$969 to replace my brakes,forget college, I'm going to brake replacement school

[dennis thompson]

I had my 2008 Ford Explorer in for an oil change. The shop called & said I needed new brakes. I wasn't surprised since the car has 41,000 miles on it, so I asked him how much it would cost (4 wheel disc brakes). He said he'd prepare an estimate for me when I picked up the car. I picked up the car & got an estimate to replace the brakes of $969 :eek:. My wife tells me I'm living in the past but $969 for a brake job seems awfully high.So here's the question: I (a former auto repair shop owner myself) am currently sending my grandson to college, should I pull him out & send him to brake repair school:rolleyes:?
Dennis

[Gary Max]

Around here the service depts are keeping dealerships alive.

[Todd Burch]

I don't know how shops can justify that type of price. I can replace disc brakes with my eyes closed. That's about $242 per wheel. New pads are ~$25/wheel. Unless there's damage, the rotors don't need to come off. It would take me about an hour to do all 4 wheels - in my driveway, with no help.

Highway robbery.

[Adam Neat]

Brake "replacement" can mean a lot of things, anything from just removing the old pads and replacing them, to turning or replacing the rotors, flushing the brake fluid.

At 40k miles I would think new pads would be fine, but I havent seen your brakes, or the estimate.

[Scott Shepherd]

You've hit one of my pet peeves. I understand people have to make a living, I do to. But if I did to my customers what dealers do to their customers, I'd be out of business.

I just replaced a fuel pump on a truck this weekend. They quoted $800. Said it was 4 hours labor. I did it in 45 minutes, sitting in a parking lot with few a handful of tools. Part cost $165.

I don't know about the brakes on a 2008, but I've put brakes on many ford trucks and it's very fast, especially when you put new rotors on. It's also not that expensive, as Todd said.

[glenn bradley]

I don't know how shops can justify that type of price

"The Book" says this job takes X amount of hours. The car makers set an MSRP for the parts. The fact that the job takes an experinced person one quarter of X and that the parts can be had for less does not factor in. As Gary pointed out, these folks are fighting to survive. Cutting you a fair price isn't in their thinking; Scott's example makes this clear. On the upside, its a Ford. There has to be plenty of shops that can do a brake job. I was surprised to find that Midas was competitive with others in my area and with the lifetime brakes, you only pay labor on the next jobs from then till you dump the vehicle.

[Gary Max]

I still crawl my fat butt out and change my own oil---- I figure when I get to darn old to do that myself maybe I need to buy a mule.

[Luke Pighetti]

I generally do all my own work, but for those times where I don't have a shop available or time is money, I take it to a mechanic. I always try to pick mechanics that don't have ASE certification but have dozens of repeat customers. These are the guys to have on speed dial. The only thing that keeps them in business is the quality of their work. Bonus points if their shop is a barn with a lift in it.

[Brian Kerley]

Disc brakes are so easy to do yourself it's not even funny. I'm assuming your total is for new calipers, new rotors and new pads. I know a saturn is a bit cheaper than a ford, but hell, I just did my fronts for $35 in pads...total. Oil changes are cheap enough that it's hard to justify doing it myself. But brakes, man, the prices just aren't in line with the effort. They are easy to do and way cheaper than paying someone.

[Scott Shepherd]

I just wanted to add, I have a ton of respect for mechanics and their talent. A good mechanic is a great person to have on your contact list. I have no problems with mechanics, I have issues with the way their industry is structured and how they bill people for time not used.

If I quote you an hourly rate, then I should charge you for the time it took times that rate. If I told a customer our hourly rate was $80 per hour and they agreed to pay that, and the job took me 1 hour, I'd feel like a criminal if they walked in and I handed them the a bill for $320 and told them somewhere, someone in the world said that job took 4 hours, so I just charged you for 4 hours, even though it only took me one hour. I seriously doubt I'd be in business today. I can't think of any other industry that posts an hourly rate and then charges you for time they didn't actually spend doing it. I honestly think it's criminal.

I know all the examples, "yeah, but if I tell you 1 hour and something goes wrong and it takes me 10, are you going to pay me for 10?". Well, my response would be name me one other business that doesn't have to eat their mistakes. I eat my mistakes. If I quoted you 1 hour and it took me 5, then I shouldn't have quoted you 1 hour. That's my fault, not yours. Now, if during that something happens, like a bolt breaks off inside the engine and has to be repaired, you'd have a dialogue with the customer and explain that additional work was required and you'll do your best to resolve it as efficiently as possible, and then you bill them.

But you can't charge me for 10 hours work when you only worked 2 hours. That's just wrong.

[Peter Kelly]

Why were they looking at your brakes if you were there for an oil change?

[Gary Max]

They need the money???????????????????

[Ken Fitzgerald]

It is not unusual for a dealership to check things like brakes, struts, electrical system etc., when they change oil. My dealer does a 19 point check including checking the charging system, battery etc.

I was leaving on vacation from Idaho. I talked with my dealer about the oil change. Currently it had about less than 2,000 miles on it but I knew I was driving over 4500 miles before returning home. The dealership said get it changed at my most distant destination. I took it to a dealership on Bloomington, IL. They changed oil and pulled up the history on my vehicle. They asked if I would like the tires rotated as it had been a while. I explained I had a tire dealer rotate them before I left home. I bought my vehicle used from the auto dealer and the previous owner had their tires rotated there. The tire dealer rotates them free and they always use a torque wrench to tightened the lug nuts so I prefer to have the tire dealer rotate the tires. Pl

[Greg Peterson]

I did a quick lookup. Parts (pads, calipers and rotors on all four corners) are roughly $400 @ jobber. Who knows if the job requires any hoses or seals, but these parts are relatively inexpensive.

With the low cost of rotors these days, it's almost a push between replacing or turning. I think shops prefer to hang and bang rather than turn rotors.

Beware, if they quote you on Bendix rotors, have them clarify if they are Bendix or Bendix Global. Bendix Global is the economically priced brand. FWIW, I use Bendix Global and have had no problems.

[Jim Matthews]

I still crawl my fat butt out and change my own oil---- I figure when I get to darn old to do that myself maybe I need to buy a mule.

Whars the oil go inna mule?

I'm purty shore I know whar it cums ott...

[Jim Matthews]

Were the other service bays empty, by chance?

I go with an independent wrench.
He does what's needed, and is the only one under the car.

He charges more on oil changes, less on repairs.
If he's licked by a task, I can always go to the dealer.

[Mike Cutler]

Uhmmm,,,,,,,,, 41,000 miles and you need a complete brake job? That seems a little soon for me, unless you've been doing a lot of towing.

FWIW, $969.00 for a complete brake job, while excessive is better than the $2K a BMW dealer will try to charge you. The wanted $1200.00 for just my fronts. It cost me $500 to do all 4 myself.
Being that you're a former mechanic, I can't see that any brake job would stump you.

I'd leave the grandson in college, the mechanic doesn't get all of the money.;)

[phil harold]

I pay my mechanic 1 beer per tire and I supply parts and then drink the beer
I like brake jobs I know I will get some beer when I am done!

[Brian Elfert]

I find it interesting that I can sometimes get brakes and such done for less on my 43 foot motorhome than for my car. I know several places that charge $75 an hour for my motorhome and they mostly charge actual time.

[Jerry Thompson]

I was not put on this earth to keep auto shops in business. For the most part I am a mechanical idiot. I have a 1986 BMW and a 1993 Ford Ranger. I have a book for both of them and my wife keeps them running just fine thankyou.

[John Fabre]

Replace them yourself, new pads, rotors and calipers would not cost that much, 4 hrs max.

[Jerome Stanek]

I just replaced the brakes on my F350 myself this included new pads new rotors and new calipers on all 4 wheels plus a 15 foot brake line for $450.

[ray hampton]

I just replaced the brakes on my F350 myself this included new pads new rotors and new calipers on all 4 wheels plus a 15 foot brake line for $450.

Did you pull the gas tank to install the brake line

[Chuck Wintle]

I had my 2008 Ford Explorer in for an oil change. The shop called & said I needed new brakes. I wasn't surprised since the car has 41,000 miles on it, so I asked him how much it would cost (4 wheel disc brakes). He said he'd prepare an estimate for me when I picked up the car. I picked up the car & got an estimate to replace the brakes of $969 :eek:. My wife tells me I'm living in the past but $969 for a brake job seems awfully high.So here's the question: I (a former auto repair shop owner myself) am currently sending my grandson to college, should I pull him out & send him to brake repair school:rolleyes:?
Dennis
it would be interesting to see to see the quote and/or the cost of the parts.

[dennis thompson]

Thanks for all the advice, I think I'll do them myself.
Details of the quote(for all 4 wheels)
brake pads $185
Rotors 405
labor 220
brake fluid service 80
Shop supplies 17
tax 62
total $969
Note that new calipers were not included. It is not a dealership, it's a shop that's part of a local chain.

Dennis

[David Weaver]

Why would the car need new rotors at 41000 miles?

[dennis thompson]

Why would the car need new rotors at 41000 miles?

That's a good question. Should the rotors always be replaced? I looked at them and they don't appear to be scored
Dennis

[Jerome Stanek]

Do the brakes pulsate if not your rotors should be good if they do see if you can have them turned.

[Kathy Marshall]

Have you looked at the pads to see if they are actually that worn? I agree that 41k is not very high mileage for new pads, let alone rotors. My Toyota Tacoma got it's 1st brake job at 140,000 miles, the pads were replaced, the rotors were turned, drum brakes in the rear got new shoes. I just did the 2nd brake job (myself), front wheels only at 215,000 miles and replaced pads and rotors, parts were around $100.

[Steve Schlumpf]

I just replaced the front disc brake pads on my 1997 Chev S-10 this week and it cost me less than $40. If you can - replace the pads yourself and save your money!

[Greg Peterson]

$400 for rotors looks a little high. Curious as to what brand of rotors he wants to install.

$185 for pads is close to full retail. Looks like he's charging less than three hours labor.

I assume the brake fluid service is a complete flush.

Quick and fast is highly over rated in my opinion. Stopping on command is a much more desirable attribute.

[Mike Cutler]

Why would the car need new rotors at 41000 miles?

Depending on the state, it's to comply with laws. Honest, I'm not pulling your leg.
Some states require a minimum pad to rotor/drum contact, as in 100% contact. Compound this with the fact that a lot of new OEM spec'd rotors really don't have the thickness to allow being turned down and still meet minimum thickness. Add in an impact wrench to rotate tires and it's pretty easy to distort a set of rotors.
It's easier to replace the whole thing as a package.

[Brian Elfert]

A lot of places don't recommend turning brake drums or rotors any more. I know the drums on my motorhome can't be turned and they were not cheap for new drums. I want to a school on air brakes in June and the recommendation was to always replace drums instead of turning them. A big part of it is liability and part of it is that brake drums for most large vehicles just aren't all that expensive.

[Ole Anderson]

Yea, disc brakes are easy, drums not so much, I refuse to do them anymore after putting one together wrong. Most rotors can be turned once, take them in and your local auto parts shop can tell you if they can be turned at about $10-15 each.

My local GM dealership, complete with salon, cafe, and a shop for the ladies only charges $10 for a lube/oil and filter, hoping to nick you for found problems. But everyone I know uses them just for oil changes and it works if you know how to say no. But recently my van (at 160k miles) was pulling hard to the left, so I changed the front calipers for under $20 each and less than an hour per wheel. My NAPA auto supply suggested a number of items it could be, including a bad brake hose. New calipers didn't help. Well I didn't want to just start changing parts, so I took it in to the fancy GM dealership, telling them I just put on rebuilt NAPA calipers, which NAPA stocked. After about an hour, sipping on the free soda they gave me and surfing the web on their free wireless hot spot, the service advisor came in and said it must still be a bad right caliper, and she suggested changing it out at a cost of something like $280. But they didn't have one in stock. I passed and asked if they could change the right front brake hose. She looked up the price and said, yes they could at a cost of about $220, but they didn't stock the part. So I stopped on the way home and picked up a brake hose NAPA had in stock and changed it myself. That fixed the problem at a cost of $17 and about an hour. I was happy to pay GM $58 for the diagnostics and test drive to eliminate other front end problems. Hooda thunk a brake hose would cause a hard pulling left problem? My boys at the friendly NAPA parts shop did.

[Joe Pelonio]

Shop around next time if you don't want to do it yourself. I recently had a vehicle (Jeep) with metal-on-metal in the fronts, and was quoted $429 with new rotors at a big chain tire shop, then $224 at another. That's a big difference. Went with the second and was happy with the work. Normally I do them myself too, but that would have cost me almost $200 for the parts so I was happy to pay a little more to have it done. Plus, I got a free tire rotation since I'd bought those from them.

[Greg Portland]

Why were they looking at your brakes if you were there for an oil change?
This is a common ploy by repair shops & dealers. Do some loss-leader oil changes and "find" problems with the car that will result in high-$$$ repairs.

[Adam Cruea]

Trade you the bill for my Harley.

$1600 for brakes, rotors, new tires, and an oil change.

Drive the bike about 12K a year. Every year, go in with bald tires and chewed up brakes.

[Eric DeSilva]

$500? I was considering doing the brakes on my '05 330Ci and I found OEM (Mintex) pads and some performance cross drilled rotors for under $250. What else did you replace? Either way, that's one helluva labor charge.

[John Fabre]

I replaced (myself) the drum brakes (4 wheels) with disc kits on my 69 Charger for only $3,500.00. Everything is new, remember, it's not how fast the car goes, it's how well it stops.

[Brian Elfert]

This is a common ploy by repair shops & dealers. Do some loss-leader oil changes and "find" problems with the car that will result in high-$$$ repairs.

I got the oil changed for the first time on a brand new car. They wanted to check the alignment because they claimed even a brand new car could be out of alignment from the factory. I declined.

[David Weaver]

Depending on the state, it's to comply with laws. Honest, I'm not pulling your leg.
Some states require a minimum pad to rotor/drum contact, as in 100% contact. Compound this with the fact that a lot of new OEM spec'd rotors really don't have the thickness to allow being turned down and still meet minimum thickness. Add in an impact wrench to rotate tires and it's pretty easy to distort a set of rotors.
It's easier to replace the whole thing as a package.

I think I'd use the cheapest rotors I could find if I lived in a state like that....if they had to be changed out with the pads every time. I know others wouldn't, but I would! One of those cases where it's easier to save a dollar than make a dollar (i would, like anything else, read a forum quick to find out which of the cheapest rotors were OK, though).

[David Weaver]

Side story, when I was in sears a few years ago getting a tire (my wife had gone through the sidewall on one of our car's tires, at 5k miles on the car, and sears was the only place local carrying a matching tire), I sat in the sears waiting room. Their price on the tire wasn't great, but it actually wasn't too bad.

As I'm sitting there, some tech comes out to every single person with a tray that has a color coded chart on it. Every single person, he did the same spiel to "we checked your oil, and it is dirty, and that could cause trouble. We'd recommend that we change it".

I had changed the oil that day or the day before with full synthetic and it was still pretty clean looking - if you'd have flattened a drop out it still would've been very clean. This guy comes walking back out to me with a piece of paper with "my" oil on it, it's black as night (i have no idea where he got it) and tells me I need to change my oil.

I suggested he figure out what car the oil came from, because my oil had just been changed and it wasn't that dark yet. He apologized real quick and ran out of the room, and didn't come back with mine.

You're not safe from it anywhere you go. I'll bet the oil sample that he was bringing out to most of the people wasn't even their oil, it sure wasn't mine. How hard would it be to pull the dipstick and get a drop of oil off of it? I guess harder than having a go-to source of dark oil and just dipping a drop out of it.

I know they're in a competitive business, and nobody working there is really getting paid too much, but that kind of thing ruined my whole experience there and it guarantees I'll never go back.

[Jason Roehl]

Rear brakes shouldn't need to be done at 41,000 miles. I've done them for the first time on several vehicles at well over 100,000 miles (I even had factory front brakes go to 105,000 miles before they got replaced for the first time).

In recent years, I've spent up to $200 for new pads and rotors for just one pair of wheels--without getting the most expensive available. Since asbestos was banned from brake pads a number of years ago, the compounds to get good, quiet stops have gone up quite a bit in price.

As for rotors, if they are not replaced, they should be turned every time--and even sometimes when they're new! Calipers should go well over 100,000 miles, too--I've had several vehicles go to 150,000 or more and the calipers still worked just fine (not so much for brake cylinders on drum brakes). I also repack with grease or replace the bearings.

I've probably paid for most of my mechanical tools just in labor costs saved over the last 15 years of doing my own brake jobs.

[Kevin Bourque]

I just replaced the front disc pads on my Tacoma and I believe it cost me around $40-50. For anything more involved i let a pro do the work, but brakes, oil changes etc. are my Saturday job.

[Marty Paulus]

just did a little experiment for ya. At my local chain auto parts store. New pad and rotors $267 + Tax. That was using the premium parts as well. Almost $1000 for the job? What are they smoking and why are they not sharing??? Unless there is something I am missing you are getting taken for a ride. Do it your self.

[Ben Hatcher]

College is still most likely to be the better investment, but I see no shame in having your grandson come over and work for his tuition ...and learn how to do a brake job in the process.