any way to fill torsion box cells so I can add bench dogs?

[Steven Lee, NC]

I built a torsion box for a workbench not realizing I would gravitate to hand tools and it's driving me nuts trying to come up with ways to clamp things so I can use my hand planes. Unfortunately I sheeted it with wood flooring so I just cant remove the cover without major damage to the mdf underneath to add some hardwood blocks. Is there anything I can use to fill some of the cells so I can sink bench dogs down into it?

Something like foam insulation that fills the cavity behind dry wall but something that will dry or cure into something very hard.

Otherwise I see a possible 3rd bench rebuild coming.

thanks.

[Jack Curtis]

I think I'd set aside the torsion box, use it as an assembly table, and build (not rebuild) a new, solid top. Among other things shooting foam into a torsion box would be an exercise in frustration, even if there were an appropriate substance.

[Steven Lee, NC]

I don't have room for an assembly table and a workbench so it does double duty. My table is about 44" about 85". I'm hoping there is an alternative to wasting time building another top.

[Terry Beadle]

You might try drilling a 1/4 inch hole where you want a bench dog. Then mix up some bondo and inject it into the cavity. Let it sit for a couple days. Then drill the hole out to a little less than 3/4 of an inch. Then drive a piece of copper or iron piping into the hole all the way through. That would give you a tight 3/4 inch hole for the bench dog ( assuming it's a round one of course ). Copper would be soft so if you dropped a chisel on it, it would be less likely to chip the cutting edge.

I don't think the bondo would break down with a pipe lined hole but it would provide enough elemental support so that if you used a soft copper pipe liner that it would give what you need.

Other than that, you could bore a hole where you want a dog, then using a router remove the surface flooring wood to the limits of the torsion box square. Then clean it up with a chisel at the edges until it was square. Then taking some rock maple stock make a plug to fit the square, mounted and glued, then bore the plug for the dog.

Either one will work. The bondo technique would be easier but not by much.

[Chris Griggs]

I'm assuming the problem is that the top is thicker than the length of any commercially available bench dog? If that's the case, buy some high quality (read: accurately dimensioned) dowel stock and make some extra long bench dogs, then you can just drill your dog holes all the way through and still be able to adjust the dogs from the underside. You could also start using planing stops in leiu of clamping, stop are a lot more convenient in many situation anyway.

[Todd Burch]

Have you considered filling with Epoxy?

[Ralph Boumenot]

How about cutting off one row of "cells", if you have a plan of the layout. You could cut off the outside skin insert wooden blocking where you want dogs and glue an apron on to close it up?

[Steven Lee, NC]

Got some great idea, thanks!

I like the idea of using plugs except I'll try using dowels for plugs and then boring a hole through that for where I want to use the lee valley wonder pups and extra long bench dogs made out of dowels for the rest of the holes :)

This seems to be a real cheap fix as well. Filling the cells with epoxy might get kinda pricey but I have no idea how much expoxy is. If I recall the cells were 4" x 4" x 2.5" .

Not sure I want to try cutting off one row of cells. No idea where the pin nails are located.

[Todd Burch]

Not sure I want to try cutting off one row of cells. No idea where the pin nails are located.

FYI - I cut through <real> nails ALL the time. Carbide spinning @ 130MPH wins every time.

Pin nails would be a easier on a blade than some hard pine knots!

[Rodney Walker]

There's a strong chance you won't be satisfied with any attempts to fill the voids. For the time, trouble, money and possible frustration involved, you may be ahead of the game just to start building another top. I understand wanting to keep the old one but as you've already stated, your current bench isn't designed for the purpose you now want it for. I don't think anyone builds their ideal bench the first time and there is the possibility there are other aspects of your current bench you're not satisfied with as well. If so, this may be the opportunity to correct those issues too.
If you know anyone just getting started in woodworking maybe you can jump-start them and give your old bench to them.
Rodney

[Dustin Keys]

Do a google search for Tom's Torsion Box Workbench. His design allows for bench dogs, and you could probably retrofit a similar front rail to your existing bench.

D

[Steven Lee, NC]

nice idea, thanks


Do a google search for Tom's Torsion Box Workbench. His design allows for bench dogs, and you could probably retrofit a similar front rail to your existing bench.

D

[Tim Janssen]

I'm assuming the problem is that the top is thicker than the length of any commercially available bench dog? If that's the case, buy some high quality (read: accurately dimensioned) dowel stock and make some extra long bench dogs, then you can just drill your dog holes all the way through and still be able to adjust the dogs from the underside. You could also start using planing stops in leiu of clamping, stop are a lot more convenient in many situation anyway.

I think that's an excellent suggestion. I use 3/4" dowels as bench dogs on my bench and they work just fine. I put a short section of snug fitting hose or tubing on the top part of the dowel to prevent them from falling through.
Good luck,

Tim

[Jim Matthews]

How thick is the top "skin" with the MDF and flooring sandwich?

My bench dogs are only about 2 1/2" long, and they hold just fine.
If you're considering a retrofit, you could easily rip a strip with a circular saw and straight edge to get access - as mentioned above.

I think you're on the right track to adapt your bench to your purposes.

If it was my bench, I would NOT cut bench dog holes -I would build a fixture (http://uppercutwoodworks.com/tag/logan-cabinet-shoppe/) to put on top, instead.

I have a row of dog holes about 4 inches from the front apron, and another parallel row about 16 inches back from them.

They're NEVER in the right place. I'm looking for the workpiece to be pretty much 1/2 the length of my handplane in from the front apron, when planing.
Any further back, and I can't reach it comfortably. Any closer, and the workpiece skitters away under the force of planing.

Edge planing can be done right on the top of your bench with handscrew clamps (like my Jorgies) held to the bench with longer "F" clamps.

I once had an inset vise from Veritas set up, and it was a PITA.

I strongly recommend a browse of Bob Rozaieski's Logan Cabinet Shoppe podcasts - his methods are readily adapted to most workshops.
In the primer podcast on flattening boards, you can see at 17:25 (http://logancabinetshoppe.com/blog/2010/10/episode-27/) the sort of set up I now use.

Note that the board is not fixed, but it doesn't slide around, either.


An alternative would be to apply battens where you need them, I mainly plane against a thin stop that is clamped to the front vise, at my left hand side.
If you're left handed (and plane left to right) you would place the stop at the right hand side of the bench.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PM9H08TL46I&feature=related



(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PM9H08TL46I&feature=related)

[Joe Cunningham]

Why do you need bench dogs to plane? I have a torsion box benchtop and just use a planing stop. There are times I'd like to use a holdfast, but usually for mortising, and in those cases I just grab a clamp off the wall and use that to hold the piece down. Not as quick as a holdfast, but it works. For edge jointing, I use clamps (again) to hold the piece like a vise against the side of the bench. Most woodworkers have plenty of clamps, just sitting there doing nothing for most of the time.

Try a planing stop--I used a 1/4" ply strip screwed into the top, and work with it a while to see if you like it. Even for narrow stock, I just use the planing stop for edge jointing. This forces you to use proper pressure on the plane, on the toe at the start of the cut and on the heel at the end. If you don't, esp at the end of the cut, you'll feel the piece want to jump up as you put too much pressure on the toe.

[Jim Matthews]

Why do you need bench dogs to plane?

What Joe said, and he's better looking than me even.
I went to a great deal of trouble to drill two rows of dog holes in refitting my bench.

A simple wood strip and a couple screws works better (dang it).

jim
wpt, ma

[rick carpenter]

I have an idea for you...

Make sure you have extra box skin laying around. Cut out a say 4" diameter hole on one side of the box and a same or smaller size hole on the other (just make sure it's larger diameter than dog hole desired). Cut a filler block of 5+" diameter into quarters. Manipulate and glue quarters into place. Cover holes with filler skin plugs and drill though for dog hole. You use the "shear" strength of the glue to hold the filler and skin plugs into place rather than a basically edge-glued through plug. That's for one hole though. For a series, consider cutting rectangles and proceed similarly.

The only problem is that your skin material might wallow out. If you think that will be a problem and still want to stick with this torsion box, then use skin plugs of real wood.

[Brian Ashton]

Like all bench dog holes they need to go right through so just do that or they fill up... That is unless you don't have a bottom sheet to the torsion box. Then make the bench dogs long enough to work with the thickness of the top.

Foam will compress and be useless and bondo or something like that will be extremely expensive