Sharpening options for a new-to-me dovetail saw? Opinions?

[Scott M Perry]

Hi, all -

I picked up a new saw for dovetailing last week - a Richardson Bros. 8" backsaw:
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8071/8304773552_83235db3ca.jpg

The saw is in nice shape, though the teeth need work:

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8222/8303724639_97c9264dd5.jpg

Not sure what's going on there. Parts are 16 PPI, parts 14 PPI, teeth sharpened all cattywompus.

Anyway, I'm thinking of retoothing this to 16 PPI. I think I've narrowed down the field to three places: http://www.tgiag.com/ (Dom Greco), http://www.badaxetoolworks.com/ (Bad Axe), and http://home.grics.net/~weir/Old_SAWS_Restored.html (Daryl Weir). I'm not trying to start any flame wars, but I'm wondering if any of you have experience with any/all of these three sources (or any I'm missing), and what your opinions are? The last saw I had sharpened was by Tom Law, so I'm a bit out of the game.

Thanks for any input.
Scott

[David Weaver]

I would probably choose Daryl, but if you're getting it retoothed, it don't know that it matters that much. There's not much easier than filing and setting a retoothed dovetail (rip filed) saw.

[paul cottingham]

I don't think you can go wrong with those three as choices. I have several saws sharpened by Mark from Bad Axe, and am very happy to recommend him.

[Chris Vandiver]

Daryl Weir's work is as good as it gets.

[Mark Dorman]

Try jointing it down flat and rethooth it yourself you'll be glad you did. what you learn will be well worth the price of a couple files and the time.

[Mike Cogswell]

Mark at Bad Axe did a great job on my father's old saws. I have no direct knowledge of the others.
However, if the saw plate is nice and straight, I'd go along with the suggestions to do it yourself.
If the 16 pipi is the front part only, it may not be a bad thing. 16 to start and a more aggressive 14 to cut faster.

[Mark Dorman]

You might look at Logan Cabinet Shoppe he has a saw sharpening service also plus tons of good podcasts.
http://www.logancabinetshoppe.com/saw-sharpening.php

[Joe Bailey]

I would direct you to Matt Cianci - here (http://thesawblog.com/?p=647)

[Tony Shea]

I also reccomend Matt Cianci. You might also be sent there through Mark at Bad Axe depending on his work load at the moment.

[Derek Cohen]

I have US-sharpened saws, a bunch by Mike Wenzloff and one by Matt Cianci. Both do superlative work. Highly recommended.

Regards from Perth (still in Sarasota, tomorrow off to New York)

Derek

[Jim Koepke]

+1 on what Mark said about giving it a try on your own.

You may not do a perfect job, but you will learn about a valuable skill. It would be next to impossible to really mess it up. If it doesn't work, try again. If you just can't get the hang of it, then send it off.

My first time sharpening a saw worked pretty good. Now that my skill has improved, my first (and a few later attempts) do not look as good as they worked. My skills and abilities are still improving in this area.

jtk

[Dave Cav]

Assuming he's not all backed up, I would send it to Bad Axe. He's done a couple of saws for me and I'm happy with the results.

[Glen Koopmans]

I have experience with three names mentioned in the post & replies. I highly recommend Daryl Weir and Mark at Bad Axe. Not only do they sharpen and tune saws well, they say what they mean, and do what they say. If they say it will take a week, it will take a week, not two.

I have restored a lot of tools and have hired good help over the years to accomplish the work. There are some who's work was very good, however their word was not... and I waited and waited. Daryl and Mark have great work ethics, and get the work done and out the door with excellent workmanship (you will not be dissapointed). Daryl and Mark are also very personable and will take the time to talk to you explaining what they will do and why.

I own quite a few hand saws, I don't use most of them. My favorites I use a lot are old (a Disston backsaw, panel saw; and a Bishop backsaw) and Daryl tuned and sharpened all three of them. There is something in those old saw plates the new ones don't have, I can't explain it, but I can feel it when I cut with them.

Good Luck with the new saw, it looks like a keeper!

[Jim Koepke]

There is something in those old saw plates the new ones don't have, I can't explain it

Could it be what makes all of us better... Experience? :D

jtk

[Scott M Perry]

Thanks, everyone, for your input and suggestions. I have to do a little legwork now and find out turn-around/backlogs and make a decision as to where I should send this thing.

FWIW, I'd eventually like to learn how to file a saw, at least to maintain the few I have. But I'm trying to figure out dovetailing right now, and would just as soon remove my sharpening ineptitude from the already steep learning curve. So, this one gets sent out. As soon as I'm done reworking the tote (shellac is ready to be rubbed out with steel wool and wax...).

Thanks again!
Scott

[Roy Griggs]

I would check around your local area, with other woodworkers, Woodcraft (if you have one), etc.; by doing a little homework I found two different people locally who sharpen saws. Not only is it much cheaper but you support local business and help preserve the service. No offence meant to Mark, Matt, Mike or Darryl...I only know Mike W's work and that is from new saws. By the way both men that I found, do excellent work, one charges me $4.50 for a simple sharpening of a large saw and $7.50 for re-toothing and sharpening (doesn't do backsaws or anything finer than 12tpi). The other charges $12.50 and I use him for my back-saws.

[Chris Griggs]

I see you're near Philly. If you want some help learning how to file or use handsaws I'd be happy to help. I'm no pro or expert (and have never fully retoothed a saw), but I can help you get to a basic level of proficiency. Feel free to PM me if you want some assistance.

[Mark Dorman]

I see you're near Philly. If you want some help learning how to file or use handsaws I'd be happy to help. I'm no pro or expert (and have never fully retoothed a saw), but I can help you get to a basic level of proficiency. Feel free to PM me if you want some assistance.

Another fine example of the generosity of the Creek; one of the many things that make it a great place.

[Scott M Perry]

Roy, that's interesting - Dom is (relatively) local to me, and is substantially more than that to retooth and sharpen.

Chris, I sent you a PM.

Mark, I've been active on (another woodworking forum) for years, but have been a member here since near inception. I'm starting to find myself here much more these days. Very generous, knowledgeable folks here.

[Larry Fox]

Scott, another thing to consider is whether or not the saw - even after an expert re-tooth / re-sharpen is going to be up to snuff for you. If you are just learning to cut them (as we all always are) and trying to refine your technique you need to have something known-good to anchor to. What I mean by this is that it is a LOT easier to improve your technique if you have confidence in your tools. When I cut a dovetail and it looks like it was chewed by a beaver - which they frequently do - I am 100% confident it was me. If I didn't have confidence in my tools I would feel like I was trying to hit a moving target.

Also in Philly burbs - Chester County specifically

[Scott M Perry]

Hi, Larry -

Having it done bby someone who knows what they're doing is actually because I want a "known good". Doing it myself would introduce that variable to the equation, too. That said, Chris has me pondering now whether to have the plate just up and replaced altogether. It's not dead-straight, but the slight bow is small and I don't think would affect much. My current saw, a 14 PPI Atkins, has worked okay for me, but is very comfortable to use. The Richardson is very nice to hold, but I'm not sure what to do with it now as far as retoothing, trying it myself, or getting a new plate... :confused:

Scott

[Larry Fox]

Tough call and for me it would boil down to economics of fix vs replace. We are relatively close so let me know if you want to sample another saw for comparison. I use a Wenzloff and I really like it - you are more than welcome to stop by and give it a whirl.

[Scott M Perry]

Thanks for the offer, Larry! You're not far away.

I'm looking into cost to replace, but retoothing and sharpening is $55 at two local people. Not sure it'd be cost-effective to replace. And I'll admit there's some allure to using the old steel, though I'm not sure why.

[Larry Fox]

Understood on the old steel. I have heard these are a great value. http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=64007&cat=1,42884,64007
I tried one a while ago and was pretty impressed but don't have one as I already had the one I own.

[Scott M Perry]

I ended up sending the saw to Bob Rozaieski. Saw came back today, a week from when I sent it to when I received it. He reset the back, retoothed and sharpened it to 18 PPI rip. Cuts like a dream now.


http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8190/8368790640_d96f1b8ba7_z.jpg


http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8354/8367722243_b12e9623e3_z.jpg


Again, in case you've forgotten how this started out:


http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8222/8303724639_97c9264dd5_z.jpg


Now to plane some wood and get busy!