First Lathe encounter: Skew help on bead

[Fred Bryant]

I have just aquired a small delta midi-lathe. The only tool I aquired with it was a skew. I have spent today playing around and so far I can:

1) Rough from square to round
2) Cut a shallow cove
3) Part using the long point down
4) Face using the long point down

What I can not seem todo is cut a bead without a spiral catch running the skew up the length of the work. Now, I will admit my only instruction is watching some youtube.

Can anyone offer any magic words of wisdom?

Thx's, Fred ( who is being smoked out of the fiery NW ).

[Roger Chandler]

One of the best things you can do is join a woodturning club and get some personal instruction.........you will cut the learning curve light years, by having an experienced turner help you with tool presentation, use and sharpening skills..........trust me, there is nothing you can do to help yourself more than this to get up and going.

You also need some other tools......spindle gouges, bowl gouge and parting tool........a roughing gouge also for making square stock round.......although you can do this with a skew..............the skew is the hardest turning tool to master.

[Brian Brown]

One day and you have gained skills in all four of those areas? :eek::mad::eek: Five years of trying with the skew and the only thing I have mastered is the last one you listed, the spiral running the skew up the length of the work. :mad: Congratulations! I think I'll just use my skew for a doorstop.

[Fred Bryant]

Mastered?

NO, just have been able to successfully do these things a couple of times after multiple tries. Have not been able to accomplish a single 1/2 of a bead. I very accomplished on the catch though.

So, I am in Wenatchee Wa, any turning organizations present?

Thx's, Fred.

[Ryan Mooney]

Dang Fred I'll echo others if you've managed to get that far with a skew in one day you have a bright future :eek: Honestly if you can get the skew mastered the rest is easy (I haven't mastered the skew.. its possible that no one has ever truly mastered the skew :D).

Disclaimer: (pretty much all) others on here are MUCH better/more experienced turners than I am, but what seems natural to most of them is something I have to think about - a lot - to get anything done so maybe my neophyte perspective will help :D

So if you watch this video (and I"m sure others, but I'm to lazy to search a lot) and look really close
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjieQ1ftFog
you'll notice that when he's using the "heel" he's actually not using the heel at all, just getting really really close. Basically you're doing the same planing cut you use for making round, the difference is that you have to get really really close to the heel catching in order to cut the curve but not quite let it catch (and when it does.. well whee spirals). The closer you get to disaster the better the cut is :D Personally I use the other technique he demonstrates of using the point to shave beads a lot for small beads. Its not very efficient for larger pieces but I find more control with small bits.

The other thing I've found with the skew is that you probably have your tool rest to low (maybe not, but its something that took me a few weeks to figure out anyway).. Raising my tool rest a little above where I was comfortable dramatically improved my results with the skew (but drop back down for gouges, etc..).

I really wish this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTXLYRyeuCA was shot from above.

I also re-ground my skew to have a slight curve. It made a lot of the cuts much easier

As for local help.. I have a similar problem that there isn't a lot within easy driving distance; closest I've found to me was Portland. Here are a few areas to try,
http://www.nwwwt.org/ - unfortunately meetings are over on the other side of the hill..
http://www.woodturningguild.com/ - portland but might have members somewhere near you
http://www.inwwoodturners.com/about.php - might be closer, meets in Spokane

I might also drop by "Traditional Woodcraft" in leavenworth (and any other stores I don't know about) and see if they have pointers to helpful local folks.

[Jake Helmboldt]

Fred, good for jumping on in with the skew. I did the same and I think it made all the other chisels easier. Practice makes perfect. It has been a while since I've done any spindle turning and when I get the skew out it is always a bit dicey until I get back in the swing of things. A couple tips; make sure you don't lift the bevel, that is when the edge catches and runs back on you. With a bead you are moving the skew in three dimensions; roll it and both swing and slightly lift the handle as the skew dives down and arcs across the bead. It always reminds me of a plane banking into a dive so the skew follows that path while remaining in contact with the wood. Has to be fluid. Also, make sure you are using just that first quarter or third of the edge, whether long or short point.

That's my non-expert 2 cents.

[Thom Sturgill]

The skew is a hard one to master but well worth the time. I had always wanted to make a gavel and used that for skew practice when i was trying to learn it. I gave the result to our turning club. No one else has mentioned them so I'll give a call out to the Alan Lacer videos - 'the Skew Chisel' and 'Son of Skew' they are excellent tutorials on the use of the Skew. Alan curves the short heel of his skews. Jimmy Clewes does some skew work on one of his videos - 'Back to Basics' I think and he grinds the skew muck like Eli does in the You Tube video linked above. Straight edged but rounded rather than hollowed edges. I have tried both as well as conventional hollow ground and each has its place.

As you may well have realized from the answers so far, the skew is far from commonly mastered. Most turners seem, in fact, to have a fear of using the skew, so in this case even if you do find a club, you may not find a person to train you with the skew. Don't take that to mean you should not find a club - it is the BEST way to further your skills in turning other than having hands on training with a real pro. In the mean time, get Lacer's video, it is far better than anything I have seen on you tube. Its a good investment if you want to continue using the skew. I pull mine down from time to time and use it for review as I do not use the skew constantly having become more proficient with gouges.

[Fred Bryant]

Thx's. I will check out the DVD.

I had some more time to practice and turned out a couple of somewhat wonky beads. I went through a couple of 8' two-by-fours cut in half to do it. Of course I then split my lip on a catch ( the skew handle came up under the face shield ). I guess I am going to have to travel and find some one on one instruction.

On a side note: I had a face shield on and a disposal N95 mask on ( I turn outside on the deck ). I still managed to split my lip. So, what is the norm for safety equipment?

Thx's, Fred.

[Ed Morgano]

Fred, good for jumping on in with the skew. I did the same and I think it made all the other chisels easier. Practice makes perfect. It has been a while since I've done any spindle turning and when I get the skew out it is always a bit dicey until I get back in the swing of things. A couple tips; make sure you don't lift the bevel, that is when the edge catches and runs back on you. With a bead you are moving the skew in three dimensions; roll it and both swing and slightly lift the handle as the skew dives down and arcs across the bead. It always reminds me of a plane banking into a dive so the skew follows that path while remaining in contact with the wood. Has to be fluid. Also, make sure you are using just that first quarter or third of the edge, whether long or short point.

That's my non-expert 2 cents.

One other piece of advise.... When you are cutting a bead, you ALWAYS start at the top of the bead. If you lose the cut, you can't back up just a little, that will cause a catch every time. Lift the skew off the piece and start back at the top.

[Thomas Canfield]

Like the others say, the skew is probably the hardest to master. I watched Alan Lacer and that helped some, but a lot is just practice and not getting in a hurry. As Ed said, one you start, you can't back up. You can stop and start over, but backing up will get you a catch. I'm sure you have learned to only use the lower half of the cutting edge unless you have the point down. The only other hint is to be sure your skew is sharp - a sharp tool requires less force and cuts the wood and not tears the wood. You should be able to have a nice smooth cut with the skew removing thin shavings when properly sharpened, and honing also helps.

Welcome to the spinny world.

[Bernie Weishapl]

I love my skews. I have I think 7 or 8 of them. I got the DVD's by Lacer that Thom mentioned. Several hours of practice. I still get a spiral at times but 95% of the time they work wonderfully. I would definitely recommend getting those DVD's. About the best on skews.

[Scott Conners]

I had the exact same issues at first, when I had a lathe and no grinding jig. My skew was the only tool I could sharpen, so that's all I used. Having the skew very sharp is important, for me that means honing with a diamond card. I also found rolling the corners of the skew with a file really helps it move more smoothly on the tool rest. When I eventually got my grinder, I found a curved cutting edge (leave the first 1/3 of the blade straight) is far easier to handle. Skews need a firm, almost forceful hand, you can't hesitate.
What wood are you turning? Some woods are much harder for a skew than others. Maple is the best I've used in my limited experience, though any of the rosewoods reward good skew work with amazing polish.

[Fred Bryant]

Thx's for the info. Currently I need to save some green stuff for more tools/acc ( currently will be skipping lunch for the next month to pay for the lathe ;) ). Currently the only tool I have is a 3/4" skew that sweetened the deal for the lathe. I rounded the corners, gave it a covex bevel, and made it sharp. I also use a DMT red diamond hone after the grinder. As far as wood, 2x4 scraps ripped down the middle. At least until next payday, it is practice on this or nothing.

As far as safety equipment, I take it I using the approperate stuff. I guess my skew loves me and just needed to give me a kiss :).

I will try rounding the top 1/3 of the cutting edge and will see how that goes. As far as the 2x4's, the knots are a killer. On the otherhand, I am just making shavings at the moment.

Another question, what would be recommended as other starting stuff? The lathe came with a nova chuck and 5 or six jaws, which I have not used yet. It also came with a set of nova tailstock centers and gadgets. I think this will get me buy as I learn, so I can buy other pieces based upon projects. Tools are another issue though. The number of choices, with contradictory information, seems bewildering. What would a small stater set need have?

Thx's, Fred.

[Thom Sturgill]

Fred, while many recommend just what you did (rip down some 2x4s for turning stock) others will tell you that soft woods are HARDER to turn than harder woods are. Personally I like cherry and maple. The harder the wood and the tighter the grain, the better it holds detail. Cost however....

At to starting tool brands, PSI (Penn State Industries) carries the 'Benjamin's Best' line which are inexpensive but decent quality. Packard Woodworks carries a store brand that is about the same or just slightly better. Sorby tools are probably a step up from those and are widely available. On the very bottom of acceptable, Harbor Freight has some kits (only the two top priced ones) which are usable learning tools.

As to tool types/ sizes - I would add a 3/8 spindle gouge first and a spindle roughing gouge (bigger is better) to make square stock round. You can learn to hand grind these, but some type of jig (most use the wolverine jig) is a great help. You can sharpen the spindle gouge either in conventional or fingernail grind. I greatly prefer the fingernail for most work but use both. You can vary the angle of the fingernail grind to be almost as sharp as you would get with a detail gouge, but it will have less metal to support that edge.

I would also look at both a larger and a smaller skew. I rarely use my 3/4" skew (cheap HF variety) in favor of the 1/2" (also HF) and a 1 1/4" heavy skew ground like Alan Lacers.

When you are ready to tackle bowls, there are a large number of gouges and sizes that come into play as well as scrapers, and as many recommendations as turners. My recommendation would be to veiw as many DVDs as you can get your hands on and decide what techniques you like and follow that.