Jet 414418 Wood/Metal Bandsaw questions

[Jerrimy Snook]

What are your opinions of a wood/metal bandsaw similar to the new Jet 414418 (http://www.jettools.com/us/manufacturing/en/product.html?node=4641&product=273698). It seems like a good choice if you want to work both but don't have the cash or space for 2 saws. What could the problems be? Would you use one blade for both wood and metal or would you take the time to switch blades. Lenox has a couple bands (Neo Type (http://www.lenoxtools.com/pages/Product.aspx?productId=NeoType) and Diemaster (http://www.lenoxtools.com/pages/Product.aspx?productId=Diemaster2r)) that are recommended for both materials but is there a compromise? Thanks for the info!

[Myk Rian]

I restored a 1966 Delta 14" M/W saw. Haven't used it for metal, but at least I have the capability.
You can use one for thin aluminum in wood mode, with a 10+tpi wood blade, but the blade won't be good for anything else.
Cutting metal causes those chips to be embedded in the tires, so many people won't use their saws for that.

232496

[Bruce Page]

A 3tpi blade will cut both wood & aluminum at typical wood cutting bandsaw speeds. The Diemaster or similar would cut wood, but not nearly as well. It would be required for steel cutting. I have bandsaw cut a lot of aluminum, I never had a problem cleaning the tires when I used a soft brass bristle brush.

[Van Huskey]

I am not a big fan of dual use machines because of metal swarf contaminating the wood use side but at least you wouldn't be using cutting fluid on that saw. There was a SERIOUS DoAll that sold on eBay on the West coast (No Cal) last week for less than half what that saw costs, my point being that saws money would buy a lot of saw in the used market but I understand used isn't for everyone.

The newer triangle spined Jet saws are solid saws but only represent good value when they are on sale. I will leave it to the guys that actually cut both on a regular basis to recommend specifics but my first suggestion would be used.

[Philip Loria]

i'm suprised that it is one HP. My Laguna 16 HD is 4.5 HP (Baldor). I would be leary of a big saw with that power rating.

[Van Huskey]

i'm suprised that it is one HP. My Laguna 16 HD is 4.5 HP (Baldor). I would be leary of a big saw with that power rating.

Not unusual for a SERIOUSLY geared down metal cutting saw but certainly weak on the wood side if one plans on resawing with it. Consider a DoALL 2013-V only has 2hp and it costs a lot more than a Laguna LT16HD, a Dake F-16 (near $6,000 saw) has only 1.5hp! In general metal cutting saws at this price point will be equipped with 1 hp motors.

[Perry Holbrook]

This doesn't exactly asnwer your question, but may be useful in some way. I needed a dedicated metal cutting band saw. New ones were in the $1200 area if I remember correctly. I had a 5 yr old Jet 18 inch band saw, that I also wanted to upgrade. My solution was to buy a Grizzly G0636X 5HP for the wood and converted the Jet to metal cutting. I replaced the motor with a 220V 3 phase with an inline 10:1 gear reduction. Added a variable frequency controller and done. Had less than $300 invested in the conversion. Works great because I can dial in the speed I need for each metal, and since I was using bi-metal blades on the Jet sawI could use them on metal. The upgrade on the wood saw was also a plus.

Perry

[Van Huskey]

I meant to include in case this wasn't hypothetical probably the best new wood/metal BS value is the Grizzly G0640X based on their G0513 wood cutting saw. They do include a 2hp motor so it is a better fit for the wood side. It certainly isn't as beefy as most serious metal saws in that size range but for occasional light duty metal work it would be fine.

[Jerrimy Snook]

I believe in the separation of wood and metal processing. Wood dust makes a mess on a metal working machine (I should have stated that differently considering the forum I posted this in).

Myk, I hadn't thought about metal embedded in the tires. I wonder if the engineers building these machines did. The horizontal I have has metal wheel w/out tires.

Bruce, my Lenox supplier actually prefers the Diemaster to the Neo-Type for wood cutting. It is available in a 3, 4, and 6 TPI hook tooth and has harder teeth than some of the other products in their line-up.

The biggest factors between wood cutting and metal cutting are speed and material thickness. Metal cutting should be under 200 ft/min and wood should be over 900 ft/min. Cutting steel at wood speeds will strip the teeth off the band. TPI should be appropriate to material thickness (which is something I need to study up on).

[Bruce Page]

Jerrimy, I was commenting more on the number of teeth, e.g. a 10-14TPI metal band as opposed to a 3-4TPI wood cutting band. The fine toothed band will cut wood, but slowly.

[Van Huskey]

I think it is hard to have a good metal/wood bandsaw on a budget that you don't find used. Good metal cutting saws tend to get expensive quickly due to power transmission requirements. On a relatively small saw the wheels may have to rotate at as few as 10-15 rpm for certain metals with wood cutting being as much as 30 times that. So if someone has significant needs in both materials two saws make sense UNLESS one finds a good deal on a serious metal saw that has bands speed capabilities of over 3,000 sfpm as well which do exist. It is just a difficult compromise to do well and cheap. Same goes for tooling, the Diemaster II is an excellent wood blade with proper TPI but to do while the TPI may be low enough for good contour cutting in most wood it will likely hurt you on the metal side. I think it is easier to get away with one saw than one blade.

[Jerrimy Snook]

I think it is easier to get away with one saw than one blade.
This seems to sum the whole scenario up.

Thanks all!

[Van Huskey]

This is seems to sum the whole scenario up.

Thanks all!

Thats the kinda answer folks like you like to hear, huh? :D

[Sid Matheny]

If you go this way be sure to clean up good before and after switching from wood to metal and back to wood. And DON"T try using your DC while cutting metal. Not only is it a fire hazard but those metal chips are hard on flexible duct work and the blades on the DC.

Sid

[Scott Lewis 509]

The biggest factors between wood cutting and metal cutting are speed and material thickness. Metal cutting should be under 200 ft/min and wood should be over 900 ft/min. Cutting steel at wood speeds will strip the teeth off the band. TPI should be appropriate to material thickness (which is something I need to study up on).


You just pinned this one down. :) While changing band speed is absolutely recommended, you also have to consider the size of the material that you cut (especially when cutting metals). A thicker material would require a coarser TPI, a thinner material is best cut with a finer TPI. It should give you the optimum life out of your blade.