Let's talk about resaw/rip Bandsaw blades

[John Coloccia]

So I've recently picked up another bandsaw. I found a nice, G0555 that was practically unused, with a riser block.

235066
There's the evidence for the stealth gloat. LOL. So I immediately took off he guides and stuck a Carter stabilizer on this thing. First of all, let me tell you the Stabilizer ROCKS, and the 555 is one heck of a nice saw for not much money. I can't believe how easy it is to follow a line with no wandering and no problems at all. This is the real deal, guys! The Stabilizer was worth every penny.

Anyhow, I now have a dedicated curve cutting bandsaw, and a dedicated straight line/resaw bandsaw....enter, my trusty G05142X2

235067

Currently, I'm running a 3/4" Woodslicer, and let me tell you this cuts through wood like hot knife through butter. Incredible, really. The only thing I hate is that it dulls so quickly. I want to replace it with some sort of long life, carbide (or whatever) something or other that will resaw and straight line rip like crazy. In fact, I've been playing around with the idea of not really needing a table saw in my shop for anything, or at least putting it on wheels, chopping the rails and storing it in a corner somewhere for occasional use.

So what says the collective? Keep in mind that I don't think this thing will properly tension or run a massive blade like a 1" Resaw King. It's silky smooth the 3/4" Woodslicer but I wasn't at all impressed with a 1" Timberwolf, to be honest.

[Van Huskey]

On the carbide front the best choice for that saw is a Laguna Resaw King in 3/4". It has a .024" gauge backer which keeps the absolute pressue low and also has the benefit of a narrow .041 kerf as well. It arguably leaves the best finish of the resaw blades as well and easy relatively cheap sharpening via Laguna.

I also like the Trimaster and Woodmaster CT from Lenox but the WM only comes in 1" and the Trimaster still has a thicker gauge at 3/4".

The middle ground would be a bi-metal blade, much cheaper than carbide tipped, much longer life than the hardened spring steel like the Woodslicers (Atlanta Sharptech stock) or carbon BUT without reducing the set and resharpening they won't leave as nice of a finish as the Woodslicer and certainly not the carbide blades.

[Andrew Hughes]

Hi John,I did have a 16inch laguna for about 10years.The best blade i ever ran on the saw was the resaw king.I did try the trimaster 1/2 wide the cut was good and it did last.But not as good as the RK blade.I stopped buy the expensive blades because i kept suck small cut off pieces down and bending teeth and kinking the blades.The last blade i bought for the saw was a olsen mvp.025 i think about a four tooth..Its a good blade i think i got from black stone ind. or something like that .The 16 inch laguna ran a 132 inch blade.I did try the bimetal blades thicker than .025 and was not happy with the cut or the noise the blade made running thru the guides.Hope this helps Andrew

[John Coloccia]

I wonder if there's anyone out there that's switched from a 3/4" Woodslicer to a 3/4" Resaw King and can give a comparison for performance and blade life? My blades are 143", which is a $250 Resaw King. For $250, it needs to last over 6 times longer than a Woodslicer just to break even. I wonder if I should just buy a bunch of Woodslicers, especially when you consider occasional damage that can happen for whatever reason.

What does the sharpening cost from Laguna, Van? I'm using my BS enough cost is starting to factor into this sort of stuff. Will I really save money with a Resaw King, especially considering that I'll need two of them (one working while one is being sharpened)?

[Andrew Hughes]

John the resaw king will cut circles around a woodslicer.On good dry stock the finish from a resaw king will sometimes look like it came off the table saw.It will also zip right thru pau ferro all day long.The wood slicer blades i have used would dull quick on most tropical woods.I used to send my RK blades to Daley saw service in Los Angeles they are not a mom a pop shop.I thought they did a better job than laguna.Same price for a 11' was about 65 bucks but they are local for me.Hope this helps

[Van Huskey]

I keep a Woodslicer (technically a Kerfmaster from Spectrum but it is the same Atlanta Sharptech stock) in the uber thin .016 gauge for when I REALLY want to save wood so although I haven't "switch" I have a feeling for what you are asking. A RK or any of the carbide blade will outlast the hardened tooth spring steel blade at least 10-1 and that is being very generous to the spring steel blades. Sharpening is $45 with return shipping, about $55 per if you ship flat rate USPS to them (it comes Fed Ex back) conservatively you can get 3 sharpenings from 1. So you pay for the first one then get 3 more for about $170. That is through Laguna.

If you do a lot of resawing you can't help but save money with the RK. The RK's finish is as good as your feed, hand feeding will not produce a perfect finish, I am sure you can "read" a resaw and can tell everywhere you increased or decreased feedrate and where you stopped to reposition, it isn't as noticable with a ground carbide tipped blade as a set tooth blade but it is still there. You can get true "table saw quality" with a feeder or I suppose if you are perfect with your hand feeding.

Love or hate Torben one has to give him credit for a near perfect resaw blade for the vertical saws we mere mortals own. When Lenox designs a wood resaw blade they are catering to their industrial users. Take for instance their Woodmaster CT which is technically their carbide resaw blade (the Trimaster is a tough metal blade that just happens to do well with wood) it used to only be available in 2" width, from the outside it might appear they were provinding "us" a blade with their 1 and 1 1/4" versions but they were designed for the wood flooring industry to be used for "gang" resawing stock for flooring. In fact I think they have recently quit making the 1 1/4" version since the 1" ended up better for the flooring industry. The RK was engineered for "us" and "our" saws and it shows.

[John Coloccia]

Well, thank you both very much for all of the input. Resaw King it is! This ought to be fun. :)

[John Coloccia]

I just got off the phone with them. The current deal that they're running for SMC is 50% off the second blade. For me, that works out perfectly well as I was buying 2 anyway (so I could have one while one is out for sharpening), so it's equivalent to the 25% off a single blade. They're also doing $.99 shipping at the moment.

So there you go. Looking forward to my new blades :)

[John Coloccia]

I would strongly recommend following up your order with phone calls and be sure you get an actual tracking number.

[mreza Salav]

It seems you should follow up with them. I'm still waiting to have my RK blades (ordered on 3rd) to be shipped.
Apparently they have had problems with their welding machines that has been resolved (they kept pushing the shipping date on my and are promising to ship it out today).

[Mike OMelia]

Creekers have always gotten good deals on Resaw King blades. Watch the Deals forum for posts from Tim Lory at Laguna. Not sure if Tim is still working that area, but someone always is.

And, I love my Resaw King blades.

Mike

[glenn bradley]

You guys are starting to sway me :). As to sucking small cutoffs into the bandsaw's throat and damaging your blade; a ZCI is inexpensive or easy to make. I use old pegboard scraps but have some plastic ones as well.

[John Coloccia]

So let's talk about blades OTHER than Laguna Resaw King blades. What is the best blade I can put on my BS, other than a Resaw King for resawing?

[Van Huskey]

So let's talk about blades OTHER than Laguna Resaw King blades. What is the best blade I can put on my BS, other than a Resaw King for resawing?

You have a 514 right? Lenox Trimaster, I would probably go with a 3/4" 3TPI (that is a thicker band than the RK) BUT it doesn't come variable tooth, I would rather have the 1" 2/3 Varitooth BUT it will be your call if you want to try it on a G0514 I would be VERY reluctant, you may want to solicit opinions from 514 owners, be aware if their experience is an 1" RK the TM has about 40% more cross section so 40% more pressure to get to the same tension as a 1" RK. Next after that would be the Lenox Woodmaster CT only available in 1" (that will physically fit your saw anyway) and also .035" gauge like the TM so it is a stretch, it is avialable in 1.3 and 2 TPI but not variable pitch.

Better luck!!!

[David Wong]

I use an old Laguna Kerf King (>2 tpi?), and a Lenox Trimaster (3 tpi) for resawing and ripping. Both are very nice blades. The Trimaster cuts is noticeably smoother than than the Kerf King, but the Kerf King will slice through 9" of claro walnut like butter. The Trimaster will cause some burning if I attempt to cut at the same feed rate. I have had no problems tracking with either of these blades. I have only resawn for panels, and not for veneer.

[Van Huskey]

I use an old Laguna Kerf King (>2 tpi?), .

What saw do you have? Thats a MONSTER blade unless they used to make more narrow widths, it is 2" only now. If your saw takes a 2" blade I wanna see pics (unless it is the Laguna Resaw Master since I am familiar with it).

[David Wong]

The kerf king I have is a 1.25" blade. I got it in a deal direct from Laguna ($75) in 2009. I think it might have been a SMC offer. I use it on a 2004 Felder 540. I guess Laguna does not offer this width any more.

[John Coloccia]

Well, I didn't want to do this but I feel I have to so others don't have the same problem. I especially feel bad because I posted their current special in Deals and Discounts, and talked about it here. I'm not happy about having attached my name to this, and sorry to anyone who bought based on reading about that deal here. Hopefully they treated you a little better.

I ordered my blades June 25th. After a couple weeks went by, I sent off a quick e-mail inquiring about the blades. I get a call back saying that they don't know why my blades were delayed so long. Then they upgraded me to 2nd day air shipping and said they would ship them today. Now, at this point I need blades. I can wait for the RK but I need to know what's showing up when and if need be, I can order another Woodslicer to keep me going.

That was last Friday. Weds rolls around, and no blade. Send an e-mail. They call me right back. Finally I get the truth. The machine is busted, but now it's fixed and we'll get the blades right out...sorry. Upgraded me to next day shipping, but it won't go out until Thursday because it's getting late. OK, fine.

"Tim, you're SURE I will have them Friday? I need blades....if you can't get them to me by Friday you need to let me know and I will get another Woodslicer to tide me over". I'm assured up and down that I'll get them Friday.

Friday (yesterday) afternoon I get a call...I recognize the area code and I know it's bad. Someone new calls and essentially tells me the dog ate his homework, someone left early, they got a flat tire on the way to post office, their grandmother died and bottom line, they never shipped them out. Now I'm pretty livid because I've been down for a week and I could have made other arrangements if I had known, but all I get is BS on top of BS on top of BS. Promises me he will ship it out overnight for Saturday delivery.

Get a tracking number...it's not working yet but the e-mail says they went out UPS Ground. I send them an e-mail and tell them to keep their blades. I'm done. Get a call. He ASSURES me that they went out overnight for Saturday delivery. I think, OK...calm down. They're trying. At least I can get caught up over the weekend.

Tracking number starts working. I might get my blades Monday morning. :mad:

All they would have ever had to do is send me a quick e-mail 3 weeks ago saying that the machine is busted and that there will be a long delay. OK, fine. I'll bring in some other blades in the meantime and wait to get these wonderful Resaw King blades. The blades would have shown up sometime next week, and I would have been a deliriously happy customer. Even after all this, if they had actually shown up today, as promised, I would be annoyed but I wouldn't be writing this....I was going to just let it go and chalk it up to several people having several bad days in a row.

But no...here we are. One stupid e-mail with an honest, "Hey, the machine's down...we're trying to get it fixed but there's a delay. It might be 2 or 3 weeks...maybe a month" would have been great. When you think how simple it would have been to make me happy, and then you look at how hard they had to work to piss me off, I can't help but wonder if they don't do it on purpose. It's not the delay....I don't care about that. It's the lies and the incredible incompetence.

Anyhow, I hope these blades last for a good, long...VERY LONG....time because I will never buy another Laguna product ever again. Not ever, under any circumstances. This could have been a piece of machinery that was down. I do this for a living and I can't afford to have any equipment in my shop backed up by a company that lies about product status, and then when they finally start telling the truth they drop the ball left and right. It's like doing business with the Three Stooges. Never again.

[bob hertle]

Wow, John! In a weak moment after reading this thread, I was almost convinced to try a RK! Apparently, Laguna has a great blade, but I've just heard too many horror stories about their customer service and competence. I guess I'll continue to struggle along with my old (resharpened twice) Trimaster, bi-metal, and the occasional carbon blades I've used sucessfully for years.

Regards
Bob

[mreza Salav]

John, my experience is more or less the same, except that I wasn't in dire need of a blade. At least 3 times I was told that the machine is fixed and the blades will go out tomorrow and each time after two days (and no shipping) when I called they said the same thing. Eventually it was shipped on Friday and it seems I'd get it on Thursday.

[Richard Dragin]

I went to the Laguna facility for a David Marks seminar last year. Nice people, gracious hosts, nice machines but I have read these stories about their poor customer service for years.

Recently, on the suggestion of a friend, I ordered some Diamond Sterling blades which are steel and not bi-metal or carbide. I got them from buyfromawoodworker.com which is affiliated with Hal Taylor of rocking chair fame and who's judgement on tools I trust explicitly. I am very happy and feel it out performs the Timberwolf blades I had been using. Turns out a local supplier carries them and will make them up to order so if you are in Los Angeles check out Daily Saw in South Gate.

I know the Lennox blades are also held in high regard but haven't tried them yet.

[David Kumm]

John, I don't know why honesty is so hard. When I consult with business I always tell them to fall on their own sword when crap happens. At least you can pick the spot of the wound. My experience is that when that stuff happens over a period of time it is a reflection of the values at the top.

[Mike Cutler]

John

Wow! that's a lousy way for Laguna to conduct themselves. I've actually wanted to try a RK blade. Maybe in time
I have been using a 1" Lennox Tri-Master, 2/3 varipitch on my Rikon 10-340 since the day I got it. It is dedicated solely to resawing and believe me, it does it well. I know that the width of the blade is supposed to have little impact on resaw function, as evidenced by the amount of folks that use much smaller width blades, but I like the wider blade.
As Van stated the finished cut is reflective of technique, and in my case a somewhat unstable floor. Even with that floor problem I can keep the statistical deviation of the resawn thickness to a very small number, and I tend to resaw some fairly long material. On short lengths,< 36", It's virtually zero deviation.
Your saw is every bit the equal of mine, and probably better, It should be able to handle the 1" Tri-Master if you want to go that route.

[John Coloccia]

I may try the Woodmaster CT next. From some of the comparisons I've read, I believe it outlasts the RK by a large margin and is far and away a better value when you factor in original purchase price, sharpening, etc. I don't think you can sharpen the Woodmaster, but I've heard that it lasts long enough it doesn't matter. Wish I had done that in the first place.

Thinking about it, Mike, my 1" blade issues were all with Timbewolf blades, and I believe much of it had to do with bad welds. I don't know why but I've gotten a lot of Timberwolf blades with bad welds. I've also gotten Woodslicers with bad welds but only one or two.

[Arnold E Schnitzer]

I'm using a 1" Timberwolf carbide-tipped blade on my 18" Laguna. It's well-made, leaves a smooth finish, and can be re-sharpened. I've sent it back once so far, and the re-sharpen was great. On the down side, it's slow (when cutting 14" thick maple), and requires a lot of horsepower. I'd also recommend you think about a custom fence. I re-saw wood that is 4' or so long, and have built a fence that is almost 7' long so that the workpiece is supported well on both sides of the blade.

[eugene thomas]

I am having same issue as john on rk purchase what really bothers me is they charged my card day of purchase, with no idea of when going to fill order.

[Erik Loza]

No dog in this fight except to say that when folks as me for the best finish-cut blade, I always suggest the Lenox Tri-Master and then point them to a vendor such as bandsaw-blades-direct-dot-com or any of the other blade vendors who get mentioned here. Never had one complaint from a referral in all these years. I always suggest buying tooling or accessories from a company who specializes in just that. Just my 2-cents.

Erik Loza
Minimax USA

[John Coloccia]

No dog in this fight except to say that when folks as me for the best finish-cut blade, I always suggest the Lenox Tri-Master and then point them to a vendor such as bandsaw-blades-direct-dot-com or any of the other blade vendors who get mentioned here. Never had one complaint from a referral in all these years. I always suggest buying tooling or accessories from a company who specializes in just that. Just my 2-cents.

Erik Loza
Minimax USA

What size and tooth set do you recommend?

[Erik Loza]

What size and tooth set do you recommend?

For what type of project?

Erik Loza
Minimax USA

[John Coloccia]

For what type of project?

Erik Loza
Minimax USA

It would go onto a Grizzly G0514X2...I'd love to have an MM16 but I haven't talked anyone into sending me one yet! :) I build guitars. I resaw all sorts of wood, from a couple of inches think for bookmatched headstock veneers (ebony, bocote, walnut, etc) to 8" hard maple for tops. I also use it in place of my table saw 90% of the time...I'd love it to be 100% of the time, actually, but the precision just isn't quite there for me yet, no doubt because of my saw and blade. I dimension almost all of my wood on it. The only time I use my table saw these days is when I need something absolutely precise, because it's going into a jig or something like that, or when I'm doing plywood/MDF because I don't want to kill my Woodslicer. I don't think that's as much of a concern for a carbide blade considering how little plywood I use.

So basically, I want everything. Good resawing and a table saw replacement. Honestly, I would get rid of the table saw in a heartbeat if I could really get enough precision out of a bandsaw. Ditto for a planer...I'd rather just cut to thickness than send it through that contraption.

[Herr Dalbergia]

Hello John, you may be interested into this:

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?189252-Saying-Hello-to-the-forum!!!

[John Coloccia]

Hello John, you may be interested into this:

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?189252-Saying-Hello-to-the-forum!!!

The motorized sanding dish is a nice touch. Hey, just FYI. You're going to get dinged for not using your real name to sign up. Send off an message to Keith Outten to fix that.

[Herr Dalbergia]

Thank you, I wrote to Keith Outten.

I think for resawing tonewood the woodmaster Ct might be the better choice. Do you know the discussions about RK and CT on the official luthier forum? Some people had serious problems resawing oily wood like cocobolo, bocote etc with the RK. The RK has a bit to high TPI for resawing wide stock like 8 or 10 inches.
I am very happy with the CT, but will perhaps try the RK also, they are made here in germany....

Cheery, Alex

[John Coloccia]

Thank you, I wrote to Keith Outten.

I think for resawing tonewood the woodmaster Ct might be the better choice. Do you know the discussions about RK and CT on the official luthier forum? Some people had serious problems resawing oily wood like cocobolo, bocote etc with the RK. The RK has a bit to high TPI for resawing wide stock like 8 or 10 inches.
I am very happy with the CT, but will perhaps try the RK also, they are made here in germany....

Cheery, Alex

I think the Woodmaster is available 1.3 and 2. I think the RK is only 2. So you would suggest if I did a CT to take the lower tooth count. I didn't know we had a fight about this on OLF already. LOL. I'll do a search there. Thanks for the info. Oh, and welcome. It's nice to see you here, Alex.

[Herr Dalbergia]

I am going quite satisfied with the 1.3 TPI, 1 inch wide and 0.035 inch thick CT. For maple, mahogani, sprcue and all the soft material the RK is really good. The kerf is less than with the CT, and the surface is also a bit better, BUT the high TPI can make some trouble with the more difficult woods like BRW, Coco, MadRose and so on. BTW the CT is also resharpable. and the differnt in the kerf is not soooo much, but still sometimes quite interesting.

Cheers, Alex

[Van Huskey]

First the RK is 2/3 variable pitch, the Trimaster (in 1") is available in 2/3 VP and 3 TPI, the CT is either 1.2 or 2 TPI. Leaving out the RK the TM will give a better finish than the CT IMPE. I think it has a lot to do with the varible pitch which reduces harmonic distortions and the slighly higher TPI. Be aware that the 1.3 TPI blade is very marginal for use with 3/4" stock but that may not be an issue for you. I have not used any of these blades with highly oily woods over 5-6" thick. They are ALL resharpenable, the key is finding someone that has the machines to do it AND does it well, some have pointed to I think it is Daley saw in So Cal for Lenox carbide blades but I have not approached them or used them.

In the end if I was rough cutting tall hardwood the CT would be my choice, if I was slicing veneer from tall pieces then the TM would be my choice as it leaves a better finish. You really can't go wrong in either case as they will both be much better than what you have used. One good source for Lenox stock is Spectrum Supply and I think Iturra carries Lenox carbide stock also.

Good luck with the next phase of project BS blade!

PS I expressed my concerns about the 1" .035" carbide blades and your saw via PM the other day, just wanted to reiterate that caveat to my recomendations.

[John Coloccia]

Well, maybe I just need a beefier saw, Van. You're not thinking about this the right way :D

[Van Huskey]

Well, maybe I just need a beefier saw, Van. You're not thinking about this the right way :D

The reality is though I have had hands on experince with the 514 is has NOT been with a carbide blade and I am one that likes tension in the high range for carbide tipped blades to get the best out of them. I guess my caveat is based on already steering you wrong once and I don't want to do it again!!! My experince is the 1" Trimaster on my MM20 is as far as I want to go (one reason I like(d) that "other blade" is the thin gauge). The TM and CT at 1" width require 40% more pressure to get the same strain as the "other blade" so it is a consideration, at least to me, not saying it won't work fine just that width would be as big of a consideration as the other blade characteristics to me were I in your position.


Now speaking more out of fun than reality I always see the "shark" as bigger than it is so I always "need a bigger boat".

[Herr Dalbergia]

Van Huskey pointed out something I totally forgot....John, nothing against your saw, but the 1" CT needs really tension, my Bäuerle BS70 is about 800kg and quite solid built, but still I can feel when tensioning the blade the saw has to work. I think my Meber SR600 would not be able tension the CT properly. Your Grizzly may be a bit comparable with the Meber in terms of construction / stiffness. So you might do better with a blade which doesn't need this high tension.

When I started this tonewood resawing thing a few years ago, I started with a way lighter build and smaller saw, but I only started getting good results when I switched to big, heavy bandsaws (btw, these are very often way cheaper than the normal ones...).

Cheers, Alex









Cheers, Alex

[David Kumm]

Keep in mind there might not be enough carbide on the CT for resharpening. I use both the CT and Trimaster and consider the CT to be a resaw blade and the trimaster a combination blade for ripping and resawing. It does carry more carbide. Dave

[John Coloccia]

Well the RK blades are here. Any hints on tensioning this thing. I'm guessing that the flutter method will yield inadequate tension. What would be a good way to tension this thing without over tensioning? It's he 3/4" RK, not the 1".

[John Coloccia]

Keep in mind there might not be enough carbide on the CT for resharpening.

That's what I had heard too, but I also heard it lasts a LOOONG time. I will definitely check out the Trimaster on my next go around, though.

[Erik Loza]

Well the RK blades are here. Any hints on tensioning this thing. I'm guessing that the flutter method will yield inadequate tension. What would be a good way to tension this thing without over tensioning? It's he 3/4" RK, not the 1".

John, I actually think the flutter method is fine. The advice I give to customers (and use, myself...) is that you want the minimum amount of tension required on the blade in order to get it make the cut you want. The flutter method gets you in the ballpark or, what I just do is make a few test cuts and see how much the blade is wandering around during those, than just creep up on the tension until it starts cutting straight. Entirely non-scientific but it works for me.

Glad to hear your blades arrived and best of luck with them,

Erik Loza
Minimax USA

[John Coloccia]

Flutter method it is. I actually have remarkable luck tracking and setting tension on my blades. I don't think I've ever once yet had to adjust for drift on my fence.

Thanks, Erik.

[David Kumm]

John, it should take both hands on the wheel to make the last turn. When you think you have it run an 8" or so piece of hardwood through the blade. If the blade backs into the bearing, tighten another 1/2 turn and check that the spring hasn't bottomed out. I tension so the blade barely moves backwards when cutting and never relies on the back bearing. Bottomed out spring and fast spinning bearing are the two fastest ways to wear out a blade IMO. Dave

[John Coloccia]

So for those who have used a Woodslicer and a Resaw King, how would you compare the feed pressures? I'm finding I have to push hard....very hard, actually....to get anywhere with the RK. Is that normal? The WS cut everything like a hot knife through butter. Maybe I'm just spoiled by the thinner kerf?

It seems as though I can apply more than enough tension. I have two blades here. One of them seems to be OK. The other one is all over the place. It suffers from a MASSIVE amount of twisting and drift. I still can't get it cutting well. The good one seemed to cut OK right out of the chute without doing anything special. Anyhow, just trying to get an idea what I should be seeing.

[Andrew Hughes]

Hi,John sorry to hear about you cs experience with Laguna tools.The rk blades I have used in the past should cut fast just as fast as wood slicer unless they have changed the grind on them.I did get a blade from Laguna that was properly sharpened and they did correct it.sounds like they owe you a blade a fresh one.I dont live too far from Laguna tools so it's not too much trouble dealing with them.But I can understand how much trouble it is for you wish I could help more. Andrew

[Van Huskey]

First, on the tension side I am of the same school as Dave, in that I like a lot of tension (28,000-29,000) PSI on a carbide blade. If you assume the spring is linear then it is going to move the gauge on the saw about twice as much as a Woodslicer of the same width.

Second, in terms of feed pressure, the pressure will be more than a fresh Woodslicer, the WS is thinner kerf and it is much sharper than the carbide tips. For a comparison it should feed about like a 3TPI 3/4-1" carbon blade.

Third, check the welds carefully especially since the machine had had issues.

Fourth, how is the finish?

[John Coloccia]

First, on the tension side I am of the same school as Dave, in that I like a lot of tension (28,000-29,000) PSI on a carbide blade. If you assume the spring is linear then it is going to move the gauge on the saw about twice as much as a Woodslicer of the same width.

Second, in terms of feed pressure, the pressure will be more than a fresh Woodslicer, the WS is thinner kerf and it is much sharper than the carbide tips. For a comparison it should feed about like a 3TPI 3/4-1" carbon blade.

Third, check the welds carefully especially since the machine had had issues.

Fourth, how is the finish?

I checked the welds first thing. They're dead nuts. Very nice welds, actually...I wish all of my blades came like that. Blade #1 is a basket case and it is unusable. The drift is absolutely massive and it required a tremendous amount of feed pressure to cut. Blade #2 cuts OK under 3 or 4 inches, but bows and wanders badly past that. I sliced off a bunch of nice 2" tall Yucatan Rosewood veneers. Again, it requires a good deal of feed pressure, though less than #1. I practically have to lean my whole body into it to cut through 7" of figured maple (that would be soft maple). It's scary, actually. I'll try one more time to crank the tension way way up (though I've tried that already), but I'm afraid I'll brake the blade and then I'll really be up a creek. I'll put one turn on the wheel and see where we end up.

re: the finish
The finish on #2 has marks in it and is wavy. It cut through a 3" or 4" piece of cherry nicely.

Off to test. Thanks for the help.

[David Kumm]

sounds to me like the grind is bad. I've heard of inconsistencies before but thought that had been resolved. It should work so well you don't question it. Dave

[John Coloccia]

Well, I just contacted them to see if there's anything they'd like me to try on the #2 blade. I'd love to have it work and have the kind of performance others get out of it. It's just seeming like the stars just aren't aligned on this one, for whatever reason.

[Phil Thien]

Well, I just contacted them to see if there's anything they'd like me to try on the #2 blade. I'd love to have it work and have the kind of performance others get out of it. It's just seeming like the stars just aren't aligned on this one, for whatever reason.

Is there any chance the blade is inside-out so the teeth are upside down? Just thought I'd ask.

[John Coloccia]

Ha ha....nope :) What's bothering me is they both drift to the right....one more strongly than the other...and it doesn't seem to matter where I track it. Normally I can dial it in with tacking and get it dead nuts.

[mreza Salav]

Your experience with the cut quality is making me concerned as my RK blades are in transit to a friends place in US whom will ship it to me in Canada.
I hope your problems sort out and that I don't need to deal with those sort of problems.

[John Coloccia]

Everyone else seems to have no problems. I think there's a little dark cloud over my head on this one.

[bob hertle]

John,
You're a better man than I am to be able to put a "ha, ha" and a smiley face in your post, under the circumstances. Those blades are just too expensive to have cr*p like this happen! I agree with Van and David that higher tension is in order, I run a Trimaster at 25-30,000 psi. But it sounds to me like you got blades that were either not finish ground, or ground improperly. My experience with the Trimaster, was higher feed force than I was used to with a 3T carbon or bimetal blade. Higher, but not that much higher. The trimaster cuts about the same kerf as my 3T hook 3/4 bimetal blade, resulting in about the same feed force. My 1/2" 3T Olson blades cut with probably 25% less feed force out of the box. The Olsons cut with even less feed force after I modify them, and cut almost as smooth as the Trimaster. All I do to them is touch the face only of each tooth at 6.5 degrees with a 60 grit resinoid bond wheel. This is done very precisely, and quickly in an indexing fixture in a tool and cutter grinder. That lowly little 1/2" 3T blade has become my favorite! I will probably never buy another Trimaster, and certainly not a RK in light of your experience. I find the Olsons have better set control than the recent Lenox bimetal blades I've bought. I've painstakingly measured the set on the last 3 Lenox blades, and found several "errant" teeth--around .005-.007". Those errant teeth will ruin a finish. The Olsons, by contrast measure consistently within .002. Interestingly, DoAll used to guarantee set within .002". My sawn surfaces will usually clean up with 2 or 3 strokes of a cabinet or card scraper. Again, these blades are run at 25-30,00 psi, and I've never, ever had to "adjust for drift", which I believe is a band-aid for some other deficiency in the machine or setup.

Just rambled too long!

Bob

[John Coloccia]

It seems like I'm getting this periodic vibration, and it leaves behind these deep, diagonal lines. I end-up with these periodic columns of diagonal marks in the wood, almost like a hatching pattern. It's quite bizarre. Maybe that will help diagnose what's going on? At this point I don't think it's too low tension. I have GOBS of tension on it. Let me see if I can post a picture.

[Howard Klepper]

One of the best kept secrets in resawing wood is the Lennox Aluminum Master. It has a narrower kerf (.042" iirc) than the Woodmaster and Trimaster. Triple chip grind teeth. Takes a smoother cut than either the Trimaster or Woodmaster. Less aggressive, so you feed a little slower. But I think most of us here are looking more for maximum yield rather than maximum speed.

[John Coloccia]

OK, so I'm convinced I just got a bad batch...nothing more, nothing less. I've made boo boos too, and so have you, so don't read too much into it. I'm annoyed at how the rest went down, but I can't ding them too badly for this because I make mistakes too. I put my dulling Woodslicer back on, and it still slices through 8" maple with hardly any force at all. I have to lean on the RK to the point that I use a push stick starting off the table for fear that I'll run my hand into the blade. I've seen videos of people using this blade, and no one seems to be using that much force. I think the excessive feed pressure is what's causing all of my problems.

I'm going to put the RK back on in a bit. I just really want to convince myself that's the problem. What's funny is that it actually seemed to cut better with less tension, not more. Not sure why that is...completely counterintuitive to me. I will say this...in the areas that don't have the chatter and the waviness/drifting problem, the finish is very very very good. Probably better than off a planer because there's no scalloping. If I can really get that consistently, it's worth a bit of work. The finish off the Woodslicer always has tooth marks in it. Very minor ones...just sand them out really quickly, but they're there. Off the RK, I could take the "good" areas and go immediately to glue up if I really wanted to.

[John Coloccia]

OK...I'm crosseyed. Put the RK back on and I don't know what the deal with #1 is, but #2 is definitely a bad weld. Back and forth, back and forth....Grrrr. I though I checked that. Someone even mentioned it, and I said Yah Yah I checked...what do ya' think, I'm dumb? Of course I checked. LOL. I think I did on #1 but not on #2.

[John Coloccia]

One of the best kept secrets in resawing wood is the Lennox Aluminum Master. It has a narrower kerf (.042" iirc) than the Woodmaster and Trimaster. Triple chip grind teeth. Takes a smoother cut than either the Trimaster or Woodmaster. Less aggressive, so you feed a little slower. But I think most of us here are looking more for maximum yield rather than maximum speed.

Hey, I didn't know you lived here. Thanks for the heads up on that. I don't mind feeding slowly. What I hate is loosing the book match. I have a piece of maple that's waiting until I can get a reliable, clean cut because I REALLY don't want to loose the book match on that one.

[John Coloccia]

John,
You're a better man than I am to be able to put a "ha, ha" and a smiley face in your post, under the circumstances.

Well, I assumed on Friday that I wouldn't see the blades, and I also know that I've gotten things like bad welds and other blade problems from EVERY manufacturer I've used, so I just assumed that I wouldn't have anything Monday and made other plans. Now I'm chipper because I'm not depending on them. I'm a little annoyed that it took me all day and a ton of wood to diagnose a bad weld....rookie mistake...but I didn't have to spend any time on it at all. I was excited to try out the new toys and went down the rabbit hole. LOL :)

[Van Huskey]

Glad you got is diagnosed, but I am very sorry you has so many issues and still do. I almost felt stupid asking someone I knew would check the weld to check the weld but I get excited too. The last time I got a cool new blade I was so excited to try it (had spent over an hour finding the right piece of wood to give it a good test, right before I fired the saw up I realized I had it on with the teeth backwards...

[John Coloccia]

Glad you got is diagnosed, but I am very sorry you has so many issues and still do. I almost felt stupid asking someone I knew would check the weld to check the weld but I get excited too. The last time I got a cool new blade I was so excited to try it (had spent over an hour finding the right piece of wood to give it a good test, right before I fired the saw up I realized I had it on with the teeth backwards...

I would NEVER do that...not twice, anyhow.

:)

[Andrew Joiner]

John, I got a couple of carbide blades from Laguna 2 years ago. They are kerf king or resaw king. They came with a couple of teeth each side of the weld nicked by the grinder when they smoothed the weld off. I have the 21" 5 hp Grizzly saw. I never have any blade drift with any blades I've used on the saw just like you . The King blades cut ok. Not much smoother than a 1/2" Timberwolf on 6" of resaw on various hardwoods.

Laguna sent me 2 more blades for free because of the nicked teeth. Again they left a finish only slightly smoother than the Timberwolf. I did find that the harder and faster I feed the finish was smoother. That seems odd to me. None of the resawing is as smooth a finish as my table saw blades at 3" of cut. I slice 3" southern yellow pine veneer for lamp shades. This requires the smoothest faces I can produce in my shop. I do it on my table saw with a $30 thin kerf blade. It leaves faces that you can see light thru. I barely have to sand the faces with 180 grit. I put several un-sanded veneers up with sanded ones and you have to look real hard to see which ones are sanded. I think I could spend a lot of money on bandsaw blades and never get close to table saw blade smooth.

I've not tried a trimaster ,CT, or Aluminum Master. My gut feeling is a Woodslicer or any blade from sharptech stock would the smoothest. Learning to quickly sharpen them on the saw is my next goal.

To bad we can't buy bandsaw blades test them and return them if the the cut isn't good. With table saw blades I ask "can I return them if I'm not happy" and I always hear yes.

[John Coloccia]

John, I got a couple of carbide blades from Laguna 2 years ago. They are kerf king or resaw king. They came with a couple of teeth each side of the weld nicked by the grinder when they smoothed the weld off. I have the 21" 5 hp Grizzly saw. I never have any blade drift with any blades I've used on the saw just like you . The King blades cut ok. Not much smoother than a 1/2" Timberwolf on 6" of resaw on various hardwoods.

Laguna sent me 2 more blades for free because of the nicked teeth. Again they left a finish only slightly smoother than the Timberwolf. I did find that the harder and faster I feed the finish was smoother. That seems odd to me. None of the resawing is as smooth a finish as my table saw blades at 3" of cut. I slice 3" southern yellow pine veneer for lamp shades. This requires the smoothest faces I can produce in my shop. I do it on my table saw with a $30 thin kerf blade. It leaves faces that you can see light thru. I barely have to sand the faces with 180 grit. I put several un-sanded veneers up with sanded ones and you have to look real hard to see which ones are sanded. I think I could spend a lot of money on bandsaw blades and never get close to table saw blade smooth.

I've not tried a trimaster ,CT, or Aluminum Master. My gut feeling is a Woodslicer or any blade from sharptech stock would the smoothest. Learning to quickly sharpen them on the saw is my next goal.

To bad we can't buy bandsaw blades test them and return them if the the cut isn't good. With table saw blades I ask "can I return them if I'm not happy" and I always hear yes.

Well, I'm going to see if I can get these working. What's encouraging is the bits that aren't wandering and chattering (and I now believe that's from a bad weld on the second blade) are as smooth as anything I've ever gotten out of a table saw. I've never seen anything like it. I'm really hoping we can just resolve it and that I can post back with glowing praise of blade, at least. From my experience so far, the blade itself runs silky smooth on my 514X2, but the tension is cranked pretty high. I'm now convinced that I couldn't properly tension a 1" blade...certainly not comfortable. Getting a 1" blade in and out of my saw is an exercise in frustration, anyhow. There's enough room to maneuver it, but only barely so and it's quite easy to damage a tooth doing it.

[David Kumm]

John, if you tension higher than the frame can handle, wierd things start to happen to the blade. Tracking, moving in and out, etc as the frame flexes under load, particularly when you force wood against the blade. That may explain a small reduction in tension improving your cut. When I used the ACM LT 18 I felt it's limit was a 1/2 x .025 blade for that reason. I think you have blade problems but some of what you describe is similar to my experiences overtensioning the ACM. Dave

[John Coloccia]

I'm going to take something back about tensioning a 1" blade. I have a 1" Laguna Sheer Force here. I just tossed it on there. I tensioned it just fine, went through my standard 5 minute setup (tension, track, flutter, guides and go). Dead straight. I just resawed 9" of flamed maple for a guitar top (yeah, I felt that confident with the blade to just go for it, based on a quick test cut I made). Actually, it did a very nice job. There was a slight bobble that was my fault from feeding too hard...I was experimenting with feed rate and pressure. Other than that, it did a great job and left a pretty smooth surface. No, not like a table saw but nothing a quick shot with the ROS can't take right out. Similar to the Woodslicer but I think it actually tracked just a bit better. I set my bearings CLOSE to the blade, and other than when I over fed the bearings barely moved...I mean, this thing went STRAIGHT, no foolin' around. Maybe that's due to it being 1", but what it did that I liked was as soon as I let up on the pressure, it got itself straight again and finished the cut. Now THIS is what I expect! Good job.

It did NOT take a lot of tension at all to get it cutting well. A little more than a 3/4" Woodslicer, but not much more. I would guess that any saw that can take a 1" blade and can tension a 3/4" WS with a bit left to spare can probably tension this also, if you're looking for a 1" blade to try. It cuts a little slower than the WS, but I think it also has a higher tooth count, which probably makes it a better general purpose resaw/ripping blade.

There is a little confusion about the tips. I have some conflicting information on whether it's carbide tipped or not. It's not a terribly expensive blade so wouldn't have expected it to be. It does say that it's resharpenable a few times.

Anyhow, credit where credit is due. This is a nice blade.

[John Coloccia]

John, if you tension higher than the frame can handle, wierd things start to happen to the blade. Tracking, moving in and out, etc as the frame flexes under load, particularly when you force wood against the blade. That may explain a small reduction in tension improving your cut. When I used the ACM LT 18 I felt it's limit was a 1/2 x .025 blade for that reason. I think you have blade problems but some of what you describe is similar to my experiences overtensioning the ACM. Dave

I think reducing tension helped because it allowed me to drive the back of the blade into the thrust bearing, which wasn't happening under high tension. I think that help negate some of the in/out motion from the bad weld. They're sending me some new blades. I'm expecting to be blown away once I get something on the saw that works. Instead of 2 3/4" RK, I'm doing a 1" and a 3/4" so I'll know soon if the 1" works well or not. At this point, I'm kind of in experimenting mode, so why not? I pickup up another blade to get me through, and now with the 1" Shear Force on there I'm perfectly happy and have all the time in the world. If I'm unhappy with it, I'll use the 1" as general construction/firewood/teak blade.

[Mike Tekin]

John,

I got this shear force blade with my LT18 3000 and I agree - its a nice blade! I have been also following your thread and want to say I'm sorry you are having issues with the RK blades. I get a a nice finish with mine (1-1/4"). It does take more pressure than the shear force to feed, though.

Also, I noticed Laguna's blades seem to work differently than others, meaning they don't require as much tension. Just as you did with the shear force, if you haven't done so, play around with the tension more on the Resaw king.

FYI, despite what people say about Laguna, they will correct your blade issues.

[Van Huskey]

The "problem" with a good carbide blade on a bandsaw allows you to see every bit of operator error, it happens with set tooth blades as well but the general rough finish doesn't allow you to see these "errors". Every change in feedrate and certainly every stop and start are going to stick out. Carbide blades it seems were designed and built to sell powerfeeders...

On tension often when you are using a blade at or near the top of a saws spring pressure it does help to back off, even if the tension is not ideal the frame may relax to the point the cut is actually better. The higher tension is only good up to the point where the frame starts giving up the ghost.

[John Coloccia]

Well, just wanted to post an update. I did eventually get at least one blade that works...I sent a bunch of blades back...I don't really remember how many. I have one blade here that I haven't tried yet because I've been busy, but I'm assuming that it's a good blade or that they'll fix it if it's not.

Here's the thing....for any other blade, I wouldn't have bothered, but I will say that the finish off the Resaw King is as good as the finish off anything. The wood comes out practically shiny. It's remarkable.

I am currently running the 1" Resaw King on my G0514X2, so if anyone is wondering if it tensions it OK, the answer is Yup! Overall, I'm happy having this blade on the saw, though clearly I caught them at a bad time. It does last a good long time it seems, so I'm happy there too.

[Andrew Hughes]

Thats good news thanks for sharing.I had told the fellow that bought my band saw to wait on buying a Rk.I'll let him know the news.

[mreza Salav]

I guess I got lucky as the first 1" RK I got was fine and did resaw beautifully; if I could keep my feed rate consistent the surface would be fairly good (I don't say like coming out of a planer but fairly good).