The Woodworking Shows - any experiences?

[Rich Riddle]

Have any of you ever attended the Woodworking Shows?

Here is the link: twws-test.businesscatalyst.com/attendees/seminars.htm

My father and I attended the woodworking expo in November located in Covington, Kentucky and found it to be a major disappointment in terms of the classes and retailers. It was also very expensive. One presenter spent nearly an hour discussing how to stand and hold one's arm to act in harmony with the wood. Another one talked for ninety minutes about glue choices instead of providing a simple handout to read.

I am hoping not to duplicate that endeavor but see the cost of these shows is only $10, not $200. Any experiences with these shows?

Thanks

[Walter Plummer]

It has gone way downhill the last few years. I have been dissappointed the last two times I went. Now that it has moved south an hour drive I doubt I will go again.

[Jim O'Dell]

Unfortunately, there was a decline in attendance which caused a decline in vendors, which magnified the loss of attendees, etc, etc. I enjoyed the first 2 shows I went to 9 years ago. The third one was a waste of time. Probably because I had my core group of products and there just wasn't much new for me. The free classes I went to were informative. Kelly Meyer, and other's names I don't remember right now, were good presenters without pushing a specific brand. There were a few deals on small stuff, T-track and the like. But not great deals on the bigger equipment. If there is something specific you want to see and you know it will be there, then it is worth the trip. I don't think they even came to the DFW metroplex last year. Jim.

[Lee Schierer]

I haven't been in a number of years. They used to be okay, but the sows have gotten smaller in most areas. If you are looking for equipment, make sure you know what it normally sells for in your area. Sometimes you can get good deals on the demo units as they don't want to take them home or try to sell them later as used equipment. Don't be afraid to haggle over the price on major purchases, particularly if you can quote local store prices for the same item.

[Gary Hodgin]

I live close to Nashville, TN. We haven't had a show in about 10 years. Prior to that we had a show about every year for 3 or 4 years. The last two had very poor attendance. Someone should have informed them that college football season is not the time to have a woodworking show, at least not back then when the Vols won a few.

I attended a couple of seminars. They weren't very expensive and some were very good. Frank Klausz was certainly worth the money. I'm not familiar with any of the participants in the linked seminars except for Paul Sellers. I certainly would pay $10 for that seminar.

[Rich Riddle]

My father lives in Kansas City where the organizers scheduled one show, but Roland Johnson will be at the conference in Indianapolis discussing topics that hold an interest. It's a short day trip to Indianapolis as well instead of the expense of traveling to Kansas City. It's worth $10 to hear Roland talk; he gave some excellent advice when talking in North Carolina.

The show I attended in North Carolina in April and the expo in Covington neither had any stationary tool companies represented there. As a matter of fact, at the expo it appeared to be geared nearly exclusively to hand tools only, including the work shops. This show indicates Delta will be there and has more than one small powered hand tool manufacturer present.

Regarding the declining attendance, do you Creekers think it's because we are an aging population and fewer younger people take up the hobby? Or has the Internet and websites offered videos and deals with which shows cannot compete for convenience and price?

[David Weaver]

I think it's probably:
* convenience of the internet for information
* convenience of the internet for finding the lowest price shopping

The only show I've been to is IWF - more of a social trip than a real need. I did get (or ordered) some LV stuff there, and an asturo spray gun that turned out to be cheaper online a month later. Could've skipped it all.

I think I'd see them as entertainment or social gatherings at this point, there's no dearth of information available elsewhere for less, and there's a great chance to hear interesting information at them that you'll forget by the time you use it.

[Rich Riddle]

I think it's probably:
* convenience of the internet for information
* convenience of the internet for finding the lowest price shopping

The only show I've been to is IWF - more of a social trip than a real need. I did get (or ordered) some LV stuff there, and an asturo spray gun that turned out to be cheaper online a month later. Could've skipped it all.

I think I'd see them as entertainment or social gatherings at this point, there's no dearth of information available elsewhere for less, and there's a great chance to hear interesting information at them that you'll forget by the time you use it.I plan on attending the IWF in 2014. Wasn't it in Atlanta in August this year?

[David Weaver]

I don't know, it was about that in '08, which is when I went (and in atlanta). I don't know if you do work for pay, but if you don't, make up a business name for your tag and make yourself out to be a commercial customer.

Some of the booths there gave us the time of day (fuhr, micromesh, felder, martin, minimax, and of course LV come to mind), but at a lot of the sales reps at other booths avoided us because my tag said "none" for company.

My buddy was extremely interested in a timesavers WB sander, but the sales guy literally disappeared mid pitch and went to a different customer - said he had a call or something and immediately went to a different customer. Bizarre, and probably cost them a sale. At a hardware booth, there was no commercial customer in sight, no customer at all, and same buddy asked the sales guy about a couple of the types of hardware and when he figured out it was just a general question for one kitchen - same thing - he disappeared with a bizarre excuse.

The martin, minimax and felder guys were all excellent, though, especially the martin guys.

[Thomas Bittner]

I am going to the Eastern States Expo in West Springfield on Jan 11-13 for the woodworking show. I have been going for three years in a row now.
Speakers Jim Heavey from WWM, Roland Johnson FWW, along with a couple of other speakers will be there.
Here in the East the shows are well attended in fact its hard to move sround at times. you can pick up all kinds of speciality woods, get your hands on Veritas Tools all kinds of tools are there with a bargin area of various hand tools. I always learn something, last year I got to play with "cold bend wood" and saw a neat bandsaw tune up demonstration. These have been very well attended and I am looking forward to going. I usually pick up small items from Peachtree supply and avoid shipping costs. Is this the same outfit running the shows where you guys are?

[Greg Portland]

Have any of you ever attended the Woodworking Shows?

Here is the link: twws-test.businesscatalyst.com/attendees/seminars.htm

My father and I attended the woodworking expo in November located in Covington, Kentucky and found it to be a major disappointment in terms of the classes and retailers. It was also very expensive. One presenter spent nearly an hour discussing how to stand and hold one's arm to act in harmony with the wood. Another one talked for ninety minutes about glue choices instead of providing a simple handout to read.

I am hoping not to duplicate that endeavor but see the cost of these shows is only $10, not $200. Any experiences with these shows?

ThanksI've only ever paid $5-$10 to get into these shows. The paid classes and/or seminars were more expensive than the same class taught by the same instructor elsewhere (TWS gets a cut). If you're going to a show, go to IWS. TWS is OK if you're looking for show discounts on specific items. Not all vendors have show discounts.

[Jim Stewart]

I went to the WOA show in Cincinnati for the last three years. The first year it was fantastic. Many handtool vendors that I had never talked to before. The show has had more of the carnival junk the last three years. I was hoping to talk with Matt Bickford and Larry Clark this year but neither were there. I also noticed that Tools for Working Wood did not show last year. The SAPFM was also absent. LV and LN were there I still learn from them. LV had 10% off and free shipping. I may go to the Amana Iowa show this Spring.

[Rich Riddle]

I went to the WOA show in Cincinnati for the last three years. The first year it was fantastic. Many handtool vendors that I had never talked to before. The show has had more of the carnival junk the last three years. I was hoping to talk with Matt Bickford and Larry Clark this year but neither were there. I also noticed that Tools for Working Wood did not show last year. The SAPFM was also absent. LV and LN were there I still learn from them. LV had 10% off and free shipping. I may go to the Amana Iowa show this Spring.I was at the WOA show in Covington with my father. The classes were expensive ($195 for the day) and not very good. I heard Roland speak at another show a while back. He was good so it's worth the drive to Indianapolis to hear him again. I will skip the WOA show next year, and I live in Covington.

[Steven Hsieh]

IWF and woodworking in america are the good shows left.

[Jim Underwood]

IWF was in Atlanta last August. It was better than the previous show by quite a bit, but it's not back to it's usual splendor. The economy and the woodworking industry just isn't going to come roaring back I'm afraid. It's too tied to the housing market, and we all know how that is - or at least anyone who has been paying the slightest bit of attention should.

As for the Woodworking show, the last one in Atlanta was also better than the previous one. I think they are trying to bring it back up to snuff and attract more vendors. We'll see how it is this year. I know I thoroughly enjoyed my time helping out in the Craft Supplies USA booth. I was tired at the end of that shift though... I'd go to this show just for the free classes. I think many of them are well worth it.

I sure wouldn't pay a bunch of money to attend one of these things. Even the IWF is pretty inexpensive if you register early enough. I don't think we've ever paid more than $10-15 for entry...

[Rich Riddle]

Thanks for all the replies. I shall never again attend a show that excludes the use of power tools like the one in Covington did. I see some classes in the upcoming shows centered on power tools.

[Eduard Nemirovsky]

Just come back from woodworking show. I am going every year for last 6-7 years. Probably it will be my last show (if it not improve drastically).It was four-five booths with not ww related stuff - basement repair, gutter cleaning, insulation, different glues, cutters and first time - booth with old ww tools but only junk quality.
Talk to Jesse from Felder group. Nice guy, good info - I may sell my SS with slider and will buy K3. I LOVE THIS SAW!!!:eek::eek:

In general - poor attendance and representation from the companies. Three big stands with Makita, Bosch and DW, but when my friend asked if they have a slider saw - blunt faces and answer - we don't have it. My friend point to the box with it - O yes, I forget.:confused::confused:
Festool stand with a few boxes, did not have sandpapers.
Classes - mostly for turners, I am not ( luckily :eek:) in this group of ww's.
One of the dealer was talking about improvement in ww show in the near future - company did change the owners and it may change a lot. Will see. I really would like to see improvement.

[Rich Riddle]

Just come back from woodworking show. I am going every year for last 6-7 years. Probably it will be my last show (if it not improve drastically).It was four-five booths with not ww related stuff - basement repair, gutter cleaning, insulation, different glues, cutters and first time - booth with old ww tools but only junk quality.
Talk to Jesse from Felder group. Nice guy, good info - I may sell my SS with slider and will buy K3. I LOVE THIS SAW!!!:eek::eek:

In general - poor attendance and representation from the companies. Three big stands with Makita, Bosch and DW, but when my friend asked if they have a slider saw - blunt faces and answer - we don't have it. My friend point to the box with it - O yes, I forget.:confused::confused:
Festool stand with a few boxes, did not have sandpapers.
Classes - mostly for turners, I am not ( luckily :eek:) in this group of ww's.
One of the dealer was talking about improvement in ww show in the near future - company did change the owners and it may change a lot. Will see. I really would like to see improvement.
Did you happen to notice if Hammer was at that show? They sent an e-mail indicating they would participate in some of the shows but not others. They are not going to be in Indianapolis in two weeks but are attending in Kansas City in three weeks. I have tickets to both shows but might just skip the Indy show since Roland Johson will be at both shows. His class is the reason I plan to attend. My dad and I were very disappointed in the Woodworking in America show in Covington. They seem to have exclusively catered to the hand tool crowd. I keep looking for reasons to go to shows and keep hearing poor attendance claims and bad reports. Are we an aging population?

[Eduard Nemirovsky]

Did you happen to notice if Hammer was at that show?
yes, Felder group did show a Hammer BS, JP and Sliding saw K3.
Ed.

[glenn bradley]

Unfortunately, there was a decline in attendance which caused a decline in vendors, which magnified the loss of attendees, etc, etc.

Jim hits the nail on the head and I have waved this flag for awhile. If we don't attend, the vendors see low turnout and in response do less themselves. Like demanding Wal-Mart pricing for everything, we are our own worst enemy in this. "The Woodworking Shows" size and interest will vary with the economy along with everything else in our society. The shows (at least 'The Woodoworking Shows') are not swap meets, nor are they bargain basements. The main purpose is not to offer great deals to attendees.

They do allow you to get your hands on products that interest you, or ones you may be just curious about, that you might not otherwise be able to see first hand. There are generally key staff available to ask those pesky questions that never seem to get answered in the glossy dog and pony ads and marketing fluff. On the left coast there are usually high ranking folks, presidents or owners of businesses, large and small, who make themselves available if you have things you want to discuss. If you think these folks don't want to talk to you, you're wrong. Your input is incredibly valuable to them.

During the lean years, the shows offer different opportunities than when things are "fat". In today's economy, if you are going with an "entertain me" expectation, I think you will be disappointed. I for one, try to go every year if only to get face to face with the folks I only see at those events. Have some fun.

[Rich Riddle]

Glenn,

Different people attend for different reasons. Some like seeing things in person before purchasing, others like seeing demonstrations, and apparently some like talking to the corporate executives and technology representatives. Others do want show discounts, like the small ones typical of Bosch and Carter. The point is that if vendors don't cater enough to each of those groups, then attendance will fall. I attend to see stationary tools in person. Members of groups that don't encounter what they came to see will not return. It's simple economics and reinforcement schedules. The vendors can't afford to isolate any sub-group of woodworkers in this economy.

The Lie Neilson folks were dispensing with the rhetoric of paying "livable wages" at the last several shows ad nauseum. It was such a turn-off that many potential non-political folks, including myself, said something and then walked away. The owner's son-in-law actually used the WalMart example you just sited. They of course offered no show discount. In Covington they were situated directly next to the Lee Valley and Veritas booth. Being able to compare the two planes side-by-side was enlightening. Anyone there could see who was getting more business after realizing little difference existed between the quality of the two. Lee Valley offered a small discount and a tote bag.

The truth is that you go for your reasons and I go for mine. If my reasons (and others like me) aren't satisfied, we won't return. Will that affect the total show? If there are enough people like me, indeed it will. You'll see dwindling attendance and even fewer vendors, the cycle you discuss. I am the customer. It's not up to me to figure out what they need, it's up to them to deliver what we want.


Jim hits the nail on the head and I have waved this flag for awhile. If we don't attend, the vendors see low turnout and in response do less themselves. Like demanding Wal-Mart pricing for everything, we are our own worst enemy in this. "The Woodworking Shows" size and interest will vary with the economy along with everything else in our society. The shows (at least 'The Woodoworking Shows') are not swap meets, nor are they bargain basements. The main purpose is not to offer great deals to attendees.

They do allow you to get your hands on products that interest you, or ones you may be just curious about, that you might not otherwise be able to see first hand. There are generally key staff available to ask those pesky questions that never seem to get answered in the glossy dog and pony ads and marketing fluff. On the left coast there are usually high ranking folks, presidents or owners of businesses, large and small, who make themselves available if you have things you want to discuss. If you think these folks don't want to talk to you, you're wrong. Your input is incredibly valuable to them.

During the lean years, the shows offer different opportunities than when things are "fat". In today's economy, if you are going with an "entertain me" expectation, I think you will be disappointed. I for one, try to go every year if only to get face to face with the folks I only see at those events. Have some fun.

[Lee Ludden]

I went to the Woodworking in America show put on this past October by Popular Woodworking. There were not many vendors there, but the classes were what I was there for and I feel I got my money's worth.

[Don Orr]

I have been to and may be going to the show in Springfield MA this coming weekend. It was OK last year but was better in the past.

Warning-blatant self promotion ahead. ;-)) If you want to go to a REAL woodworking show, please consider the NWA Showcase of Fine Woodworking in Saratoga Springs, NY at the end of March. This will be the 21st year (I believe) of one of the largest woodworking events in the Northeast and it is entirely put on by VOLUNTEERS! Go to www.woodworker.org (http://www.woodworker.org) and look for the Showcase icon for more info. You'll be glad you did.

[Rich Riddle]

I have been to and may be going to the show in Springfield MA this coming weekend. It was OK last year but was better in the past.

Warning-blatant self promotion ahead. ;-)) If you want to go to a REAL woodworking show, please consider the NWA Showcase of Fine Woodworking in Saratoga Springs, NY at the end of March. This will be the 21st year (I believe) of one of the largest woodworking events in the Northeast and it is entirely put on by VOLUNTEERS! Go to www.woodworker.org (http://www.woodworker.org) and look for the Showcase icon for more info. You'll be glad you did.

Don, that looks like quite the show. Some of the previous winners are better than I ever hope to aspire. It's a bit far from here to travel there, but good luck with the show.

[Erik Loza]

...The point is that if vendors don't cater enough to each of those groups, then attendance will fall...

Rich, I hear what you are saying but have a different take on things. Accept or reject as you like. In my opinion, the biggest cause of demise in the woodworking shows (not necessarily this particular show, but across the board...) has been the growth of the internet and of blogs and forums like this.

I have been in this industry for over ten years and done pretty much every professional ww'ing show in the country at one point or another. If not all, at least the majority. The economy has been a factor, no doubt, but the shows started to tank even before the economy did its downturn. If you go back to the early 2000's, the internet was still a nacent thing and there were not very many shows. There were only a handful of discussion forums. Also, a lot of this machinere (the Euro stuff, anyway...) was still relatively new to the US. If you wanted to see one or even better, to get a deal on one, you HAD to go to a show and you HAD to wheel and deal there. There were less dealers at the time and nobody on the web to ask the usual questions in regards to feedback, quality, comparisons, etc.

The "demand" side was stronger and what happened was that the shows saw this as a green light to move forward and instead of one or two promotions, doing a only few shows a year, you had new promotions popping up and doing shows every few weeks and all over the place. Soon, customers started to adopt the mentality that they did not really need to make a buying decision at the show because there would just be another show with other deals in a few months, so they could just wait or go to the show and not spend any money. The "not spending any money" part is important because if the customers don't spend any money at the show, then we (the vendors) can't afford to come.

To put it into perspective, it would cost us about $10,000 to do the average hobby ww'ing show. By the time you added up booth costs, airfare, hotel, rental car, and charges to actually ship the machines and the booth to an expo center, that was the average cost. So, we needed to sell $10K just to break even. Not $10K gross, $10K PROFIT. In the early 2000's, there were plenty of shows I did that at. But, as the we got into the latter half of the decade, things changed like everyone in this thread is commenting about. Plenty of traffic in the booths, just a lot fewer buyers. What that meant is that many of the shows had their major vendors abandon them because they simply could not make any money at the shows, so what you ended up with was all hand tools or knick-knacks, like someone mentioned. Or, "peripheral" businesses from, other industries, who bought booth space. In other words, the role of woodworking shows in general has shifted from being a place where deals got made to a place, today, where information is gathered, for "future decisions".

There is nothing wrong with any of that. The market is dynamic and I look at it as some form of evolution. For the record, if anyone is thinking of going to just one woodworking show, I would highly encourage them to attend the AWFS this summer in Vegas or the IWF in Atlanta, next year. Those shows are what you expect.

Just my 2-cents as always,

Erik Loza
Minimax USA

[Rich Riddle]

Regarding the declining attendance, do you Creekers think it's because we are an aging population and fewer younger people take up the hobby? Or has the Internet and websites offered videos and deals with which shows cannot compete for convenience and price?

In my opinion, the biggest cause of demise in the woodworking shows (not necessarily this particular show, but across the board...) has been the growth of the internet and of blogs and forums like this.
We don't differ in opinion as this is one of the first questions I asked and thought might have fostered lower attendance.

The lack of vendors only portrays part of my disappointment, the lack of stationary tools and demonstrations is the other part. At the show in Convington all the classes I attended focused on hand tools, even the ones I had thought would not do so. The working smarter class instructor talked at length about being in harmony with the wood in posture. I had envisioned how to run a project most effectively when using tools, etc.

I don't know the number of woodworkers who use only hand tools, but it's not worth my time to go if that's all they discuss. I am not one of those who primarily use hand tools. Perhaps the Woodworking in America crowd only focus on that. Fair enough. Good luck to them.

I understand what you mean about the costs associated with the shows, they're expensive. It's enlightening to see that vendors expect the shows to be self-supportive. I had thought many companies would use woodworking shows to garner potential customers rather than prove profitable, much like advertising doesn't turn a profit.

We will see how the Kansas City show goes and the attendance factor. If I have time, the Indianapolis show would even be a consideration, weather dependent of course. There, Roland Johnson discusses how to tune and use power tools. Recognizing power tools exist will be a positive step forward from the Woodworking in America show.

Vegas in the summer. That will test my devotion to the hobby, but if it's the best and has a strong representation from the power tool folks, it's the show to attend. Thanks for that tidbit of information.

[Erik Loza]

Sure thing, Rich. For the first-timer, Vegas is the better show IMO. "Less" to see (or to be overwhelmed by...), so it is easier to focus on what you want to visit. Also, both AWFS and IWF offer classes and seminars for those in the interested. You don't necessarily need to be in the industry but you do need to sign up ahead of time. The one show I miss more than any are the TSI Expos. They were for the industry but on the scale of a (large-ish) hobby show. A victim of the economy. Here is an interesting read....

http://www.woodshopnews.com/news/news-desk/498501-shows-exhibits-are-slowly-disappearing

Best,

Erik Loza
Minimax USA

[Rich Riddle]

Sure thing, Rich. For the first-timer, Vegas is the better show IMO. "Less" to see (or to be overwhelmed by...), so it is easier to focus on what you want to visit. Also, both AWFS and IWF offer classes and seminars for those in the interested. You don't necessarily need to be in the industry but you do need to sign up ahead of time. The one show I miss more than any are the TSI Expos. They were for the industry but on the scale of a (large-ish) hobby show. A victim of the economy. Here is an interesting read....

http://www.woodshopnews.com/news/news-desk/498501-shows-exhibits-are-slowly-disappearing

Best,

Erik Loza
Minimax USA
Erik,

I read where the shows I will be attending in Indianapolis and Kansas City were bought out by that old company. Apparently they aren't near the magnitude of the former shows. Thanks for the read.

[Erik Loza]

Erik,

I read where the shows I will be attending in Indianapolis and Kansas City were bought out by that old company. Apparently they aren't near the magnitude of the former shows. Thanks for the read.

It really hits you when you do a big show, like Vegas, and one year, instead of being two large halls, it is a single hall that maybe is 2/3rds full. Things seem to be on the way back up, though. At least if my busines is any indicator. I heard (did not go) that last summer's Atlanta show was bigger than before, so that is a positive sign. Whether the hobby shows will reflect that, hard to say.

Erik Loza
Minimax USA

[Randal Stevenson]

Erik,

I read where the shows I will be attending in Indianapolis and Kansas City were bought out by that old company. Apparently they aren't near the magnitude of the former shows. Thanks for the read.

I first went in 2003, just to get an idea of what they were like. In 2004, I went to buy something they were "demoing", and had to ask them to demo it, since they weren't. The next year, that vendor was no more then a Harbor Freight reseller, and closed after that and sold their tool displays to other vendors. You still see their marks on some stands. It hasn't been the same since (they were the largest vendor), and they moved the show one year, which was a disaster (lack of parking, they had to resod a freshly sodded location, after people parking on the grass). It is over crowded and a lot of people (myself two years ago), go when they need something small (Peachtree casters, that matched Woodcrafts, for less), but multiple of the woodworking stores, have events that same weekend (I tend to attend them instead).

[Peter Kelly]

Sure thing, Rich. For the first-timer, Vegas is the better show IMO. "Less" to see (or to be overwhelmed by...), so it is easier to focus on what you want to visit. Also, both AWFS and IWF offer classes and seminars for those in the interested. You don't necessarily need to be in the industry but you do need to sign up ahead of time. The one show I miss more than any are the TSI Expos. They were for the industry but on the scale of a (large-ish) hobby show. A victim of the economy. Here is an interesting read....

http://www.woodshopnews.com/news/news-desk/498501-shows-exhibits-are-slowly-disappearing

Best,

Erik Loza
Minimax USAThose regional TSI shows were great. Much more manageable in size then IWF and you didn't have to go to Atlanta in August (too hot) or LV in July (lethally hot).

To me, the value in attending either IWF or AWFS is speaking directly with exhibitors and compare stuff almost side by side. There are a ton of opinions about almost every product or tool on the web but very little of what is written is authoritative and not always very objective. Corporate reps aren't going to give you the most unbiased opinions about why their product is better than all the others but it's a good starting point for some things.

[Rich Riddle]

Those regional TSI shows were great. Much more manageable in size then IWF and you didn't have to go to Atlanta in August (too hot) or LV in July (lethally hot).

To me, the value in attending either IWF or AWFS is speaking directly with exhibitors and compare stuff almost side by side. There are a ton of opinions about almost every product or tool on the web but very little of what is written is authoritative and not always very objective. Corporate reps aren't going to give you the most unbiased opinions about why their product is better than all the others but it's a good starting point for some things.
Peter,

It looks as though the weather is holding up well, so I will likely drive to Indianapolis this Friday and explore the show. Someone said it's better to attend on Friday than the weekend. Hopefully things work out well.

[Roger Leclercq]

Just come back from woodworking show. I am going every year for last 6-7 years. Probably it will be my last show (if it not improve drastically).It was four-five booths with not ww related stuff - basement repair, gutter cleaning, insulation, different glues, cutters and first time - booth with old ww tools but only junk quality.
Talk to Jesse from Felder group. Nice guy, good info - I may sell my SS with slider and will buy K3. I LOVE THIS SAW!!!:eek::eek:

In general - poor attendance and representation from the companies. Three big stands with Makita, Bosch and DW, but when my friend asked if they have a slider saw - blunt faces and answer - we don't have it. My friend point to the box with it - O yes, I forget.:confused::confused:
Festool stand with a few boxes, did not have sandpapers.
Classes - mostly for turners, I am not ( luckily :eek:) in this group of ww's.
One of the dealer was talking about improvement in ww show in the near future - company did change the owners and it may change a lot. Will see. I really would like to see improvement.

I also attended Baltimore show and was very disappointed unless you were a turner they had like 5 groups showing their skills I was looking for a mortiser but the only equipment being showed was laguna (out of my price range) as I am not a professional. I see it going down the tubes I love INCRA but they stopped attending about three years ago. I doubt if any body just getting into woodworking even knows about INCRA except their rules. If the manufactures want to sell it they need to show it. After the last 20yrs of attending if next years show is as bad as this one I wont attending again.

[Rich Riddle]

Well I missed the one in Indianapolis last weekend due to being on the East Coast. I am visiting my father this weekend in KC. Has anyone been attending the shows?