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View Full Version : FS35 jointer/planer gloat, move account. Long



Dan Forman
04-13-2005, 5:47 AM
Well, I finally took delivery on my Mini-Max FS350 jointer/planer. Luckily Roadway Express was very accommodating of my work schedule.

It was an interesting experience, to say the least, getting it across the back lawn and into the basement. The truck arrived at 5:30, on what until then had been fairly pleasant, weather wise. At precisely the moment the truck pulled up, the wind picked up to about 30 mph and the temp dropped about 10 degrees. The lift gate could barely hold the pallet, we had to lend support as the driver was trying to maneuver it onto the lift before bringing it to ground level. More than once I feared it would fall off the lift.

As soon as the driver left, it started raining. Luckily the beast was covered by a huge plastic bag inside the crate, so it didn't take on any water as we broke up the crate and pondered the best way to get it from the alley to the house (it blocked the endtire alley). Not sure of how to go about this, I had several things on hand, and we ended up just using the included mobility kit, and pulled it across the lawn on leapfrogging pieces of plywood, which worked pretty well, with two pulling on a rope in front, and me pushing and steering from behind.

Now the fun part began. The plan was to mount it onto two skids made of 2 x 6's, cut to extend about 3" to the front and rear of each leg, and slide it down the stairs on two planks, each made from two 2 x 6's which were held together with 2x4's and screws from the underside at three locations along their 8' length. Turns out 2 x 8's would have been much better for the skids, as one of the front legs is turned sideways, and so is much wider than the others. This led to one skid being a bit skewed to the other.

The front and rear of the skids were angled at 45 degrees from the ground to ease negotiation of bumps and such. Once on the skids, it became much harder to move, it didn't really want to skid at all. We borrowed a trick from the egyptians, and rolled it to the stairs on steel bars that my neighbor had. By this time the neighbor and his brother had joined the festivities, lucky for me. Once a few bars were under it, it rolled pretty good, just needed to replace them in front as they came out from behind.

So now it was perched on the landing. The twin 12" wide ramps were now screwed to the top stair from below, by mitered blocks of 2x4 which bridged the gap from the underside of the ramp to the top of the stair. This would prevent them from being pushed out by the movement of the machine. The tops of the ramps had been angled at 45 degrees to ensure a smooth transition to the ramps. There is a picture of this below.

While I was under the stairs fastening the ramps in place, the crew was attaching a block and tackle to the machine to control it's descent. They decided on the only available attachment point on the machine itself, which was where the mobility kit lift engages the lift bar. Unfortunately, this is not centered, but is to the left on what was now the rear of the machine. In hindsight, it would have been better to make some sort of harness to center the load, as the unit tended to veer to the left, and had to be redirected back on track several times on the way down. A second rope affixed to the other side to balance the force did little or nothing to change it's course, so it could also have been the fact that the left skid was skewed to accommodate that pesky out turned leg which led it off track. Luckily the block and tackle performed well, so halting the progress to steer ( a 2x4 used as a lever between the wall and the machine) was not difficult. Not so lucky was the damage done to the unsupported wallboard next to the steps, which now has several holes where it met the 2x4.

One thing in planning that I overlooked was how to fasten the J/P to the skid for it's descent. I thought that if the feet were surrounded with blocks of wood screwed to the skid, that gravity would hold it in place. This works fine on level ground, but at the full 45 degrees down on the stairs, the rear end was lifting, threatening to lift out of the blocks. Needless to say, this caused some excitement. It was solved by wrapping a couple of nylon belt tie downs over the top of the machine and around the pallet front and back. Again, the block and tackle made this relatively painless.

At last the front of the skids made contact with the floor, but were held there pretty firmly by gravity and friction. It took the egyptian trick to get moving again, using a lever to lift the skids enough to get the bars under them, and three of us sitting on the ramps and pushing with our feet. Once on level ground again, the wooden blocks were removed and the beast lifted enough to get the skids out from under it.

In the end, the machine got down in one piece, nobody got hurt, and I saved three or four hundred on moving fees. I even called a machine rigger, they wanted $300 an hour with a four hour minimum, Needless to say that was not an attractive option. I spent over $150 on materials for the move, lumber, ropes, pullys, and 4 heavy duty castors, and assorted other items. The castors, which were never used, will be returned and $45 recouped. Much of the lumber will no doubt be used for other projects eventually, and now I have a couple of nice ropes and pulleys which will probably come in handy some day. I suppose I am bound to buying pizza again for my coworkers again

Just a side note, a block and tackle is apparently a thing of the past. I was unable to find one to rent or buy in my metropolitain area, or out in a rural area where my dad lives. They apparently have been supplanted by come-alongs, which for letting down a weight are not nearly as convenient. As I suspected would be the case, simple, ancient machines were what was required to get this piece down into the basement. There are times when a forklift or pallet jack are just not feasible, and in such cases, the simple lever, pulley, and inclined plane will save the day, not to mention backs and limbs. Thanks for bearing with me through this rambling account, thought it would be helpful for anyone else facing a similar situation, to know what worked and what didn't work so well.

And to satisfy the pic police, here is some documentation. Unfortunately, I was much to busy to take pics during the process, but here is the result of our efforts this evening. It took about four hours from when the truck pulled away to setting the beast down on all fours. Part of this was actual work, much was trying to figure out what to do next. Glad I didn't try this on a work day, which for me starts at 3pm.

The first pic was not severely cropped in order to cover up any mess which some of you might think exists in my basement. In actuality, I am just making an artist's statement, yeah, that's it! The second shows how the ramp was held in position on the stairs, if you imagine it is at a 45 degree angle, and fastened from below through the stair tread. I will be moving a couple of those angled blocks to a 10 inch wide pine board, which will be used ot help slide sheetgoods down the stairs on edge, without banging on the steps on the way down. some sort of non-skid pad will be used rather than screws to hold it in place.


Haven't had time to clean it up at all, or even unpack the blade guard or attach the other hardware, so such view will have to wait until the full shop tour, after the dust collector arrives and is set up. Outside of the DC, this is the last major tool on my list, at least for the time being. I now have to see where things can be situated to produce the best working arrangement, so that I can go ahead with the DC ductwork design, and finish up the 220 wiring. Eventually, I will actually be able to use this stuff!

Aaron Montgomery
04-13-2005, 7:52 AM
Nice Score!! I'd love to have one of these eventually and would have the same exercise getting it into my basement. Enjoy your new toy!

Alan Turner
04-13-2005, 8:21 AM
Dan,
Good work. I too have a couple of heavy guys in the basement, and it was hard work and required much thought. To get a 780 lb. planer down with me and one other, we strapped it to an appliance dolly, and secured it with a comealong which was attached to the back of the masonry house via a 2/10 of hard maple, and taken down a click at a time, which seemed plenty fast.

Michael Gabbay
04-13-2005, 8:35 AM
Nice jointer/planer!

I have a similar issue with my basement shop. 13 stairs, no walkout. Last fall I brought in a Bridgewood 17" bandsaw. It weighs in around 300 pounds. Getting it in was fairly straight forward. Getting it out may be a little more interesting! :eek:

Mike

Jeff Sudmeier
04-13-2005, 8:40 AM
Congrats on getting it down there in one peice.

I have done two heavy moves. Both printing equipment. Both times we used a 5000lb winch. Once it was coming out, the other time it was going in. Both times it worked great! Biggest thing in a move like this is to not trust your winch or block and tackle. If it would let go a machine like these would kill a man.

Jim Becker
04-13-2005, 9:07 AM
Congratulations!!! You're gonna love that machine!

(And I'm glad my shop was at ground level when my friend Russ and I brought my FS350 home awhile back...his lift gate got within 3 feet of the shop doors...hee hee)

Pete Harbin
04-13-2005, 9:28 AM
Nice Dan! That jointer is almost as long as your tablesaw is wide. They should change the naming convention on those to LS350 (Landing Strip.)

Fortunately for me, if I ever bring in some big iron like that I just have to open the garage door. :D Now if I just had the budget... :rolleyes:

Congrats Dan!

Pete

Tyler Howell
04-13-2005, 9:48 AM
Nice Haul Dan!

Let's see it covered in wood chips.:cool:

lou sansone
04-13-2005, 12:19 PM
congratulations on the new machine.

what made you decide on the combo machine? cost, space effency, other?

just wondering.

thanks lou

Steven Wilson
04-13-2005, 1:44 PM
Nice moving job. When you go to move it out of the basement you might want to look at a few more riggers. I went with Lovegreen Industrial; besides rigging and moving they do metal fabrication, repair, and a whole bunch of industrial services. My rigging cost was $65/hr, no minimum, and 1$/mile for the 18 wheeler delivery, total cost for moving my CU350 was $250 (rigger, fork lift, tilting flat bed trailor, Kenworth tractor, and guy, receive from trucking company, un-crating, etc)

Dan Forman
04-13-2005, 2:24 PM
Thanks guys!

Lou (and others who are considering major purchases)---It was not an easy decision for me, time will tell if it was the right one. If the 8" Grizzly jointer with spiral cutter head had been in stock 6 weeks ago, it would have been down there instead of the MM, accompanied by a DeWalt 735 portable planer.

With my first choice (at that time) unavailable, I started researching alternatives, and seeing what others here were using. Many people were saying to get the biggest jointer possible. I started thinking about some of those nice, wide boards of quilted maple I frequently lust after (in my heart), and what a shame it would be to have to rip them before jointing.

As is my pattern (you'd think I'd learn, lol) the more I read about jointers and planers, the more I thought I needed to pay for the features I wanted. Talking with Sam at Mini-Max when ordering my band saw opened my eyes to the combo machines. As I have a modestly sized basement, the space saving factor was appealing. The Tersa cutter head meant no fussing with setting the knives, another plus.

So it came down to the choice between a Delta DJ20 and a 15 inch planer, jointing wider boards on a sled in the planer, or the 12 inch Mini-Max combo. The separate machines would have been converted to the Byrd Shelix cutterheads to facilitate working with figured woods, and to get away from those pesky knife changes. As such, the cost for either option would have been very close.

In the end, I went for the bigger jointer, space saving and higher overall quality of the Mini-Max combo, but somehow managed to talk myself into the 14 inch model (more robust, longer beds, 2" wider). I did look around for used machines, hoping I could score an older American made Delta or Powermatic, but around here anyway, none could be found. The HUGE old machines that you and Alan are so fond of were out of the question due to weight and space considerations, and lack of three phase power, not to mention availability.

Three months ago, I never would have guessed that I would have paid so much for either this piece of equipment or the MM16 bandsaw. I don't generally have this sort of budget, so I figured I had best get the best I can now, because I wouldn't likely to be able to upgrade in the future, and it would hold it's resale value if I ever did need to sell (perish the thought).

To be honest, I still wonder if I made the right decision on this one. I'm sure I would have been well served by other equipment, and would have had more left over with which to buy some of that fancy wood, and a bunch of other tools like LN handplanes and such. That 14" flight deck overpowered every other consideration however. I have also found that Mini-Max lives up to it's reputation of great customer service. Sam and Jim have very patiently answered my many questions, and never pushed a bigger sale---it was my idea to upgrade from the 12 to the 14.

Now a question for you. What exactly is a "pattern shop" I have been reading your posts and taken your shop tour, and this term comes up frequently in relation to your behemoth machines. So I am wondering what they make there, and why they need such gigantic equipment?

Dan

Ted Shrader
04-13-2005, 4:04 PM
Dan -

Congratulations on your new mondo piece of equipment. And thanks for the detailed description on getting it down to the basement. Sounds like some real thought went into the process. Well done!

Congratulations,
Ted