Grizzly 3HP shaper (on sale for $950!) or Laguna "Compact" 3HP shaper

[Phil John]

Hi everyone,

I just got my Grizzly Christmas catalog and am seriously considering the G1026 3HP shaper for $950 plus shipping. After searching the net for alternatives, my thoughts are to consider the Laguna "compact" 3HP shaper for $2199. It looks suspiciously similar to the Jet 3HP shaper (35X3-1), which is selling for closer to $2800, apart from different color paint.

That said, this machine will be used for home use and will maybe run enough lumber through it to fill a house with furniture if it is lucky (some bookcases, maybe bathroom cabinets etc). I'm not looking at creating mountains of flooring, but may create some floorboards (say 1500' total). The extra $1000 is a lot of money, but I have been given permission by the boss to spend that "if that is what you need". A very loosely defined term that seeks to rely on my potential feelings of guilt if I buy something excessive. Like a $2199 Laguna.

For those of you that already own a shaper, which way would you pull the trigger? The laguna is here: http://www.lagunatools.com/shapers/HD-Shaper_3

I'd gain a more modern design and better dust extraction (not insignificant given I'm working in half a 2 car garage and the wifeys car parks in the other half). Not sure if the flat belt will give me any huge benefits? Quieter maybe or more even torque application? I'm not sure if the Laguna is safer, but it looks to me like the cutters would be more enclosed and less chance for debris flying about.

There is a steel city for sale second hand which I may look at, but it looks very similar in construction to the grizzly - same factory in Taiwan perhaps?

Thanks in advance for any advice you can give this novice / just starting woodworker.

Phil

PS I realize from doing some thread searching that 5HP is recommended, but I'm not sure I can justify the price increase on my limited budget. I'm not in a huge rush so making 2 passes doesn't phase me.

[Cary Falk]

I have the Grizzly. The fence is nothing special and am always looking for something better. That being said, it works fine in my hobby enviornment. I have heard so many horror stories and have had a negative experience with Laguna CS that I wouldn't touch their shaper with a 10 foot pole.

[Carl Beckett]

Hi Phil,Have you considered looking for something used? I see a pretty steady stream of used shapers on CL, often with cutters included ( shaper cutters are $$$$! If $2k is the max, then you need to budget at least $500 for cutters, maybe more )

[david brum]

You might also consider the Shop Fox W1702. It's about the same price as the Grizzly with what appears to be a nicer fence. If you shop around, you can usually find free shipping on shop Fox machines. The 1702 has a better warranty, too. I have a bunch of their stuff and have had excellent customer service.

Don't forget to budget for a feeder, especially if you're planning to do a bunch of edge profiling for flooring.

[Sam Layton]

Phil,

A couple things to consider in your shaper purchase. I think, bigger is better, 5hp 1 1/4" spindle. However, that being said, it sounds like in your application a 3hp 3/4" spindle will be perfect. I have two Delta 3 hp 3/4" spindle shapers, and one power feed. My first shaper I purchased new years ago new. I forgot what I paid for it. My second shaper, I purchased off of Craig's List. I paid $750.00, and it is like new. My first shaper has the better fence, but the second fence is fine. My point being, you could find a real nice shaper from Craig List, and get a lot more for your money. With a 3/4" spindle, the cutters are a lot cheaper.

My Delta 3hp has a lot of power. I have never had to take two passes because of lack of power. Like David said, for doing things like you mention, a power feeder is a must for me. It gives you a better cut, and the most important part, it is SAFER.

I am not familiar with any of the ones you mentioned. If you buy new, check out who has the best fence. Also, if you buy new, I agree with Cary...

Sam

[Mike Delyster]

Another vote for used, Like Sam
I also have two Delta 3hp shapers, I bought both of mine used one for $600.00 and the second one for $400.00. The first one came with alot of accessories and a box full of cutters this can be one of the bonuses of going used. I added a $500.00 power feeder to the first one, this is something you should budget for. For hobby use I think the 3hp shapers with 3/4" spindles are a good size.

[Jay Rasmussen]

Phil,
I have a Delta 3hp, plenty of power for me. I’ve never had to take two cuts on anything due to not enough power.
Grizzly vs. Laguna:
I purchased an oscillating spindle sander and a drill press from Grizzly, the sander is great the drill press is/was a boat anchor.
I purchased a band saw from Laguna, fit, finish and function are excellent, however, I don’t care much for the ceramic guides.
Generally speaking I think you get what you pay for. I agree with the other guy’s if you have the time and patients used could be a great way to go. I have nether.
Have fun!
Jay

[Rod Sheridan]

Hi, in my opinion it's the Laguna hands down

- much better fence, and a shaper lives or dies by its fence.

- larger spindle size

- 4 speeds including a lower one for larger cutters. I often use larger cutters, including grooving cutters, and saw blades and dado cutters. You'll need a 3,000 to 4,000 RPM range for larger cutters and the Laguna has that, the Grizzly doesn't.

It's all about money, pay more for a better machine, you won't regret it. I use my shaper a lot, don't forget to order a 1/2HP or larger stock feeder at the same time.

A year ago one of my buddies needed a stack of 3/16" wide strips sawn, setup the shaper with a rip blade, set the power feeder, all the strips are perfectly consistent and no fingers any where near the cutter. You'll use for a lot of things.............Regards, Rod.

[Jeff Duncan]

Rod has made some good points most of which I'd agree with. Larger spindle size and slower speeds are a good benefit.....with a caveat! Small quills and bearings with large spindles are not the ideal arrangement, and that's what many of the entry level machines do. They take the same quill used for a 1/2" or 3/4" spindle and simply make a bigger spindle for it without increasing the size of the quill or bearings. It's OK for light stuff, but not so good if you try to push the machine:o Lower speeds are also good to have mostly for running large diameter heads and cutters. However if your machine has those smaller bearings....it may not be good to run really large heads too often! This is probably why the entry level machines like Powermatic 26's and Delta HD's usually kept only the higher speeds? I'm not sure, but I can tell you it took me only about 2 years to kill the bearings in my Powermatic 27 occasionally running large 4" tall heads!

As far as the fences go I disagree a little with Rod, I have the opinion that a good shaper is more important than a good fence. Or put another way, if I can have an OK shaper with a great fence, or a great shaper with an OK fence....I'm going with the better shaper. Remember many of the older industrial machines didn't even come with fences, or at best were offered as an option! It doesn't take much of a shop made fence to get a lot of work done. Having said that having a full featured fence is really nice! Laguna seems to have the edge with the fence they're offering. Most entry level shaper fences are garbage so you have to apply some value to the upgrade.

Now as far as power goes this is a subject I find somewhat over rated. Manufacturers have catered to the customers desire for more and more HP without regards to whether or not the machine can actually make use of it. For instance, I believe 5hp motors may be more than the small bearings on a Unisaw or Delta HD shaper were ever designed for or could handle when pushed. IMHO a 3 hp motor will do anything that size machine was designed to handle.

I haven't used any of the machines your looking at, so I can't give you advice on which to buy. My first impression is the Laguna offers some nice features for the price if your committed to buying new. Then again you can get a heck of a lot more machine for that kind of money used.....if your so inclined;)

good luck with your decision,
JeffD

[Shiraz Balolia]

If you are going to spend over $2000 for a shaper then you should consider:

http://www.grizzly.com/products/5-HP-Professional-Spindle-Shaper-Z-Series/G5912Z

Much more shaper than the others on your list. These shapers have been in use at the Gibson guitar factory for over 10 years. They have several of them. Some people will spend your money freely, but I think you will do just fine with the G1026 shaper. FYI - I build serious guitars as a hobby as well and have both the G1026 and G5912Z in my shop. The G1026 has plenty of power for everything I do, but I needed a dedicated shaper for taller spiral cutters for guitar necks.




http://i45.tinypic.com/s2xhlx.jpg

[Jeff Monson]

I'd do a little searching for used, if time permits. I like the Griz for the price, but the fence IMO leaves alot to be desired. I like a good fence on my shaper. Not sure what you can pick up a PM2700 for nowdays, but its a great shaper with a great fence. I'll second Cary's advice on the Laguna CS, I have read a ton of bad things about it.

[Rick Fisher]

I would go with the $950.00 Grizzly .. Buying a shaper is like buying a boat.. The true cost doesn't kick in until you own it .. lol

I have a $1200 General international shaper .. And then added a $1000 Power feeder and about $1600 worth of cutters.. Presently, I never have the right cutter on hand .. I need more cutters.. lol

I agree with Rod that the fence on a shaper is a big deal .. but I also believe that you could modify the fence if you felt qualified .. They are actually pretty simple.

Shapers with power feeders are amazing tools .. The feeder improves the cut quality in a big way, and makes the machine safer in my opinion..