powermatic 4224B

[ned jarmas]

new video on powermatic 4224B on you tube

[Tim Rinehart]

Pretty much saw that one coming...long overdue! Cool...anyone interested in a nice used 3520b?

[Jon Prouty]

Teaser video... But I want.

JP

[Scott Hackler]

Yeah, but does it come in black? :)

[Bob Bergstrom]

Interesting clamping system on the banjo. Nice touches of chrome. Looks like quite a heavy duty machine.

[John Keeton]

Here is the link - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YRKBPUccnXg

[Steve Schlumpf]

Looks like a nice lathe! No mention of availability or pricing.... Looking forward to hearing from those that eventually pick up one of these new versions!

[Greg Bender]

Tim,
To answer your question,YES ,and I'm close enough to test drive it .
Greg

[Peter Elliott]

funny how the website still says 10mins left until the big announcement...

10:50am EDT (as I post)

[Peter Elliott]

$7500 4224B

233997
(http://www.cpopowermatic.com/powermatic-1794224k-4224b-24-in-by-42-in-1-or-3-phase-3-horsepower-220-volt-lathe-with-lamp-kit/pwmn1794224k,default,pd.html)

[Steve Vaughan]

That be my next one, my next and last upgrade. If not in reality, it will definitely be so in my dreams...just ask!

[Jon Nuckles]

948 pounds. It is going to be tough for those with basement shops! I love my 3520B and really don't know what I would do with the extra capacity, but there is a part of me that wants!

[Tony De Masi]

Website says it comes with everything you see in the pic, light kit, remote switch....and it also mentions a vacuum system too. Waiting for someone at the symposium to chime in on this one. Stand by Peter.

[Rob Sitze]

Did I read the specs correctly that it's a 3 phase 3HP motor?

[Rick Markham]

Wow, $7500 :eek: That's some SERIOUS dough... that won't break the bank, that will ROBUST your wallet :D

I love my 3520B but they have priced themselves into an entirely different class of machines with this one. I'll be interested to see the specs.

[Tony De Masi]

Rob, I think it said either 1ph or 3ph motor.

[Scott Hackler]

I agree about the price point. At $7500 they are pricing their (Affordable solution for a big ole lathe) into the same price as Robust. It will be interesting to hear the symposium attendee's views on this lathe.

[Jason Clark2]

3ph is correct. It takes 220v 1ph and converts it to 3ph to power the 3HP 3ph motor.

The 3520b does something similar but only 2HP.

Jason

[charlie knighton]

Steve, how does it compare price wise with Robust??????????

[Bob Bergstrom]

I wonder what the price would come down to if they took all the lights, vacuum, and outlets off. That 7500 is a lot of cast iron.

[Scott Hackler]

Of course that price is MSRP and it is highly doubtful that anyone will be paying full MSRP for the lathe. What the "discount" brings it down to....well that is speculation. As well as the thought that the discounts might not start showing up until they've been out for a while.

[John M. Smith]

One on line seller had an mrsp value of $9000 with sale price of $7500. Would really have to think about that price. Not far off from a robust. And the powermatic headstock is really big. Sometimes in the way.

[Noah Barfield]

What size swing does it have?

Noah

[Tony De Masi]

Noah, 24".

As for price point one of our favorite stores has a price much lower than the $7500. Of course prices are always relative.

[Sid Matheny]

Humm something has moved to the top of my wish list but will have a long wait.:)


Sid

[Kyle Iwamoto]

Wow. Looks like the headstock slides? The old one did not. It's a very nice lathe to turn on. (the old non sliding one) For that kind of money, aren't we getting near the VB36? That would be my last and final lathe..... Dream on.....

[Jacob Reverb]

Wow, $7500 ... talk about irrational exuberance. Are they trying to out-Festool Festool?

[Thom Sturgill]

Quite some specs. With the long extension you could turn an 8' column (105" if I recall) if you did achitectural work. The vacuum is integrated and it looks like an air gauge and conrol on the face of the headstock. There was mention of an air connector for blowing off you turning, so they are apparently generating BOTH a vacuum and pressure probably from the same pump though I doubt you could get much pressure if you ar using the vacuum chuck. (no input).

Definitely on the dream shop wish list.

[Roger Chandler]

Ya' know............if I am going to lay out that amount of $$$$$$...........then if it is a choice, I am going with the lathe that has the stainless steel ways............the Robust! Not that the 4224b is not a really nice machine.........if one already has a vacuum system, etc, and does not need the whole enchilada, then the Robust is still my choice!

[Steve Vaughan]

That's a good point Roger.

[David DeCristoforo]

Big dog... and "fully loaded". It's almost a bit to much. I'm not impressed with the "bells and whistles" on this machine. The lighting system, the four 115v receptacles, the little bent steel "tool holder" bolted onto the end, the "clever" extra storage compartment built into the tailstock... all of these are things that I wish they wouldn't do. I'd rather see a lower price. The onboard vacuum setup might be worth a few extra bucks but, taken all together, this is overload. It looks like a fine machine but, as has already been pointed out, there are some pretty highly regarded machines in this price range. Like some others, I'd be hard pressed to choose this over the Robust AB.

[Jerry Wright]

DD - I always wished that they would leave the burl dash and leather seats out of the Rolls-Royce, also! :)

Looks like a wonderful lathe to me. With Robust, Stubby, Hegner, Serious, and PM, I have lots to dream about. Meanwhile, I'll keep overloading my current "dancing" lathe.

[Kevin W Johnson]

Ya' know............if I am going to lay out that amount of $$$$$$...........then if it is a choice, I am going with the lathe that has the stainless steel ways............the Robust! Not that the 4224b is not a really nice machine.........if one already has a vacuum system, etc, and does not need the whole enchilada, then the Robust is still my choice!

Roger, just buy one of each, try them out and which ever one you don't like, just send it down to my shop to live.:D

[Chris Studley]

....Brilliant Marketing by Powermatic! They just got me to think, maybe $4k isn't that bad for a 3520b.

Little depressing looking at my HF special w/ 12" swing...

[Peter Elliott]

If you shop around that $7500 price is high. Sub $7k can be had..

[Mitch McGee]

I got to see the 4224B today. There are many little touches sprinkled on this one.

- They added a locking plate to the spindle lock. This can be retro-fitted to the 3520B.
- The main spindle has LASER etched degree marks.
- The integrated vacuum system is venturi based. Just connect your shop air compressor.
- The spindle indexing was moved from the spindle nose to the hand-wheel. So, no more hand wheel.
- The belt tension handle is chrome plated.
- The banjo mouth is split clamped. So, setting the tool rest height will not mar the tool rest post.
- The light bar will be available for the 3520B.
- There is a 20" swing-away/geared height adjustable tail-stock extension.
- There is a riser available now to allow the use of the tail-stock while turning out-board.

There may be more changes. But, that is all I remember...

Cheers,

[Tom Hintz]

Did I read the specs correctly that it's a 3 phase 3HP motor?

I would think that it has the inverter for pne phase lke the 3520B. 3 phase is really industrial only in most places.

[Gary Max]

Something to think about---- The folks over at Powermatic made a big investment in doing this. They incorporated ideals from some of the best woodturns in the business and upgraded thier biggest wood lathe. This project has been years in the making----- personally I take my hat off to them for advancing woodturning.

[Roger Chandler]

Roger, just buy one of each, try them out and which ever one you don't like, just send it down to my shop to live.:D


Great idea Kev! :D:D:D:rolleyes:

[Rob Sitze]

While I like powermatic lathes, and it looks like an awesome lathe, for that price I could get a loaded Robust. My main reason for choosing a robust was the headstock, your more able to get behind the bowl with it then the powermatic. I think I'll keep saving my pennies for the Robust.

[Jon Nuckles]

While I have not really studied the lathes available at that price point, it does seem like Powermatic is going up against some tough competition. The vacuum capacity is a big feature, and may have been pretty expensive to incorporate. A lot of the other bells and whistles, though, seem like things that are cheap to add for Powermatic and just allow them to list lots of features in their ads. The 3520B has the tailstock storage (which I never use) and the tool caddy (though the 4224B's looks more substantial). Outlets and lighting probably add very little to Powermatic's cost. 948 pounds of cast iron and providing Powermatic's usual free shipping of that weight will certainly cost them a bit! I wonder what it would have added to the cost if they included stainless steel ways? Now that's a feature I'd pay for.

[Tom Hintz]

Something to think about---- The folks over at Powermatic made a big investment in doing this. They incorporated ideals from some of the best woodturns in the business and upgraded thier biggest wood lathe. This project has been years in the making----- personally I take my hat off to them for advancing woodturning.

I know they had this lathe in the works well before the recession hit and then like lots of companies it went on the back burner until the economy started showing signs of life. I like what they did and look forward to getting mine. (already sold my 3520B and 1014 to make room in the shop and budget) No matter what they make or what they set the prce at it will be too high for some, not so much for others. That's why they have more than one lathe, to service more people within the market.

[Rick Markham]

Ya' know............if I am going to lay out that amount of $$$$$$...........then if it is a choice, I am going with the lathe that has the stainless steel ways............the Robust! Not that the 4224b is not a really nice machine.........if one already has a vacuum system, etc, and does not need the whole enchilada, then the Robust is still my choice!

This is my point exactly! Most of the "extras" are things that some of us have. I don't see too many people new to turning dropping $7500 on a first lathe. I'm probably being a bit hypercritical, but it had better be one heck of a sale. They are trying to compete in a class of machines that have "customizable" options at the same price point. Without the "free" extras, it's just a 4224 with sliding headstock... does that justify a nearly $1500 price increase?

[Bob Bergstrom]

I wonder if the price of this lathe will raise the value of my 3520b for a while. At least till the 3520C comes out.

[Peter Elliott]

While I like powermatic lathes, and it looks like an awesome lathe, for that price I could get a loaded Robust. My main reason for choosing a robust was the headstock, your more able to get behind the bowl with it then the powermatic. I think I'll keep saving my pennies for the Robust.

Loaded Robust is well over this price.. AB with a 3hp upgrade is $7400 according to their online sales sheet...

Like I said before that $7500 price is HIGH... you can do sub $7k if you do a little shopping.

I'm not in the market for either of them but it's nice to see some upgrades to the 4224.

[Jeff Myroup]

It looks nice and it is definitely a beast, but I will continue to save for the Robust AB. One of the many reason I choose to go with the AB, is the off set headstock.

[Alan Trout]

I am still in San Jose for now. I will be heading back home this afternoon. I looked over the lathe pretty closely. It is pretty much a 3520 on steroids. It is a nice machine but still has short comings as I see them. For me it is the "Fat" head stock. It can get in the way at times. That is one of the things that the premium lathes has over this machine. If you look at the Rubust, Oneway, or Vicmarc they all have significantly smaller headstocks. I did not ask but hope they started putting in a hardened spindle on a lathe of this size. The load that a lathe this size should be able to carry is significant and hope they put the forethought into that.

Other than those nitpicks it looks to be a nice machine with some nice features. I will still take a vacuum pump over a vacuum generator. I am still perfectly happy with my decision on the Robust AB. It should serve my needs for a lifetime.

Alan.

[Reed Gray]

Just back from San Jose. A couple of differences between the AB and the PM. Robust has gone to 2 speed ranges from 3 because most people weren't using the middle range that much. Mid speed range is the one I use the most. PM has 3 speeds. Robust had also gone to a different motor which is shorter and more round/bigger diameter. That would help static balance more on the headstock. The AB has a new tilt away set up as well. Far better than the old model that I have. I will have to upgrade that soon as well. I did see one lathe, and can't remember which one it was, but the extended lower bed for over sized turnings was on a screw jack of some sort for raising and lowering, and would pivot out of the way for standing at the end of the lathe when bowl turning, and not be a shin knocker.

robo hippy

[John Beaver]

I saw this at AAW also. Here's a few impressions.

First off, it is a beast. As much as I like the Robust, this thing is way more massive. I guess it will boil down to your needs, but if you want big and heavy this fits the bill.
The built in vacuum system is nicely done, but couple that with the outboard indexing and it is difficult to spin the spindle by hand.
On the other hand, the indexing is much better and very accessible.
The little spindle lock mechanism is handy, and they were selling an adapter for the 3520. There are other solutions that are cheaper and work as well.
The headstock is the same size, so it can get in the way, but really nice to have the sliding option.
The ratio on the tailstock ram crank is really nice. I won't take forever to spin it forward or back, and it's a pretty long reach. All the locks for the tailstock, and ram are really nicely done.
I understand why they offset the post receptacle on the banjo, but I still prefer it centered like the original 4224. It's a small nitpick.
The bed extension (which is an option) is on a crank so it can be brought up or down while still basically attached. Potentially a nice feature.
Some people have complained about the added cost of the attached lights and plugs, but I think they are a nice feature, and well designed. The start / stop extension box looks decent.

Overall, the things that are good about Powermatics, are good here, and many are improved. The things that are not so good about Powermatic (head stock size etc...) are not necessarily improved.
It is a Powermatic on steroids, but still a Powermatic.