Drill Press Options...

[Kevin Guarnotta]

Hi Guys,

I'm realizing I need a drill press for my wood shop. Certain things are not as accurate as I would like when drilling by hand...;)
I have been reading through previous posts and also reading articles online about drill presses. Sounds like the old ones are the good ones. I am never quite sure how to budget for a new tool-ie I don't want to buy a tool, and find I have outgrown it, or realize for a bit more I could have gotten a much better model. I try to think about that old saying buy a good tool-cry once, buy a cheap tool, cry every time you use it. something like that...
The way I see it so far these are the features to decide on -

Radial vs. regular
Floor vs. Benchtop
Size (ie 10" 12", 14" ...) distance to column
Stroke (3" seems the minimum)
Speeds?
Size of Motor
New vs Used

Anyway when I first started to look the Radial Arm Drill presses seemed very neat, with amazing abilities, and some very good reviews. Then as I dug deeper-I noticed a lot of folks saying the accuracy is terrible...I am not a machinist, I am a woodworker, so tolerances are a bit different. What do you guys think about radial drill presses? Consensus seems to favor regular drill presses.

So back to regular drill presses. I could go table top, or floor model. The floor models don't seem to be a big price difference, and a few folks have recommended these-as they are easier to move around the shop. I like the idea of being able to move tools around the shop easily-so I'm onto floor models. Some folks have recommended used older ones-as they were built better. Now size of motor, stroke and swing size...these I am having trouble with.

As I don't currently have one, I am trying to determine a 'sweet spot' for size, swing, stroke. Have you guys bought one, and shortly afterwards - thought, dang I should have gotten the next size up.

So for size of motor-how do you know what size you need? Is there a formula for size of bit to determine size of motor?
Variable speeds? - how many is enough, what do you use the slow speeds for, and how fast do you want/need to go?

One other thing, I have recently seen one on craigslist that is foot actuated, by that I mean there is a small pedal you step on to lower the head. That seems like a great idea, that way you can have two hands on the piece. It is an old delta/rockwell. Apparently from 1949.

I know that the basic question - is how will I use this? At this point I just want to be able to drill straight holes in furniture/cabinets that I make. But I understand that sometimes when you get a tool, you find new potential uses for it. Or realize it's shortcomings...when you try to do basic things. So any advice on how to determine the right size for me would be appreciated.

thanks
-Kevin

[pat warner]

This one leaves me not wanting a thing. Made in 1968 (http://patwarner.com/images/old_rock.jpg).

[Von Bickley]

I have the Delta 12" benchtop model. I have it mounted on a stationary wall stand. Everybody has different needs. I just needed a drill press that would drill a straight perpendicular hole. I also use it with a small sanding drum at times. It fit my budget and it fits my needs.

[Alan Muller]

The great majority of recent drill presses are Asian clones and pretty similar to each other. Older ones tend to be US made.

The biggest limitation I've found is that there is no drawbar or locking collar on the Asian machines to hold the chuck arbor in the spindle, or the chuck on the arbor. So you can't very safely use a sanding drum, XY milling table, or anything else involving only or mostly side thrust. You are pretty much limited to drilling only. For me this is a big limitation.


Most Asian machines have a table that tilts and rotates. Most US made machines do not. I've found I don't tilt the table very often but once in a while it comes in very handy. For instance, you can tilt the table 90 deg and clamp a long piece to it for end drilling.

Most of the larger Asian machines have a countershaft and two belts. This gives a good range of speeds but sometimes the pulleys are out of true and the belts are crappy and so on. Overall, I prefer the domestic setup with two big cone pulleys better.

Longer stroke is very useful. Most machines can't drill through a 4 x 4 in one step.

I've mostly had floor sitting drill presses. There is an advantage in being able to drill into the end of a longer item. For me that doesn't happen very often. The only read advantage I see for a bench height drill press is if you want it on a mobile base or a base with storage in it. A floor model is top heavy and not that easy to make a stable rolling base for.

As for motor power, I don't think it makes much difference for casual use: The belts can't deliver that much torque to the spindle anyway--not as much as a good 1/2" hand drill, for instance. For large hole drilling in metal, or even hole sawing in wood, the typical drill press is not really that great. I like variable speed motors for drill presses--either DC--can make up something from a treadmill if mechanically inclined--or 3-phase with a vfd.

If my experience is any guide, a drill press is best not bought sight unseen, even a new one, unless the price is really attractive and/or returning it is easy. Best to check it out for runout, condition of the pulleys and motor, etc.

am

[Don Jarvie]

I have a Craftsman radial DP and its pretty good. Only complaint is its a bit underpowered with a 1/3 hp motor. I want to get a floor model with a bigger motor but will still keep the radial. It's very good for angled holes as it should be.

[Larry Browning]

Ok, here's a completely different idea. How about a used ShopSmith? The drill press feature is generally pretty good for a hobby application. Plus, it's variable speed AND you get a horizontal boring machine, lathe, sanding station, etc... All for the price of a good used DP, maybe even less.
I'm just saying, it is one option.

[Jeff Duncan]

I'd say start out with a basic drill press, something you can find on your local want ads, CL, etc for short money. Then you can learn about what you like and don't like about using it before spending too much cash. Sometimes you can have too much tool! For instance I have 2 drill presses at this time, an older Craftsman and an even older Powermatic 1150. The 1150 is a great drill press, but for ease of jumping on and drilling holes I mostly end up on the Craftsman! For more involved setups the 1150 is the go-to press.

I don't have one, but I think a radial press would be good for a 2nd press. I want my drill press to be ready to drill holes at 90 degrees to the table every time I use it. With a radial I feel like I'd always have to check for that before using, kinda the way I feel about my tilting shaper! Again that's just my take not having owned one so take it for what it's worth....not much;)

good luck,
JeffD

[Kevin Guarnotta]

Thanks for the tips... i think the radial type is out, as I agree with what Jeff is saying. Most of the time, I'll be drilling 90 degrees, and I don't want to have to worry about the press being set up correctly. The floor model will allow for nice options. I definitely want the table to be able to tilt, as to me-those holes are the ones that are impossible to do with a hand drill, and I don't want to have to build a jig just to drill an angled hole.

I think my decision was just made today, while I was at my local Rockler to pick up some clamps for a jig I'm making-I saw the Delta 18-900L, which had gotten very good reviews on this site. They had the floor model deeply discounted, to the point that I couldn't resist. It is probably a bit more than I need - but according to this forum, and other sites - it is a very good one, I can't imagine ever outgrowing it. Supposed to be accurate, and well designed, 6" stroke...the price was a sticking factor for me-but the discounted price makes it worthwhile.

The idea of a shopsmith is intriguing, but whenever I've gotten a tool in the past that does more than one thing, it generally doesn't do any of the individual things very well. I guess if I only had to get one tool-I might go that route.

thanks...

[CPeter James]

Well I have two and both are older Delta/Rockwell units. One is a 17" from 1951 and the other is a ram type radial that weighs 900 pounds. The radial is equipped with a VFD and has 16 speeds with belt changes, so it will go from zero to 8,300 RPM. It is my go to machine most of the time. The 17" Delta is equipped with the slow speed pulley set that gives a nice range of speeds for both metal and wood working. I would be looking on CL if I were you. If you buy an older machine and need help getting it into perfect running order, you can go to the OWWM.org website and they will get you through any problem you might have. Last summer, I sold 5 Delta 14" & 15" drill presses that were reconditioned for between $150 & $175. They are out there and in your area. I just sent you a PM with a couple of leads.

244957

244956

CPeter

[Myk Rian]

I'd say start out with a basic drill press, something you can find on your local want ads, CL, etc for short money.
Skip the short list that you'll get rid of later, and go for the good stuff.
Like this one. I paid $150, and put another $50 into cleaning it up.

244980

[scott vroom]

I love drill press threads.

[Victor Robinson]

Kevin, looking forward to hearing how you like your 18-900L. I've got my eye on it but wasn't ready to pull the trigger when Amazon recently discounted them a bit. Would you mind sharing what you got your floor model for?

[Jeff Duncan]

Skip the short list that you'll get rid of later, and go for the good stuff.
Like this one. I paid $150, and put another $50 into cleaning it up.

244980

Please don't take this the wrong way, but that type of machine IS the entry level type of used press I'm recommending. I had the bench top version of that years ago, inexpensive old iron;) The 'really good stuff', (at least in terms of woodworking), I would equate to the big Delta's and Powermatics which usually run closer to $500+ used and have variable speed, deep throats, and long quill travel. Heck even my Craftsman has 10 speeds to choose from:D

The point was merely to find something for short money like what you did, and use it for a while before spending a lot of cash on a bigger machine with more features;) For that machine may be all he ever needs!

good luck,
JeffD

[ray hampton]

to drill an angled hole.

ed, 6" stroke...the price was a sticking factor for me-but the discounted price makes it worthwhile.


thanks...

A 6" stroke and a longer drill bit will enable you to drill lamp posts

[Kevin Guarnotta]

I picked up the Delta Today. Just over $625 with tax. I got it back to my shop. It is missing a couple screws, and the bottom rack collar is super tight. I have taken it off, and looked at it. The guy at the store said this is a common issue with these machines - the coating on the collar was too thick. He had suggested just taking it off and sanding it a bit. I have done that, and now the table will spin out of the way without too much effort. I'm not sure how often I'll need to rotate the table out of the way. If it is a lot, I may take that collar off, and have another go at it with some sandpaper.

The quality of it is much worse than the top one. I'll probably be giving them a call tomorrow to get it replaced...

My shop floor is so out of level...it is hard to find a good spot to put it. I think I may need to get some leveling compound and level up a spot there.

While I must say the older machines are much more beautiful than this new one, I have enough other projects going on - that I can't afford to drive around looking at different machines, testing them out, and or doing some restoration work on an old beauty. That is why I ended up going for new. If I had more time-I would have loved to go for an old one. By the way what is owwm.org? I tried the website a couple times yesterday-and it was down.

I;ll be playing around with my machine over the next few days, testing it out trying to make some things. I'll let you know how it goes. Any suggestions-or is there a place on this forum regarding things to test out the machine? I have read on this forum it is important to test your machine once you get it-to make sure there is not too much runout, and other things. I just don't know how to test that? Also I'm going to be lookign for ways to add some stuff to the table - specifically a fence. I'll start searching the web, but if you guys have suggestions on where to find info on that it would be appreciated.

Thanks...

[Victor Robinson]

Heck of a price, Kevin. This qualifies as a gloat for sure, though gloats generally must be verified with photos before they can be credited to you.

I can't tell you much about testing drill presses - I've always looked at runout by extending the quill to the end of its travel and giving it a wiggle and see how much it moves...you can measure this accurately with a dial indicator.

As far as fences, googling "drill press table" will give you lots of ideas. The tips I'd mention are to use T-track embedded in the table for hold-downs, and to have a replaceable insert system for zero-clearance on your exit holes. Make sure to design/position the replaceable insert such that when you rotate the insert, you're not drilling in the same spot on the insert (e.g. don't place your square insert dead center on the quill/bit).

[Steve Horvath]

I am not a machinist, but my understanding of runout is the amount of movement or woble you get at the end of a straight shaft/drill bit as it turns slowly in the chuck

[Clint Baxter]

As far as drill press tables and fences go, Woodpeckers makes a nice one. You can either purchase one from them or view it to get ideas on making your own. I've had one of theirs for years and am quite happy with it.

Clint

[Thomas Canfield]

Kevin,

A floor mount drill press has a lot of advantages, but most of the column is never or seldom used. I built a "skirt" around my floor model that supports a removable top that give me the range of a bench top under normal use, or I can remove the top and items stored below for full column drilling. The skirt sides are also removable if required. See this post: http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?47280-Drill-Press-Stand-Skirt&highlight=

My drill press table came from Woodpecker and has been used on now 3 different drill presses. A table with adjustable fence and hold down track is really handy.

[Milind Patil]

That is a heck of a DP you got there. That is what I call "manly" machine !

[Kevin Guarnotta]

That skirt is a great idea. And I just checked out the woodpecker site. that looks like a nice thing to have. Are they the only player in this game?

[Mike Heidrick]

well i have two and both are older delta/rockwell units. One is a 17" from 1951 and the other is a ram type radial that weighs 900 pounds. The radial is equipped with a vfd and has 16 speeds with belt changes, so it will go from zero to 8,300 rpm. It is my go to machine most of the time. The 17" delta is equipped with the slow speed pulley set that gives a nice range of speeds for both metal and wood working.
244957

244956

cpeter


drooooooollll!!!!

[Cary Falk]

That skirt is a great idea. And I just checked out the woodpecker site. that looks like a nice thing to have. Are they the only player in this game?
I thought the Woodpecker one was too small for my 17" drill press so for about the same money, I built a larger one. You used to be able to buy one just like this but it is no longer sold. This is first table that I am completely happy with. I got all of the parts at Woodcraft locally but they can probably be sourced cheaper online.
http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q297/caryincamas/DSC_0637.jpg
http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q297/caryincamas/DSC_0638.jpg

[Keith Outten]

I'm late to the party as usual but I have taken the path less traveled.
After owning several full size drill presses I bought a Grizzly Mill/Drill and I would not trade it for any drill press on the market.
.

[Jeff Duncan]

I test mine out by using them:D Seriously, just get some wood chuck a drill bit in there and start making holes. If you see the bit wobbling in a funny way....then you have a problem:eek:

As for your floor situation your not alone.....nobody has truly flat floors! Grab a shim and pop it under the low spot and your good to go!

I don't have any of the fancy aftermarket add-ons myself. You will want some type of auxillary table though. Makes life much easier for things like having a fence for maintaining hole placement. Also good for providing bottom support when through drilling to prevent blowout, and a host of other benefits. Mine are usually just scrap material cobbled together quickly to get the job done.

Anyway good luck and happy drilling!
JeffD

[ian maybury]

There's different ways of looking at it, and it depends on what you want it for - but to my mind I'd buy almost anything but a cheap eastern made drill press. Not too bad on run out (if you get a good one), but not enough spindle travel at 4in, the table is flimsy enough to be hard to keep in alignment, limited reach, quite likely a poor quality and inaccurate chuck, and unable to drill even a moderately sized hole in steel without getting into severe and nasty chatter. Add a PIA need to change the belt/pulleys for speed changes.

It's absolutely not worth putting the time into building a decent table or the like for one of those things.

I'm jealous of you guys in the US - there seems to be such a wide choice of slightly older properly made used stuff for sale for very decent money. Even the higher end Delta machines with the long spindle travel look pretty decent from this distance....

ian

[Ole Anderson]

That Delta 18-900L looks like one fine machine: 3/4 hp, 5/8" chuck, crank to lift the table, I like the flat belts. And you got it at a steal. On the downside I would prefer just 2 pulleys for speed changes, I have a mill that has 3 pulleys and it is a pain to change speeds. I have a Craftsman with a skinny belt and 2 pulleys, easy to change speeds and it has a quill lock. And I constantly use the printed drill sizes/tap sizes chart on the side of the machine. Also I see the Delta does not appear to have a quill lock, it looks like you need to use the depth stop to perform that function. That is almost a stopper for me. All in all, I would trade it for my Craftsman and put up with the shortcomings.

I have a mill-drill but with the HD vise it almost never sees service with wood, just steel and aluminum.

[Jeff Duncan]

I'm jealous of you guys in the US - there seems to be such a wide choice of slightly older properly made used stuff for sale for very decent money. Even the higher end Delta machines with the long spindle travel look pretty decent from this distance....

ian

That's true....however if your a shop like mine always trying to improve the quality of your equipment, your not in too bad a neighborhood! For you it's a much shorter ferry trip to the mainland where there's plenty of fine German made machinery that's as good as it gets! The Grass always 'looks greener' though;)

JeffD

[Kevin Guarnotta]

That looks pretty sweet. I am trying to decide about making my own vs buying one. The woodpeckers seems to be the nicest one out there. Not sure I can make it cheaper than theirs, but I could make it bigger. What is your table made from? It looks like MDF with a laminate top? Also how do you attach it to the press? Could you give me an idea of the overall dimension?

[Cary Falk]

That looks pretty sweet. I am trying to decide about making my own vs buying one. The woodpeckers seems to be the nicest one out there. Not sure I can make it cheaper than theirs, but I could make it bigger. What is your table made from? It looks like MDF with a laminate top? Also how do you attach it to the press? Could you give me an idea of the overall dimension?
Kevin,
I'm not home right now so most of this is from memory. The two outside t-tracks with the measuring tapes on them are 24". The 2 inside t-tracks are 18". I believe I cut 2" off of one of them to account for the table height crank. The fence is 36" long. That puts the table around 18-24" wide. The 2 pieces on the outside that extend past the column are 3" wide. It is made out of 2 pieces of MDF faced with maple and covered in black formica. I cut 4 pieces of wood the size of the "plus" slots that are cut in the table and glued them to the underside of the table. This keeps the wood table from shifting on the metal table. I then screwed the table on from the bottom through slots using wood screws and washers. HTH

[Gary Herrmann]

I picked up a Jet 20" DP earlier this year for under a grand. It sat in a warehouse for 5 years. They go for $4k new. Think of it as an offshore PM 1200 clone.

I looked for a PM1200 in good shape forever, but never found one.

My point is, you can find something lightly used or that has been warehoused for awhile if you keep your eyes open.

[Kevin Guarnotta]

Hey cary, that is a sweet looking table. I had a couple questions about it (thought they posted the other day, but realized they didn't).
Approximately what size is it?
How do you attach it to the drill press?
For the t-tracks with ruler, do you actually use the ruler? I could see using it for the fence, with the stops-but I don't think I'd use it for the t-tracks?
Victor suggested having the insert sort of off-center, I think so yo ucan rotate 180 degrees and keep using it? did you do that?
For the adjusting screws under your insert, how did you put those into the wood? Are they just screwed in, or did you install threaded inserts?

One last thing - it is made from MDF right?

[Alan Lightstone]

How do you prevent from drilling into the table with that Grizzly Mill/Press?

[Cary Falk]

Hey cary, that is a sweet looking table. I had a couple questions about it (thought they posted the other day, but realized they didn't).
Approximately what size is it?
How do you attach it to the drill press?
For the t-tracks with ruler, do you actually use the ruler? I could see using it for the fence, with the stops-but I don't think I'd use it for the t-tracks?
Victor suggested having the insert sort of off-center, I think so yo ucan rotate 180 degrees and keep using it? did you do that?
For the adjusting screws under your insert, how did you put those into the wood? Are they just screwed in, or did you install threaded inserts?

One last thing - it is made from MDF right?

Kevin,
Some of you questions did post yesterday and the answersto those can be found a couple post up. For the new questions... I thought I would use the rulers on the t-track but I do not so it is a waste of money other than it looks cool. Maybe some day they will come in handy. The insert is offset a little bit so I can use each one 4 times. If you offset it too much or make the insert too small you can't use large forstner bits. The screws are just screwed into the wood(MDF) below. I thought they would hold position better then a threaded insert. It is MDF down there so once I screwed the screw in I removed it and strengthened the hole with super glue. Seems to work so far.

[Keith Outten]

How do you prevent from drilling into the table with that Grizzly Mill/Press?

Alan,

Milling machine tables have T-Slots that you normally use to secure a vise or some other attachment to the table. When you are drilling you can place the drill bit over one of the slots or secure a wooden table to the milling table which is what I often do depending on the job. I have also made a wooden table with a cleat on the bottom that I can hold in my drill vise for small jobs and I often use this setup for keyhole routing small signs. Milling machines are built for side loading and vertical drilling so routing on a mill is never a problem as it is on most drill presses.

Milling machine tables move in both X and Y directions so you don't have to do the old tap tap tap when you need to align a bit to the center mark, you just turn the handles until you are on the mark. I purchased a power feed for my mill/drill that is a handy feature. I can also quick disconnect the drill handle and use the precision down feed which is graduated in 0.001" increments.
.

[Alan Lightstone]

Alan,

Milling machine tables have T-Slots that you normally use to secure a vise or some other attachment to the table. When you are drilling you can place the drill bit over one of the slots or secure a wooden table to the milling table which is what I often do depending on the job. I have also made a wooden table with a cleat on the bottom that I can hold in my drill vise for small jobs and I often use this setup for keyhole routing small signs. Milling machines are built for side loading and vertical drilling so routing on a mill is never a problem as it is on most drill presses.

Milling machine tables move in both X and Y directions so you don't have to do the old tap tap tap when you need to align a bit to the center mark, you just turn the handles until you are on the mark. I purchased a power feed for my mill/drill that is a handy feature. I can also quick disconnect the drill handle and use the precision down feed which is graduated in 0.001" increments.
.
Thanks, Keith.

I installed a Craftsman X-Y vise on my drill press, underneath the Woodpecker's table. I just remove the Woodpecker's table when I need to do that type of operation.

It's time consuming compared to having the milling machine, but it does work.

BTW, that Grizzly G0619 6" x 21" Mill / Drill with variable speed power feed looks amazing.

[Keith Outten]

My Mill/Drill is simular to the G1007 (http://www.grizzly.com/products/Mill-Drill-w-Variable-Speed-Power-Feed/G1007). Its an older model that cost about $895.00 when I bought it years ago.

I like the G0619 mill and the dovetail column feature.

[Kevin Guarnotta]

Thanks cary...for some reason I could not find my post, and I think I know why now. I was hitting the 'reply' button instead of 'reply to thread' so when I went to look for my post it was not at the end of the thread. Sorry for the double post, and thanks for the answers. I'm going to take that, plus your pictures and look at the woodpeckers version...then probably design something trying to combine the best of all of them.