Anyone have EXPERIENCE installing full-frame replacement windows?

[Harry Hagan]

I’ve offered to have my neighbor help me install full-frame replacement windows in his house. We often barter for the other’s services. That’s providing we can find a quality window that someone will sell to a DIYer.

So, if you’ve actually installed a full-frame replacement window; we’d like to learn from your experience. Good or bad—let’s hear it.

[Bob Wingard]

When I built my shop a few years ago, I went to a local Window/Door/Remodel "specialist" store. They showed me several choices with most of the options being LOW-E ... tint ... double vs. single hung ... with/without built-in J-Channel ... with/without nailing flanges. The method of installation involves choosing nailing flange vs. no nailing flange. The same unit can be installed either in new construction (with flange) or as a retrofit (no flange). Otherwise, they were the same. I chose a mid-priced unit that was about $160 each for a 3' X 5' unit ... thermal pane ... single hung ... all vinyl ... with J-Channel and nailing flanges ... low-e glass. They installed beautifully and have been trouble free since installation. The nice thing was that for just a small premium in price, I could custom order any size I wanted ... if you know the opening sizes you are dealing with, just give them to the shop, and they will make up the units to your specs.

[Tom Wassack]

Hello Harry,
I'm not 100% sure what you mean by full-frame replacement windows, but I can relate my experience replacing 11 windows in my house 12 years ago. When we built, the builder installed M&W double hung windows. These were builder grade - nothing special, no low-E, not-tiltable, etc. The seal between the double panes began to break down and moisture accumulated between the glass. The plastic jamb liners began to break down. I visited my local building supply company and asked about my options and ended up ordering Caradco Zap-Pac replacement windows. These were aluminum clad, stain grade wood inside, low-E, argon filled, grid between the glass, and a 20 year warranty. Old window removal was as follows: carefully remove the inside window stop molding, remove parting strip at top of window, raise the old windows, remove the nailer holding the jamb liner, remove one side of jamb liner, and remove both sashes.

Installation was install new jamb clips, snap in new jamb liner, insert outer sash into track and tilt into place, same for inner sash, install parting strip, reinstall window stop molding. I installed all 11 windows in one day. We really noticed the difference immediately, quieter - less noise from outside disturbances. Over time we realized reduced energy consumption and fading to rugs, draperies, and carper was reduced.

Caradco was bought by Jeld-Wen. I believe M & W also makes a similar system, as does Marvin.

Regards,
Tom Wassack
Asheboro, NC

[Matt Meiser]

Home Depot sells Andersen 400 series windows. We replaced all our 8 years ago. We got lucky in that all but one window were a size that Home Depot stocked which saved us considerable money. However Home Depot and I weren't on speaking terms for quite a while after that due to repeated screw ups with the order, delivery, and getting a damaged window and screen replaced. A year or so later the manager who I went several rounds with and specifically mentioned in my letter to the CEO was stocking shelves at Tractor Supply and years later the same store bent over backwards on a twice-damaged stove so it might not have been a corporate issue.

I did one (the really bad one) and we paid a contractor to do the rest. It took me the better part of the day to do the one with unskilled help. They did the rest of the house, including replacing one set of double windows with a sliding door, built custom aluminum trim for around every window (solved the need to install new J-channel,) drywall work related to the door, and a few other things in about a week. The only thing they didn't do was staining and finishing the wood inside.

[phil harold]

Each time I do window replacement they are about the same process.
Take old one out, put new one in.

But each one seems to be different depending on the original framing, siding, interior trim, and installation one was.

The biggest factor is proper measurement and ordering of window
3'6" inches is not 3 foot
7'6" is not 76" "damhik"


I like to install anderson windows
http://www.andersenwindows.com/servlet/Satellite/AW/Page/awReplacement_FullFrameWindows/1162992734174

good luck!

[Harry Hagan]

Bob, Tom, Matt, and Phil; thanks for your responses.

I used to sell Andersen and Caradco windows among other brands when I helped manage a lumber yard over thirty years ago. I don’t remember full-frame replacement windows being available back then.

Here are some Pics:

233186233187233188
Your standard house built in the 80s with too many windows.

Bob, it sounds like your job was new construction.

Tom, see Phil’s link to Andersen’s full-frame replacement windows. I checked out Jeld Wens site but couldn’t find replacement windows. I’ll do some more research on them.

Matt, it looks like the 400 series is an insert replacement. My neighbor’s windows are in pretty rough shape and he wants windows with prefinished brick mold rather than covering the rotted wood with aluminum trim.

Phil, I checked out Andersen’s installation videos the other day for the full-frame version Renewal line. In the video the installers were able to utilize a nailing flange because the older home had wide trim boards that could be removed. On my neighbor’s house I’m thinking we’d have to use windows without nailing flanges—at least for the brick portion.
So how do you properly fasten a window without nailing flanges and without nailing through the factory-finished brick mold?

[Matt Meiser]

The 400 series we used are new construction windows and come with a nailing flange installed. I believe there's a way to install without--and we have a double and triple so there's definitely no nailing flange between those units. How you trim it out I can't answer.

The one I installed I peeled back all the siding, reinstalled the J-channel and reinstalled the siding. The contractor came up with the idea of making a wide trim all around that replaced the J-channel and allowed him to cut the siding (with a cutoff wheel in an angle grinder) back from the window edge far enough for the nailing flange to fit right in. Then they attached the trim around the window. The guy was a whiz with aluminum. Unfortunately he went on a mission trip to Haiti for a year and the guys running the company for him ran it into the ground so they are gone--because I'd like to have him do something else for me now.

[Harry Hagan]

We’ll have to get the Andersen people out and see what they have to say. Have them price windows and installation separately.

If anyone else can recommend a quality full-frame replacement window manufacturer, your input would be welcome.

[Jason Roehl]

All I know is that when I (eventually) get around to replacing my ca. 1974 single-pane windows, I will be cutting back the wood siding so that I can use a window with a nailing flange, then adding trim. The flange will be caulked to the sheathing AND taped. I don't know that I would trust any installers to take their time to get all the details right.

[phil harold]

I have installed some replacements by just shimming and blocking into position then foamed them in place
Had to rove one a year later for an addition and it was a bugger to get out, in other words it was very secure in it's opening

I gained this technique from a german builder who told me this was how he installed doors and windows in stone walls

jenweld widows We have cut the flange off with a knife


You should be able to order windows with brick mold installed or as kit like this
http://www.andersenwindows.com/_PDFs/ProView/AWExteriorTrim.pdf

[Bill ThompsonNM]

I've installed Hurd, Anderson, Pella and Jeldwen aluminum clad wood windows.
I liked the Hurd the most, but they all make some good windows and you can find equally bad and good reviews on all of them.

My recommendations: Measure, measure and measure again. If you buy a custom size and it's wrong, you are out of luck. They all have slightly different opening requirements, so the measured size might end up slightly different for different brands. Read their installation instructions before ordering. I would do one test order and install before ordering a full house worth! If you order throu a big box, have an idea what you need before you order. They have programs that allows the clerk to interview you and punch in the info. If the clerk is clueless, you need to decipher the order to make sure it is right.

If the non custom sizes are far off you might get funny results. I have a vinyl window in our house installed by the previous owner which has about 50% of the window in frame components. The original window had about 40% more glass! Truly a bad fit. Other windows had 2x6's tacked in top and bottom to take up the gap from the standard size in a non standard opening.

After replacing about 20 in my first house in Massachusetts, I can tell you that the first one will take much longer than expected....windows 3 and on can go quite fast once you have a routine down.

[Bruce Wrenn]

I’ve offered to have my neighbor help me install full-frame replacement windows in his house. We often barter for the other’s services. That’s providing we can find a quality window that someone will sell to a DIYer.

So, if you’ve actually installed a full-frame replacement window; we’d like to learn from your experience. Good or bad—let’s hear it.MW is now PlyGem (Lowes) if memory serves correct. Get yourself a HF multi-tool for cutting caulk loose on outside. You can order windows without either sill nosing, or brick molding. I usually wind up removing brick molding, and after window is centered in opening, attach brick molding, but it depends upon original installation.

[Larry Edgerton]

In my restoration work I use Marvins. I usually come at it from the outside so as not to disturb the interior trim. Outside trim is being replaced. I lightly shim to get it where I want and use foam to set it in place. If you foam buy a foam gun, it is much more controlable that the Great Stuff in the can.

I consider Marvins at the top right now in the middle price ranges. Anderson has been slipping both in quality and service. I have a nightmare house with 21 Anderson exterior doors and 63 windows that some are failing after 12 years and I am not getting any satisfaction from Anderson. Makes me look like an idiot, so no more Anderson for me.

Larry

[Jim Matthews]

I used Farley windows (http://www.farleywindows.com/windows_dh.html) in a "Florida room" near Albany, NY.

Once all the sills were shimmed to level, they went in quickly.
All four sides trimmed in with peel-n-stick Ice and water flashing - screws went right through.

I then trimmed out the opening with Azek.

Surprisingly enough, all the windows opened and closed.

[Paul Johnstone]

I replaced all my windows with Anderson's.. I think it was the 400 series.

There is a nailing flange on the outside.

However, it is removeable.

We have a brick front on our house. Removed the nail flange. Removed the two panes from the window (they come out).
Remove the tracks the panes slide in.

Now you basically have a wooden rectangle. Put it in your window opening. Shim to square. Screw in through the sides. Replace slides and panes. Caulk around the outer edges. Fill the inner gaps with the NON-EXPANDING spray foam designed for windows/doors
If you have a big gap in the rough opening on brick, Anderson sells plywood with a vynyl trim over it that you can use to fill the gaps (color matches the window exterior).. You can nail that in and caulk there. Or you could put brick molding over it like his original windows are now (I assume).

If you have any questions, you can PM me.

Is this an easy job? Well, it's not hard, but time consuming. I could do 2 ground level windows or one upper level window per day, and usually it was a long day. The brick face windows are actually faster, as I peeled back siding when I did the windows on the sides of the house with siding.. On the siding faces of the house.. peel back siding, apply caulk under where nail flange will go, use the nail flange, use the special tape to help seal it up good. Put siding back.

[Jim Andrew]

I thought the idea of replacement windows was to leave the window frame in place, and install window units in the old frame, without disturbing the trim on the outside or the inside. Pella makes replacements which fit that way, can't say I enjoyed installing them, but at least you can do 6 or 8 in a day. My neighbor bought his from Sears, they took out the casement sashes out, and put double hung units in to replace them. One double unit they sawed out the center post and put a slider in. Course he told me later they cost 1,000 per window installed.

[Harry Hagan]

Replacement insert windows are a compromise between affordability and appearance/performance.

[Harry Hagan]

Thanks everyone for the additional input. I’ll take a look at your manufacturer recommendations.

Here’s a link to an article by Mike Sloggatt that answers some of my questions about installing full-frame replacement windows on brick-veneer homes.
http://www.coastalcontractor.net/pdf/2007/0705/0705repl.pdf

Phil, that trim package by Andersen looks interesting. If it looks good it might be worth the mucho $$$ they’ll want for the kits.

That’s a bunch of doors and windows Larry. What a nightmare. I’ve always said that Andersen was probably better at marketing windows than they were at making them.

[David Hostetler]

I helped a friend rebuild several walls / replace windows in his now Ex wife's house a few years ago after they got hit with termites. You obviously will need to have all the siding off of the house to do the job. Due to being in wind zone 1 for hurricane protection he had to get storm rated windows too... They go on pretty easy. Just make sure you tack it in place, make sure it stayed level, and operates fine, throw a few more nails at it, test again, then finish it up...

[Bill Brush]

I ordered a Jeld-wen custom sized replacement window several years ago for my kids' nursery. Worked great, and was pretty affordable. I just removed the double-hung sashes and slid it in to place, caulked it and added trim.

[Larry Edgerton]

Went to see my Anderson dealer yesterday about the previously mentioned house. Andersons answer on failures on 12 year old doors, actually 10 as this has been going on for 2 years was no dice. I asked if he had explained that as a contractor I had used millions of dollars worth of Andersons and he said he had, but they just don't care.

Well, neither do I. For many years I talked customers into Anderson because it was a good product with excellent service. Not any more.

I should have known when their stuff started showing up in the box stores that they had hit the skids.

Larry