Anyone Use T5 Lights?

[Derek Arita]

I have to add a light fixture in my garage and want the max light I can get, with low power use. I've been reading about T5 and it sounds pretty good. Can anyone recommend these? I'll be using 48" x 4 fixture.

[Grant Wilkinson]

I have two 48" x 2 tube fixtures. Over time, I will convert all my old T12's. I find that I get as much usable light out of 2 T5's as I do out of 4 T12's. There are a couple of places that sell direct conversions. They consist of a sort of cradle with a built in T5 ballast and the tubes. Since the T5 tubes are shorter than the T12, you cannot simply use the same end caps.

[Eric DeSilva]

I researched changing out the poor lighting in my shop and decided to go with T5HOs. I know there seem to be a lot of folks saying that the price point per lumen for the T5s isn't quite there yet--they typically recommend T8s--but I like the smaller form factor and found that the fixtures/lights weren't all that much different than the T8s in terms of pricing when you figured in the fewer lights that are needed. I would note that I got a quote from a real lighting supply place near me that was considerably better--and had better options--than my local big box store. Unfortunately, I'm still in the middle of another shop project, so I'm still working under crap T12s.

[Scotty Allen]

I have a 4 - 48" by 8' long light set. It puts out a lot of light, something like 20000 lumins if you use the 5000K lights. I am thinking about putting another set up as well.

[Lee Schierer]

We installed T-5's to replace some old lighting in a factory and wow what a difference. Some employees were complaining at first that they were too bright, but were really nice once they got used to them, particularly for detail work. Some energy providers provide rebates for T5's.

[Derek Arita]

This is the fixture I'm looking at for my shop..
http://www.amazon.com/Commercial-Tube-Fixture-Light-Size/dp/B002TJOGLE/ref=sr_1_1?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1354412144&sr=1-1&keywords=t5+light+fixture
This can be hardwired to the other lite fixture...right? Would this give me the hi output? I'm also looking at replacing the bulbs in another fixture with t5 retrofit units. Actually, it's an old kitchen fixture that I relocated into the garage.

[Kevin Nathanson]

I have a 1,600 sq. ft. shop with 8 six-bulb fixtures filled with 3500k lights and I absolutely love them. They throw a lot of light with minimal shadow. I used fixtures from e-conolight.com.

K

[Steve Rozmiarek]

We converted the two big farm shops from the four different types of fixtures to 4 bulb t-5's. They work very well. A friend is an electrician who spends a lot of time converting factories and warehouses to T-5, and he sourced the fixtures. I agree on the bright. They take a few mins to be full power, but nothing like a metal halide. Not cheap, but well worth it, and I have not changed a bulb in 3 years. I was skeptical when the engineering diagram came back calling for so few fixtures, but they were right. Mine are mirrored reflectors, which I'm sure helps too, and at the time you could only get those through the "pro" sources. I will use them in the new wood shop if it ever gets finished.

[Matt Marsh]

Derek,

I am the Master Electrician of Records and Lead electrician at a state university in Northern Minnesota. We've done some very extensive lighting retro projects in recent years, two of them involving retro-fitting HID high bay fixtures with T5 fixtures, one in a gymnasium, another still in progress is a retired indoor Hockey rink. Lighting retros are a very hot topic these days, with many of the power companies offering rebates for watts saved.

Because the lumen output is concentrated into a smaller diameter tube with the T5s, the light from them appears harsher and more glaring than the T8s when they are mounted on ceilings 20' or lower. This is especially true with HO T5s. For this reason, we generally prefer T8s to T5s if the ceiling height is 20' or lower, and T5s are considered where ceiling heights are over 20', depending on the cost difference, and the lighting requirements.

[Marc Ward]

I have to add a light fixture in my garage and want the max light I can get, with low power use. I've been reading about T5 and it sounds pretty good. Can anyone recommend these? I'll be using 48" x 4 fixture.

T5s are still old technology. They still require ballast, which uses energy and produces no light. They are still filled with mercury. They still break. They still have a short rated life. All fluorescents still hate the cold. The still require time to come to full power. They still flicker. The fixtures still hum. They still emit ultra violet which attracts insects.

I use these...http://www.titanled.net/editor/assets/TITAN%20Titanium%20Tube%20clear%204%20foot%20SMD-2.pdf

75,000 rated life, no mercury, no ballast, no ultra violet, made of lexan so they don't break easily, day white clear color temperature.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Marc, those look pricey? Also, have they solved the dimming over time issue?

[Derek Arita]

T5s are still old technology. They still require ballast, which uses energy and produces no light. They are still filled with mercury. They still break. They still have a short rated life. All fluorescents still hate the cold. The still require time to come to full power. They still flicker. The fixtures still hum. They still emit ultra violet which attracts insects.

I use these...http://www.titanled.net/editor/assets/TITAN%20Titanium%20Tube%20clear%204%20foot%20SMD-2.pdf




75,000 rated life, no mercury, no ballast, no ultra violet, made of lexan so they don't break easily, day white clear color temperature.
Couldn't get to their website. What's the deal? What's the cost? What's the equivalent wattage or lumens.

[Grant Wilkinson]

The website titanled.net loads after the flash screen for me.

[Marc Ward]

Dimming over time? Have fluorescents solved that problem? LEDs do degrade, but much slower than a fluorescent does. Also, when fluorescents degrade, the ballast works harder, drawing more from the grid and costing you more money, for no additional benefit.

When a "average life" is given for a fluorescent tube, it is based on a sample of tubes (say 75) and how long it takes them, as a group, to degrade to 40% of their original lumen output. The test for LEDs is similar, but more stringent. it is based on a sample of tubes (say 75) and how long it takes them, as a group, to degrade to 70% of their original lumen output. So, 30,000 hour life for a fluorescent vs. a 75,000 hour life for LEDs means the LEDs will be producing significant lumen output many times longer that fluorescents.

Besides, it if is good enough for Jay Leno's garage, it is good enough for me... http://www.jaylenosgarage.com/video/led-shop-lights/1424118/

[Derek Arita]

Dimming over time? Have fluorescents solved that problem? LEDs do degrade, but much slower than a fluorescent does. Also, when fluorescents degrade, the ballast works harder, drawing more from the grid and costing you more money, for no additional benefit.

When a "average life" is given for a fluorescent tube, it is based on a sample of tubes (say 75) and how long it takes them, as a group, to degrade to 40% of their original lumen output. The test for LEDs is similar, but more stringent. it is based on a sample of tubes (say 75) and how long it takes them, as a group, to degrade to 70% of their original lumen output. So, 30,000 hour life for a fluorescent vs. a 75,000 hour life for LEDs means the LEDs will be producing significant lumen output many times longer that fluorescents.

Besides, it if is good enough for Jay Leno's garage, it is good enough for me... http://www.jaylenosgarage.com/video/led-shop-lights/1424118/
If I could afford Leno's cars, I'd go for his lights as well.

[Carl Beckett]

Couldn't get to their website. What's the deal? What's the cost? What's the equivalent wattage or lumens.


Any info on cost? I have to cam are against a set of fixtures I trash picked out of the back of the building at work. These look quite a bit more expensive than, say, free.

[Marc Ward]

Retail for one piece is $73.89. All specs are on the site....here ===> http://www.titanled.net/editor/assets/TITAN%20Titanium%20Tube%20clear%204%20foot%20SMD-2.pdf

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Marc, no offense to you, I'm glad I know about these now, but they illustrate the false economy of leds I think. To redo my current woodshop with these bulbs it would cost $3,500. That is a lot of money for the same level of light that costed me $200 for the T-8 bulbs that are there. I could replace bulbs and pay for a little more power for a very long time before break even is ever achieved.

[Marc Ward]

Marc, no offense to you, I'm glad I know about these now, but they illustrate the false economy of leds I think. To redo my current woodshop with these bulbs it would cost $3,500. That is a lot of money for the same level of light that costed me $200 for the T-8 bulbs that are there. I could replace bulbs and pay for a little more power for a very long time before break even is ever achieved.

No offense taken.

False economy for you, maybe. But not for everyone. I just replaced 64 8' T12s and 32 4' T8s in a bowling alley that burn them 18 hours a day. With installation, payback is 19 months. After that, all the energy bill savings are theirs to keep. Not to mention the lower maintenance cost, and quality of light. They are thrilled they can actually dim them. Something they could not do before.

They did not think it a "false economy".

At the same time, they have a banquet room with very poor light. My LED retrofit payback calculation was north of 100 months because they only use the room once or twice a month. They decided to hold off on this room, and I can't blame them. But, that is why we do the analysis for them.

Also, the LED tubes do not radiate light 360 degrees. The LEDs face down, sending the light where you want it, without having to try to "recapture and redirect" the light with reflectors, or whatever.

[Andrew Pitonyak]

When I purchased my house, it contained numerous 40 Watt 48" T12 lights with magnetic ballasts. I was also given some fixtures that I could use that matched these specifications.

I purchased a bunch of Electronic ballasts that can drive T12 and T8 lights, replaced the ballasts and then I installed T8 lights as opposed to T12 lights.

When I chose a ballast, I chose freezer ballasts that work in my garage in those cold Ohio winters.

Color Rendering Index (CRI) was very important to me so that when I produce a finish, I know the true color.

Note that I did not install T5 bulbs, i went with T8 bulbs instead. Part of this was that I did not want to replace my fixtures, but there are other considerations as well.

They have similar run characteristics in terms of CRI and Luments per Watt. I was told that the T8 bulb produces a better quality of light with less glare when the bulb is lower than 20 feet. I expect that this is because you have much more light coming from a smaller bulb and with the higher installation height a nicely designed reflector can have more affect on light dispersion (and such).

That, coupled with the fact that the T8 bulbs are less expensive (or where when I last checked) than T5 bulbs, is why I ended up with T8s in my shop.

Will be interested in what you choose to do.

[george newbury]

Thought I'd join this thread rather than starting a new one.


When I purchased my house, it contained numerous 40 Watt 48" T12 lights with magnetic ballasts. I was also given some fixtures that I could use that matched these specifications.

I purchased a bunch of Electronic ballasts that can drive T12 and T8 lights, replaced the ballasts and then I installed T8 lights as opposed to T12 lights.

When I chose a ballast, I chose freezer ballasts that work in my garage in those cold Ohio winters.
<snip>

I'm in a similar situation. I've got about 50 8' T12 fixtures each with 2 bulbs, and at least 10 4' T12 fixtures, each with 4 bulbs. And I'm getting a buzz off several of the 8' ers so I suspect ballast replacement is necessary at the minimum. Virtually all the units are stand alone with a cord run to an outlet which was installed nearby.

Some of them are in a shed with an 8'+ ceiling.

251684

This picture is typical of the install.

Most are in sheds with 10' ceilings, and a few in an RV shed with a 14' ceiling.

I'd like to replace most of them with the most cost efficient possible. Usually the lights are on for 3 hours or less, and in two of the buildings might not be run for weeks. I'm sure the most "efficient" would be the LED lights but payback would take infinity.

What I am focusing on now is to gradually upgrade most of the T12 fixtures to T8's, either as their ballasts go bad or when I run out of T12 bulbs. I'd like to upgrade SOME of the T12's where I need more light with T5 upgrade kits or full replacements. Such as the RV shed, where the lights are so far away from the floor, and other areas for workbenches.

So I'm looking for sources for replacement kits.

Any suggestions?

[Steve Rozmiarek]

George, assuming the bulbs are the same length, could't you just make a kit? I saw the tombstones in stock at Lowes, you can source ballasts there too. Probably cheaper sources then Lowes, but it's a possible solution.

[Derek Arita]

Thought I'd join this thread rather than starting a new one.



I'm in a similar situation. I've got about 50 8' T12 fixtures each with 2 bulbs, and at least 10 4' T12 fixtures, each with 4 bulbs. And I'm getting a buzz off several of the 8' ers so I suspect ballast replacement is necessary at the minimum. Virtually all the units are stand alone with a cord run to an outlet which was installed nearby.

Some of them are in a shed with an 8'+ ceiling.

251684

This picture is typical of the install.

Most are in sheds with 10' ceilings, and a few in an RV shed with a 14' ceiling.

I'd like to replace most of them with the most cost efficient possible. Usually the lights are on for 3 hours or less, and in two of the buildings might not be run for weeks. I'm sure the most "efficient" would be the LED lights but payback would take infinity.

What I am focusing on now is to gradually upgrade most of the T12 fixtures to T8's, either as their ballasts go bad or when I run out of T12 bulbs. I'd like to upgrade SOME of the T12's where I need more light with T5 upgrade kits or full replacements. Such as the RV shed, where the lights are so far away from the floor, and other areas for workbenches.

So I'm looking for sources for replacement kits.

Any suggestions?
If by "kit", you mean the T5 replacement kit for T8 or T12 bulbs, make sure that the replacement T5 kit uses HO bulbs, if that's what you want. I bought a replacement kit that used the lower watt T5 bulbs and was disappointed in the light output. That's why I switched to the HO fixture and was thrilled with the output. Again, I realize that the HO bulbs use about 54W, but if you're going for light, like I was, they're the ticket.

[george newbury]

After perusing the "kits" I've found so far on the web I'm thinking it might be better to just buy the Home Depot T5, $70, 4 bulb strip (http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1...1#.UPtyJB21k6Y (http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-202516724/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=t5+light+fixtures&storeId=10051#.UPtyJB21k6Y)) and I can mount that in my present reflectors.

[Derek Arita]

After perusing the "kits" I've found so far on the web I'm thinking it might be better to just buy the Home Depot T5, $70, 4 bulb strip (http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1...1#.UPtyJB21k6Y (http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-202516724/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=t5+light+fixtures&storeId=10051#.UPtyJB21k6Y)) and I can mount that in my present reflectors.
George, you won't be disappointed in the light output or the "whiteness" of the light. Don't be surprised if you end up replacing more of the old fixtures for these. Post what you think of the result.