Help with VFD for a jointer planer

[Jeff Monson]

Looking for some 3phase help please. 1st off I have another 3 phase machine in the shop that I run off a Kay industies RPC it is a Felder saw shaper. I recently aquired a
3phase AD741 jointer planer with a 5.5 hp motor. I think this tool I'd like to run off a VFD drive if possible, I looked at a couple different ones and they state the wiring must go
directly to the motor. Well with this J/P it has additional electonics that must be powered also. Can anyone recemmond a VFD that can be wired to run the entire machine? or is this
not possible? I have several 220 outlets in the shop so I'd like to use the machine in different locations, powering it with my RPC would limit me to 1 area, unless I start running long cords (which I dont want to do). I'd like to mount a VFD on the machine to keep it mobile. Suggestions?

I'd also consider a static phase converter, I know they reduce the overall HP, but I dont mind that on this machine.

[Mike Heidrick]

If you have a Kay i would make that work. You would not have any issues with braking on the RPC like you may have with the VFD. Id make an extension cord personally. It will be as mobile as your dust collection I am thinking.

If you must run a VFD, specifically what electronics/switches will you need to use besides just spinning the motor?

[John McClanahan]

Many VFDs need to be derated when used with single phase input. A 5hp VFD that can convert single phase is fairly expensive, and will output around 3-1/2hp. To me, a static converter would be the way to go if you don't need speed control.

John

[Peter Quinn]

Does it have the power table raising? I'm up to (three) three phase machines in my one man home shop, I just ran branch circuits with romex cable where I need them, sized the romex one size over to compensate for any potential voltage drop. They are what I might call "semi-mobile" machines, so I ran the power cord a bit longer than I would for a stationary tool that just had to reach a plug in a static situation. I suppose the VFD would allow you to run both 3 phase machines simultaneously should that be necessary, otherwise I don't see any advantage to that versus just running a few extra circuits and powering them on the RPC. If your RPC is large enough to run both than I see no real advantage for that type of machine. For me being able to run any additional 3 phase machines was one of the primary reasons for installing the phase convertor versus a VFD.

[Stephen Cherry]

can you post a schematic, or more info on the machine? THe question would be if the machine has a separate feed motor, as well as the cutterhead motor, and how the raise lower is done.

If there is a separate feed motor, it would need a drive, and the cutterhead motor would need a 10 hp drive.

[David Kumm]

Jeff, you can do it but all the start stop, emergency,etc must be wired to the vfd and the original wiring bypassed. If the machine has a brake - and I don't know if the 5.5 has one - it must be bypassed as well. You need a vfd rated at 10 hp input if you use a three phase in and wire it to a single phase input. I would not put a Felder on a static. Conduit or flex with a fusible disconnect to extend the three phase would be easier to wire than a vfd. Dave

[Stephen Cherry]

I looked at the felder, and my impression without seeing a schematic is that the machine has only one ac motor. It may have a dc raise lower motor, but that is a separate issue. My impression is that you could keep the machine as is, wire the single phase in to the two of three leads that run the controls of the machine, as well as to the supply for a vfd. THen you could disconnect the motor wires and connect them to the outut of the drive. ALSO DISCONNECT ONE OF THE THREE SUPPLY WIRES TO THE CONTACTOR. Then the contactor could be used as the run command to the drive, using the part that has the wires disconnected. This would retain the estop function, etc.

I would need to see a schamatic of the machine to confirm this though. As for the felder wiring and schematics, I can say that the wiring in my K975 is very nicely done, but the schematics are a little hard to read. The wiring and devices are industrial standard though, very nice.

Also, the drive could be the brake.

[Dave Cav]

You are going to need at least a 7.5 HP VFD, and more likely a 10 HP if you plan 220 single phase in and 3 phase out to a 5.5 HP motor. You are NOT going to like what it will cost you. Also, as others have pointed out, you can't have any circuits between the output of the VFD and the motor. The VFD has to go DIRECTLY to the motor. No starter. The VFD is it's own startter, and can be the brake, too as Stephen pointed out.

I think if I had an RPC with sufficient capacity I would figure out some way to use it for the Felder. Good luck.

[Stephen Cherry]

You are going to need at least a 7.5 HP VFD, and more likely a 10 HP if you plan 220 single phase in and 3 phase out to a 5.5 HP motor. ck.

I like the drives wharehouse hitachi vfd, I had a paper from them a while back that states to derate by half, so 10 hp.

Also, another cheap and easy way to wire would be to unhook the three wires from the contactor to the motor at the motor end. One would be dead because of the two phase supply, it would be wire nutted and taped. The other two wires could go to the coil a 220 volt coil contactor. The contacts of the 220 volt contactor would be used as a run permissive for the drive. Something like that would work.

[Jeff Monson]

Thanks for all the great info so far. It has a digi-drive for the table height, that is what scares me about messing with any factory wiring. That is why I went with a RPC to power my saw/shaper. I was hoping for some type of converter I could attach to the side of the unit, run both my 220 wiring and 3phase wiring in and out, and it would work. Looks like its more complex than that. My RPC is in another room and hard wired directly to my saw/shaper, looks like I may have to just run another circuit over to it.

[Rick Fisher]

I would run a wire to a surface mounted box, then put a 3 phase plug on the end of the jointer wire.. Plug it in .. if you want to move it .. unplug it ..

I recently did just this with an edge sander. The parts are kinda expensive but its on wheels and portable..

http://i335.photobucket.com/albums/m455/jokerbird_photo/P1020236.jpg

[mreza Salav]

I'm surprised no one has sadi: that's a nice machine you have got, congratulations!

[John Halsted]

Reviving a pretty old thread here, but I have the same question about operating a 3 phase 4hp AD741 from single phase power.

Looks like the OP hasn't posted in a good while, but has anyone else had to deal with this? The biggest issue seems to be not just the 3 phase power to the motor, but also the power to the peripherals like powered lift.