsaw and a bunch of tools from the Neander side. Planes, saws and start with a workbench.

[Mike Heidrick]

Do you have a circular saw? Maybe a tracksaw might be a good investment for you and maybe a decent bandsaw. Those would give you pretty safe powered cuts and both can work well in a small shop space. Festool and dewalt tracksaws get good reviews - dewalt being a bit cheaper and festool having a system behind them but they are pricey. In a few weeks we will have reviews on Grizzly's tracksaw too.

Also Grizzly sells some fine bandsaws. Maybe start out of the gate with a G0513 17" bandsaw for about a grand and go through all the upgrade paths on a common 14" saw. You can use them both to build a bench.

Be careful with the bandsaw and tracksaw as they can hurt you too but you should be in good shape with them.

Add some clamps - maybe a few pipe clamps or even two 24" and two 40' parallel clamps like bessey K bodies or Jorgensen cabinet masters or Jet parallel clamps. evn a couple sets of those would be a great start to a clamp collection.

Add in a router as well - a dual base setup can give you a plunge base for above table work and a fixed base you can leave in a subt table for your bench. Bosch 1617EVSPK is a solid router setup. I like the Dewalt 618 combo setup too but sometimes the VS magnetic disc breaks and a hassle to change them.

Buy router bits from brian at Holbren dot come - he gives a woodnet discount. Buy the bits you need by the project. Good set - 1/8 3/8 1/4 round overs, some oggee and classical edge bits, a rabbet bit set, a flush trim bit or two, and a 1/8, 1/4 and 1.2" spiral straight bit is a good place to start.

Get a good ROS sander too - Festool 150/3 is pricey but the last one first - or get a porter cable 390K.

Get a starrett 12" combo square and a decent dial caliper. You will learn to use them all the time.

Veritas or Lie Nielson block plane and low angle jack. Awesome way to start any plane collection.

Eventually we will talk about portable planer and maybe jointer.

[Cary Falk]

I am in a simiilar garage situation. Put everything on wheels.
http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q297/caryincamas/DSC_0282.jpg

http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q297/caryincamas/DSC_0283.jpg

[Sam Murdoch]

Consider a bandsaw and a bunch of tools from the Neander side. Planes, saws and start with a workbench.

Eric - for the kind of projects you are intending Bill is giving excellent advice. Lots of support here in The Creek and I think importantly, learning handwork and how to care for your basic tools is a wonderful and satisfying entry to woodworking. Machinery is great but your hands are your most important tools. Anything you learn by way of hand tool work will serve you very well in the future as you have room and $$$s for stationary equipment you will still be able to make things if the power goes out :rolleyes:.

[Lornie McCullough]

Cary..... wow.... that is compact!!

Lornie

[Keith Weber]

I think that you should educate your wife that parking her car in a garage in the winter will be hard on it. If you park outside everyday in -20C, the salty sludge that packs in every nook and cranny under your vehicle won't rust anything too quickly. But, park in a warm garage every night, all that sludge melts. It'll rust out your vehicle at a much faster rate, and make a mess of the garage. The humidity and moisture in the garage from the repeated door openings and melting snow and salt on the garage floor will also rust out your tools. I only park in the garage if I fly out of town for more than a couple weeks.

To make the education work better, it's probably a good idea to offer to clean the snow off her car whenever it needs it. Anyway... good luck! I managed to convince the pretty one that garages weren't for parking before it got started. I'm sure that if she's become accustomed to it, it'd be like trying to take a chew toy away from a pitbull!

[Clay Fails]

I agree with the bandsaw suggestion. You can make a lot of different kinds of cuts, safely, with the bandsaw. And a good used one should not set you back too much $. Get an assortment of good blades. Work your way in to this....

[Danny Thompson]

What I use most (outside of my TS):

Equipment: Grinder, Drill Press, Random Orbit Sander, Planer, Band Saw, Plunge Router
Handtools: block plane, sharpening system (sandpaper, stones, whatever; maybe a honing guide), crosscut saw (dozuki), card scraper, chisels, marking knife, awl, combination square, jack plane, and clamps, clamps, clamps

Some wood that excites you.

Enjoy.

[Eric Goosman]

Thanks for all of the great advice, esp Mike for taking the time to go in to so much detail. Keith, if I were to try and "educate" my wife to parking outside, she would cram the few tools that I do have into a much smaller and painful space. Yeah, I've been leaning toward a low-angle block plane and chisels for hand tools. My wife also bought me Lee Valley dovetail and crosscut saws for Christmas. I like the Festool dust control for their tols, but I think I might get more use nitially from a bandsaw than a tracksaw. But, the problem is that I just don't know. Now, i will look at some bandsaw reviews to see what i need. Thanks for all the advice.

Eric

[john lawson]

First, do an honest assessment of what kind of work habits you have, are you someone who can work in a very confined space or do you need to spread out? Next, are you neat, organized, and disciplined, or are you sloppy, unorganized, and undisciplined. (Though I am reasonably intelligent I tend toward the latter). The reason I ask is that this needs to be a part of your plan of organization.

If you are organized and disciplined you can have a portable shop that you "roll out" when you use it. If not, you need to have your machines in one place so you can leave them there. If you can have one bay of a two car garage, and you have space for wood storage you can have a functioning shop in a small space. If you are like most woodworkers and start to acquire tools you will soon be "tool bound" and will find you can't move around or work efficiently.

This final thought should guide your tool purchases. A Sawstop, a planer/jointer , a radial arm saw or scms, and a bandsaw are all you need other than routers and hand tools. Most of your hand tools can fit in a workbench or assembly table.

Do a layout and make a commitment to put no more tools in there than you allow for at least a year.

I am fortunate to have a large shop, and though I am fairly productive I find my biggest fault is laying out my shop inefficiently and not having a strong discipline to make it more efficient.

Of course, I've always believed that most woodworkers are A.D.D. so add this to the mix are we are somewhat prone to this malady.

My $.02

[Jim Matthews]

Before purchasing any power tool, look for a co-op shop in your area.

A little driving and membership costs can be considerably cheaper than buying lotsa "ARN".
You'll also be able to park your car in the garage - as God intended.

I highly recommend Jim Tolpin's "The New Traditional woodworker", it will point out how you can do
nearly everything with tools that will fit neatly into drawers when not in use.

I would say that the bandsaw is my most useful power tool.
After than, a circular saw on a track comes a distant second.

I buy my lumber nearly to the dimension required - no jointer or planer needed, I get to final thickness by hand.

[Joe Angrisani]

Hey Eric. Welcome!

Couple of questions. You talk about spending a certain amount "now". Do you have a feel for what you want to spend all-in-all? You got some great advice above, but some are being pretty free with your money. What's the big budget?

I'm with Bill, basically. And with your initial budget numbers, maybe a bandsaw from Grizzly's 14" 555-family would suit you adequately.

Where in Alaska? If you're in the Anchorage area, I'd think used tools. They're a great option.

[Eric Goosman]

Hey John, I am pretty organized and the garage space is all I can do right now. I am in the military and will be moving back to the lower 48 in June 2014, so my workshop space will change. Jim, we have a woorshop on thebmilitary base, but the hours don't mesh with my work/family hours. It sounds like the bandsaw is probably the "large" purchase that i will start out with. We don't have a lot of specialty stores here and i do try to look at CL frequently for used options. Joe, I want to make an initial investment that will allow me to do some projects. My budget can increase when i have space and am having some success. If i need to, i can go to my friends house and use his planer to help get the wood to proper thickness. Thanks again for all who have taken the time to respond with great advice.

Eric

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Of course, I've always believed that most woodworkers are A.D.D. so add this to the mix are we are somewhat prone to this malady.

My $.02

Good point John!!

Supports the point that there isn't just one way to do something correctly too. Just because one guy needs certain tools to enjoy the hobby, don't fall into the trap thinking that you do too. There is no one perfect path to happiness in a woodshop, and after all, that should be what we are all striving for. Some of us just enjoy setting up or shops with any tool that strikes our fancy, even though we could actually be more productive with less tools.

Welcome to the hobby!

BTW, maybe look at the Hammer bandsaws, if you want new, they look very good to me.

[Jim Foster]

Depending on the kind of work you want to do, you may be able to do without a table-saw for a good, long time, especially if you can get support at your friends shop when necessary. I think one way to start is to select a project and look at the tools you need/want for that project and if possible use your friends table-saw, jointer and thickness planer for the rough work, and acquire the tools needed for the joinery and finish work.

One other thing to consider, many power tools end up have large hidden costs in terms of tooling, dust collection and safety devices, so things you can learn to do by hand may save in more ways than one. I'm dreaming of the day I get rid of my routers and router table and just use molding planes, etc...

Also I think the planer/jointer combo machines and a good idea for space saving.

[Adam Cormier]

+1 on this great advice! If you can win that argument, you will double your work space!!! I won it with mine 2 years ago and am loving the space! I go out and make sure the driveway is clear of snow and so is her car (or windows scraped) in the winter to keep her happy though :)


I think that you should educate your wife that parking her car in a garage in the winter will be hard on it. If you park outside everyday in -20C, the salty sludge that packs in every nook and cranny under your vehicle won't rust anything too quickly. But, park in a warm garage every night, all that sludge melts. It'll rust out your vehicle at a much faster rate, and make a mess of the garage. The humidity and moisture in the garage from the repeated door openings and melting snow and salt on the garage floor will also rust out your tools. I only park in the garage if I fly out of town for more than a couple weeks.

To make the education work better, it's probably a good idea to offer to clean the snow off her car whenever it needs it. Anyway... good luck! I managed to convince the pretty one that garages weren't for parking before it got started. I'm sure that if she's become accustomed to it, it'd be like trying to take a chew toy away from a pitbull!

[paul cottingham]

If I had bought a good bandsaw when I was startling out, I probably wouldn't use my table saw at all. Safer, more versatile, etc. that's where I would start, saves the drudgery of the dreaded long rips by hand. That plus a good cross-cut handsaw, or mitre saw and you are set.

[Bobby O'Neal]

The first thing that comes to mind is that I wouldn't spend the entire budget. Keep some (maybe $500) aside for the unknowns. Right now it's unknown what your work preferences will be on your own, in your own space.

For that matter, if I were in your shoes (and mine are similar actually) I'd buy a decent 14" bandsaw and if I found out later that I was really a bandsaw guy, I'd add a bigger one. Then I'd buy things as needed. Do everything that your bandsaw and other tools you currently have will allow you to do. If you hit a wall created by the lack of a tool and you know that its a tool you will get repeated use from (or enough use to warrant a purchase) go get it. That could likely be a router to help with joinery or hand planes for milling.

Do what you can with what you have until it just won't work, safety first. And from your description of your situation, I'd look seriously at hand tools for a lot of operations paired with a bandsaw. Rip rough on a bandsaw and refine it with a jointer plane. Cut tenons on a bandsaw and clean them with a shoulder plane, rabbeting block plane or router plane.

Avoid one trick pony tools. If you can't see multiple operations from a tool, it may be for later.

Good luck and welcome to the Creek.

[Eric Goosman]

Any particular Grizzly bandsaw people prefer (110v)? They seem pretty reasonably priced and I think a 14" saw is a good place to start.

[Jim Neeley]

Eric,

Where in Alaska do you live? If you live in or around Anchorage I'd be glad to give you a shop tour and can share some advice. My shop is fairly well equipped with both hand and power tools. You might get some ideas. Feel free to PM me.

In any event I suggest filling out your location in your profile. If not Anchorage, you may find someone else local willing and able to assist.

Jim

[Myk Rian]

I put the table saw toward the door. That way I can have long cuts going out it. About 15 ft of room in front of it.
I also have a 2 car (w/wife car) garage. I make do pretty well.
Have a pic or 2 someplace I can update with later.

[Carl Beckett]

I'm a fan of not buying all at once. Pick a project, buy what you want to use for that project, and then repeat on the next one.

It sounds like you can get some of your larger equipment needs filled in other ways.

Don't under estimate the value of having some space to do the actual work in! Big piles of equipment are not that useful if it's a shell game every time you need to plug one in (DAMHIKT), or if there isn't enough space left to assemble or do the real woodworking.