My wife wants.....

[Ken Fitzgerald]

a wooden swing for our covered patio.

I priced teak and found it unbelievably expensive and am now considering white oak.

Any other suggestions?

[Paul DeCarlo]

Ken,

How about Cypress? Inexpensive, domestic, plentiful, good outside, not bad to work with.....

-Paul

[Richard Wolf]

I have used Iroko wood as a substitute for teak. It is sometimes called "poor mans teak" or African teak. Still not real cheap, but worth the look.

Also, Afrormosia is also called, poor man teak.

[Ron Jones near Indy]

Ipe would last forever. It might be a little difficult to find and/or work for that purpose.

[Greg Portland]

Ipe would last forever. It might be a little difficult to find and/or work for that purpose.
Ipe is very common @ our local decking supply. Note that it will turn silver/gray after UV exposure unless it's finished.

[Van Huskey]

I am a cypress fan, then again I am looking out my window at them as I type. I would absolutely use it but it is very cheap here because it is everywhere in LA.

[Jack Wilson50]

I have made several adirondack chairs out of cypress, it is very easy to mill.

[Roy Harding]

I'm partial to red cedar for outdoor furniture. It weathers well, either unfinished and being allowed to grey over time, or it can be finished with a wide variety of finishes

Then again - it grows like a weed around where I live and is cheap like borsch - that may have influenced my tastes over the years.

[Sam Murdoch]

White oak - a very good choice as are most of the other suggestions above - EXCEPT - I have used cypress on one project (only one and it is not a local lumber so my experience is tainted - I defer to others who have good things to say about it) here in Maine that required many many hundreds board feet of this stuff. It was a very stringy lumber. Long strips of grain would flake off the edges or worst drive themselves in to your hands while sanding. Whole faces would come apart. We did get some beautiful lumber for the project and some that I have used in my own house, but there was lots of waste. Could have been just a few seriously wind shaken trees in the mix, but I have been spooked off of cypress since. Just to add to the conversation :).

[Damon Stathatos]

All of the suggestions above are good ones. Ipe would probably the best choice but it's (real) heavy.

If I started a thread 'My Wife Wants...'

My post would be maxed out, word-wise or character-wise, and I would never be able to actually post it.

[Van Huskey]

Sounds like "hurricane" trees to me... the local guys tend to ship them out of the area since so much of it is used here for cabinets and the like users know how cypress should act.

There are tons of good woods and Damon probably could think of 100 exotics that would be excellent. Down here it would be cypress as I mentioned because it is cheap, works well outdoors and everyone here knows it or teak if they wanna spend the cash.

[Bill Huber]

I have 6 Adirondack chairs made from cypress that have been outside for the last 4 years and one redwood. Looking at the chairs now they are sliver gray and it is hard to tell the cypress from the redwood.
I find cypress very easy to work with, it works just about like pine.

This is one of the cypress chairs when it was first built, after 4 years outside it still looks the same only now it is sliver gray.

232682

[Phil Thien]

If you're going to use a clear finish (not paint), I think the white oak would look pretty darn nice.

[Phil Erup]

a wooden swing for our covered patio.

I priced teak and found it unbelievably expensive and am now considering white oak.


Ken,

I hardly ever post 'cause so many others are way more experienced. In this case, my son & his family live in Lewiston... he is building a garden arbor, he went to the local lumber yard for advice and was told that given the climate there douglas fir would last. His is in an exposed location, under a covered patio I think doug fir would outlast me.

maybe I'll meet you someday, planning to retire there in a couple of years.

dan

[Gary Max]

Ken I have a antique White Oak swing that was made back in the early 1950's. Unless you are just wanting to spend a bunch of money oak would be a good way to go.
SWMBO had to wait 5 years before I built hers out of Eastern Red Cedar.

[Sid Matheny]

Cypress is the way I would go. A few years ago I got a couple of truck loads of cypress from a guy building a log home out of cypress. He was just glad to get it out of his way. Might pay to look for someone building a log home.

Sid

[frank shic]

All of the suggestions above are good ones. Ipe would probably the best choice but it's (real) heavy.

If I started a thread 'My Wife Wants...'

My post would be maxed out, word-wise or character-wise, and I would never be able to actually post it.

lol i can relate!

[John Piwaron]

The usual suspects - cypress, redwood, white oak, ipe. I've got red cedar benches and planters outside, they've been there for years. I think the planters will one day have to be replaced though. they've got constant moisture contact through the wet soil in them.

But the experimenter in me is to test the rot resistance of black walnut. I'm not so much on making furniture from it because it's so dark. Too dark for my residence. But I read it's rot resistance is very good. So, the few boards I've been given or otherwise came to own have been used to make exterior window parts. casing, drip edge at the top and so on. up to now it's all functional. This summer I'm trimming one window entirely in walnut and then varnishing it with epiphane marine varnish. to test both the rot resistance and all the claims I've ever seen for CPES (a penetrating epoxy sealer) and an Epiphane varnish top coat. Color wise I expect that it'll match the brown painted trim that the other windows have now.

[Fred Belknap]

Ken any wood like poplar or douglas fir would be fine if it was in the dry and painted.

[Larry Fox]

Surprised no one mentioned jatoba. Stuff is absurdly heavy and stinks to work with but should hold up well outside. I did a park bench for my parents using it a year or so ago and - other than color change - it has shown no signs of wear.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Well....I am going to use white oak and I ordered some Epifanes marine varnish to use as a finish.

Teak was available but too expensive. Cypress in this part of the country isn't readily available. I contacted my two most-used suppliers. One didn't' have cypress and didn't want to special order it. The other said he could special order 4/4 but their distributor didn't have 8/4. A lot of the suggested woods aren't readily available or just too expensive.

White oak was readily available and reasonably priced at a lumber yard just 30 miles away.

My wife guys........she wants but her wants are pretty reasonable.......BUT...........she can nickel and dime you to death.......LOL....

A number of years ago I had purchased Norm's plans for his "Hanging Porch Swing". That was my intended build. When I told my wife of this project, she started making modifications....16" longer and 6" deeper so she can purchase cushions for it.

I got the additional length drawn and figured last night. Today I need to work on lengthening the arm rests and seat supports and then go buy the white oak.

Thanks everyone for your suggestions but practicality and availability won out.

[Bill Huber]

Is anything to expensive for your wife?????:mad:

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Is anything to expensive for your wife?????:mad:

She didn't want to buy the teak......and I agreed........LOL..... Please don't ask that question in front of her.....;)

[frank shic]

rule number one: keep your wife happy...
rule number two: keep your wife happy...

:)

[Ken Fitzgerald]

rule number one: keep your wife happy...
rule number two: keep your wife happy...

:)

It's worked for 43 years so far.......

[Damon Stathatos]

My dad used to race horses and had one that he had named 'Happy Wife.' One day leaving the racetrack just after she had run (and won) we overheard a disgruntled 'punter' exclaim, "Happy Wife???...That's an OXYMORON !!!"

[Prashun Patel]

Cedar or cypress.

[Larry Edgerton]

My wife wants me to finish the schoolhouse I am building her, my daughter wants me to finish the crib I am building for my new grandson, and my mom wants me to reroof her house again. These are all my "free" jobs, and I get to do all this same kind of thing all week long too. I'm so lucky.
Just say no......

Jatoba is often spec'd for elevator floors as it is one of the hardest woods. Reason being, a 160 pound woman in 1/4" spiked heels [don't laugh, it happens!] puts 2560 psi on the floor when she turns around on one heel. Ouch!

Its terrible stuff to work with on any large project, fights you all the way.

Ken, White Oak will be just fine. Actually, as they will all be gone soon, and it is under a porch in a dry climate I would consider white ash. It will soon be extinct but prices at the moment are still low as its a mad dash to turn it into lumber before the beatles get it. Twenty years down the road it would be an oddity. Just a thought.

Larry

[Gary Herrmann]

Another vote for white oak. The outdoor furniture I've made has held up very well.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Cypress....4/4 special order....no 8/4.....Teak too expensive....Cedar....quality stuff isn't available that I have seen......


I just returned from Moscow Idaho with WHITE OAK. The local price? 4/4 white oak is $5.00/bd ft.....8/4 white oak is $6.89 / bd ft.....S2S........ We don't have a lot of hardwood available....none commerically grown localy. Hardwood is expensive

[mickey cassiba]

All of the suggestions above are good ones. Ipe would probably the best choice but it's (real) heavy.

If I started a thread 'My Wife Wants...'

My post would be maxed out, word-wise or character-wise, and I would never be able to actually post it.
Yup, my thoughts too, when I saw the title.
My first choice would be cypress, but white oak would be a close second.

[Chris Padilla]

Redwood is plentiful and cheap out here on the Left Coast. WO sounds like a winner.

[Kevin W Johnson]

Sounds like Van should buy a semi-truck load of cypress and deliver to the SMC folks that are intersted. Good way to see a lot of the country. :p

[Ken Fitzgerald]

We have a much more limited variety of hardwoods locally and what we have is expensive.

I bought the white oak this afternoon. It's in the shop. Tomorrow I will start making patterns where necessary.

[frank shic]

can't wait to see the finished product and hats off to you for keeping the marriage going for all those years!

[Damon Stathatos]

We have a much more limited variety of hardwoods locally and what we have is expensive...

You've got to be 'swimming' in (inexpensive) Big Leaf Maple, Mrytlewood, and perhaps, Walnut? Oh, and all those burls !!! Not that any of those would be good choices for your outdoor project/use but you may have it better in the local hardwood situation than you're leading on to.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Damon....there are a few maple trees in town here, there are a few walnut trees in town here.......I don't know of any myrtlewood. Idaho isn't known for it's hardwoods but rather it's coniferous forrests. You must be thinking of somewhere else or someone else.

[John Piwaron]

Jatoba is often spec'd for elevator floors as it is one of the hardest woods. Its terrible stuff to work with on any large project, fights you all the way.

Larry

What do you mean "fights you all the way?"

[Sam Murdoch]

Jatoba is a beautiful hardwood that polishes to an exceptional finish, BUT it is gnarly as the worst of them. Can hardly be edge planed without tear out. Try splitting a piece with a hatchet for some revelation as to what gnarly means. AND it is brutal on chisels. If you intend to chop a few mortises you will very likely chip a chisel edge or two. In my experience...

[Brad Shipton]

I am working on a custom deck project using Cumaru (went thru about 12,000lb at this point). I know IPE and Cumaru are similar. My project involved a lot of custom parts so milling and adhesives were a big part of it. I would stay away from either species unless you are using standard profiles that do not require a lot of milling and you plan to screw everything together. These species are awful to work with and when you say decking material it seems the mills do not take the same care producing the stock in South America. I could show you a board that was milled to 3/4" thick, lock mitered on boith sides and sat in the shop (stickered in low humidity shop) for a week while I was gluing up others. It warped at one end almost 1.5" just cause. I have others that did similar things, but this one was by far the worst. This made building the box newels an absolute nightmare.

I have worked with a lot of Jatoba and Tigerwood, and they are both much much much better to work with. That stock came from a wholesaler that supplies cabinet shops, so that could be part of it.

Brad

[Van Huskey]

Sounds like Van should buy a semi-truck load of cypress and deliver to the SMC folks that are intersted. Good way to see a lot of the country. :p

I would trade every board foot of cypress in LA and never touch it again for easy access to the hardwood "just" up 81 from you in PA!

[Damon Stathatos]

Damon....there are a few maple trees in town here, there are a few walnut trees in town here.......I don't know of any myrtlewood. Idaho isn't known for it's hardwoods but rather it's coniferous forrests. You must be thinking of somewhere else or someone else.

Ken...Sorry for the confusion. I figured you'd have a bunch of stuff 'floating in' from Oregon and Washington. It looks like only a couple of inches away...on a map that is.

[Kevin W Johnson]

I would trade every board foot of cypress in LA and never touch it again for easy access to the hardwood "just" up 81 from you in PA!

Yeah, it is really close by.....

[Thom Porterfield]

Ken:

I am with Roy on red cedar. I made a garden swing from it a few years ago and it's performing super well.

But if cedar (native to the PNW) is too mundane, consider redwood. I made a trestle table and benches out of (mostly) heart redwood and it's lived outside in the central Oregon climate for over 30 years. We waited to apply water sealer until it turned silver. Now, every spring, we wash it down with a hose and mild soap. About every five years, we give it a light sanding and reapply sealer. It's gorgeous.

You aren't THAT far from Oregon or Washington hardwoods. Take me fishing on the Clearwater, and I'll truck some over for you. :)

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Thom.....Fishing on the Clearwater? How about fishing on Kelly Creek....or the Lochsa.........or the Little North Fork?

And yes....we fish on the Clearwater, the South Fork of the Clearwater, the Snake.....the Selway in the spring.....


Do you remember the old Hamm's commercial...where the 2 guys canoe'd a vicious rapids? Local legend says it was just below Selway Falls. In the middle of the river is rock as big as my home....during spring runofff you can't see that rock....in summer you can't see beyond that rock.....LOL



BTW.....I already bought the white oak and it's in my shop acclimating......

Thom.....I lived in Bend for 20 months...and have an interesting Deschutes River fishing story that happened just below Wickiup reservoir and above the first falls......

[harold bowlin]

I built a porch swing this past december. Mine is hung outdoors so I needed something that would resist weather and last a long time. I picked Ipe. While researching what wood I should use I found that Ipe is virtually impervious to insects, doesn't warp or splinter. It will last for 40-50 years without finish and has the same fire rating as concrete. It turns a pleasant gray without treatment but can retain it's brown color with a regular application of oil. The only down sides are that it is so hard it dulls tools quickly so carbide is recommended and glue will not work outdoors so mechanical fasteners are required. I'm glad I used it and plan to build some more outdoor furniture with it soon.

232783

[Larry Edgerton]

What do you mean "fights you all the way?"

My first experiance with Jatoba was when I got a job building all of the furniture for an office suite. They wanted cherry but when I stopped in to Rare Earth Rardwoods they made me an offer on a truckload of Jatoba in the rough that I could not pass up. $1.37 bd ft.

There were boards in that load 42"s wide, no splits, beautiful color. I had no idea what I was getting myself into. First thing that happened is that something went very wrong in my Powermatic 180 while planing some of it out. All of a sudden all heck broke loose, and parts were flying. It appears that a bearing crushed and let the head swing around enough that the shaft snapped and chewed the planer up bad. Thats how I ended up with the SCM I have now. $13k loss on the job so far and I just got started. You can't cut jatoba to size, you have to sneak up on it. Even figuring an extra 1/2" for bow was not enough sometimes. You had to joint, rip, joint, rip and edge plane to size with some of the prettier boards.

And hard! They wanted a clear finish like glass, and just one desk to would take 8 hours with air tools to get perfect. And there were eight desks. You didn't have to worry about sanding a divot in it, thats for sure.

It would take a good Fisch or Clico mortise bit and just curl over the points and split then on the chip ejection side. I went through about $400 worth of morticing chisels.

I, being a younger man bid it with the same labor as I would have cherry. There really was no internet at that time and I knew nobody that had used it. I bid the job at $152K, and I worked the last month and a half for nothing. Hard to keep motavated when you are working out of your own savings.

I still had half a truckload left, but I charged out at a premium after that.


Ken, I spent a summer working on a ranch in Preston Idaho and snuk up and fished the Snake. Dang that thing is fast! I always wanted to kayak it but after breaking my leg kayaking the Grand Canyon I think I will leave that to younger men. I did manage to hook a few but the current was on their side and they knew how to use it. Gave up and fished some of the slower tributaries around there. I went to school in Missoula Mt. and lived across the street from the Clark Fork, but the Snake is much faster. would like to get back out there myself......

Larry

[Larry Edgerton]

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/images/attach/jpg.gif

Here is a figured Jotoba mantle. Even in my dark shop you can see the crazy coloring in the wood. I'm not saying it is not beautiful, just that the price of admission is steep.

Larry

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Ken, I spent a summer working on a ranch in Preston Idaho and snuk up and fished the Snake. Dang that thing is fast! I always wanted to kayak it but after breaking my leg kayaking the Grand Canyon I think I will leave that to younger men. I did manage to hook a few but the current was on their side and they knew how to use it. Gave up and fished some of the slower tributaries around there. I went to school in Missoula Mt. and lived across the street from the Clark Fork, but the Snake is much faster. would like to get back out there myself......

Larry

Larry....you think the Snake is fast? You should see the Lochsa or Selway rivers during spring runoff. Every 4 or 5 years there are one or more kayakers or rafters killed on the Lochsa during spring melts. If my memory serves me correctly, the people killed are always with a private group and not an commercial outfitter.

There are some serious rapids in this neighborhood and south of hear on the Salmon River.