Tree Design Bookshelf

[james glenn]

We are putting the finishing touches on our nursery before the arrival of our first child, and the only remaning item
is a bookshelf. I had thought of something traditional, but since the room is not overly spacious, I started to think about it
a little differently and did some research.

I would like to build something similar to these attached photos, and since we have a jungle theme for the room this would
look great with some books and stuffed animals on it. Of course I will make many lower 'branches' for the child to reach when
it is younger.

Now, my questions:

1. Easier to cut the tapered branches on the bandsaw from solid wood, then sand smooth; or build a internal frame of webs and 1/4" plywd. sheathing then laminate over this?

2. How to attach it to the wall? I figure about 6"-8" deep, getting a little narrower at the top. But still cannot just screw through this if I use solid wood.
If I use a plywd. frame and internal webbing, I could then use hidden blocking attached to the wall studs then screw thru the underside of the 'branches' to attach
to the blocking.

Looking for any and all ideas please. It has me a little stumped at the moment.

Jimmy

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[Jamie Buxton]

An advantage to solid wood is that you'd get to curve the trunk and branches, like real trees. Considering all the straight lines in the pics, I bet it is plywood. A disadvantage to solid wood is that the bookshelf will weigh quite a bit.

I'd fasten it to the wall with a screw or two that goes in above the top shelves. I'd use something like figure-8 clips. Above the upper shelf, they'd be generally invisible. (http://www.highlandwoodworking.com/figure8tabletopfastenerspk12.aspx)

In addition to your puzzle about how to fasten it to the wall, you should think about the joinery. Cutting and clamping joints that aren't at 90 degrees is a bit of a challenge.

[Thomas Bank]

You might be able to use cam screws like they use for Sauder and IKEA furniture to attach the "tree" to the wall?

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[John Aspinall]

These are wonderful looking! What a great idea to nurture a love of reading.

I have built (fairly conventional) bookshelves using recessed keyhole plates (e.g. http://www.craftparts.com/100-fh101-p-1601.html ) for hidden mounting.
You have to be able to hang the shelf from the keyholes so its center of mass falls below the keyholes. That way the shelf falls naturally against the wall.
In my case, the keyholes were at the top of vertical "bookends" (each shelf was a wide shallow "U").

In this case, the suspension points are less obvious, and more critical to get positioned accurately, but I think it could work.

[Dave Richards]

I'd be inclined to go with plywood boxes with solid wood on the front and back. I probably wouldn't fully assemble it until it is ready for mounting and then I'd use KD fasteners similar to those Thomas showed to attach the pieces together. Keyhole plates on the wall make sense to me.

[Bruce Page]

Those are wonderful!
I would want a solid attachment along the lines that Thomas suggested. Having raised 3 kids, I know that sooner or later my kids or one of their friends would’ve tried to climb it. :rolleyes:

[james glenn]

Thanks guys. I have figured that I need to build sections and then assemble/mount them on the wall. I will have the bottom of the branch coming up out of the floor, so
that should take some wight itself. Also figured on using biscuits or dowels to join the smaller branches, hoping it gives me a stronger joint and a way to control
it from sliding around while gluing.

Here is another question: Can the keyhole plates be mounted sideways? I get how they work vertically, but ever try them horizontally?

[Sam Murdoch]

Here is another question: Can the keyhole plates be mounted sideways? I get how they work vertically, but ever try them horizontally?

Yes, but getting all to align will be very difficult. Can't come up with a better idea except PERHAPS these: http://www.amazon.com/WoodRiver-Bed-Rail-Fastener/dp/B0039ZCQT6/ref=pd_sxp_grid_pt_2_0

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These might be more forgiving as regards alignment and would certainly resist coming apart once set.

I like these bookcases very much. Clever and nice looking. Worth the effort that's for sure.

[Matt Day]

Great thread! I'm interested in this build and I'd like to hear some suggestions on the joinery and mounting ideas as well.
Particularly, designs with veneered plywood boxes vs solid wood.

[Art Mulder]

2. How to attach it to the wall? I figure about 6"-8" deep, getting a little narrower at the top. But still cannot just screw through this if I use solid wood.


NO!

James, go measure a bookcase. Better yet, go to the library or bookstore and measure the average size of Kids books.

You want shelves that are probably a minimum of 10" deep. Kids picture books are big.

Otherwise this is a very cool looking shelf idea!

[Eric DeSilva]

How about these: http://www.leevalley.com/en/hardware/page.aspx?p=51933&cat=3,43648,43649&ap=1

I haven't used the ones pictured, but have used a similar design for some commercial floating shelves I've bought in the past. I'd still want to anchor it to the wall here and there, but these can provide some good support. Besides, there is a rumor that Lee Valley place makes some pretty good stuff.

[james glenn]

How about these: http://www.leevalley.com/en/hardware/page.aspx?p=51933&cat=3,43648,43649&ap=1

I haven't used the ones pictured, but have used a similar design for some commercial floating shelves I've bought in the past. I'd still want to anchor it to the wall here and there, but these can provide some good support. Besides, there is a rumor that Lee Valley place makes some pretty good stuff.

I was actually thinking about something like this. And I believe they will work for the sections I make from solid wood. I plan on making the "trunk" section out of 1/4" mdf frames, then laminate the walnut to it. This will keep the cost and weight down, then the smaller branches will be solid pieces that I will glue up to a required thickness. This also allows me to use the keyhole plates to secure it to the wall.

I settled on an overall depth of 7.75". I have looked at the books, and figure I would stack the larger books. I would be nervous if they were stood up on something like this as opposed to a traditional bookshelf.

Thanks for the ideas and help, I'll keep you all posted on my progress. I started a trial mdf frame and also laminated some walnut boards together.

[james glenn]

So I just typed up this latest update with all the details and whatnot, then like an idiot proceeded to click the wrong button and lost it all......

This is the condensed version:

I laid out the design of the 'tree' and masked around the outline with black artisian tape. Looks pretty intense and cool just as it is. (will post pic later)

Then I made a template of each branch from museum board (similar to chip board) and marked all stud locations.

Still haven't descided how to attach to the wall yet, but think I might have to try a few ideas mentioned above.

Started cutting out the smaller branches first by laminated some walnut boards then cutting them on the bandsaw followed by some passes on the jointer
to get them near smooth. Then some light sanding to finish them up.

A few new questions I do have:

1. What type of finish do you fellas recommend for this application?

2. I want to use dowels to hold the branches in place while glueing. I hope this stops them from slipping. If you look at the pictures above, you will notice
that each branch has a unique angle where it meets the larger branch/trunk. How do I drill the dowel holes if the face getting the hole is not perpendicular to the shelf face?
Or am I over thinking this and will realize it's not too hard once I set the drill press up?

3. Would it make more sense to dado each branch into the trunk of the tree, even though this means various angled dado's?

Thanks for all the help.
I will post some pics of the progress this weekend.

Jim

[Dave Richards]

If the dowels are only for registration to keep one part from slipping against another, I think I would skip the dowel and use some small finishing nails with their heads clipped off. Drive them in and clip the heads off with a side cutter about 1/6" above the surface. Press them into the mating surface and the parts won't slide. That's a lot faster and easier. If you want the dowels to provide some joint strength, you can do the same thing with the nails but pull them out after marking the opposite side. Drill for the dowels in the locations marked by the nails. Or you could get some dowel centers--little metal inserts to fit into holes drilled in one part with points to stick into the other part.

As to the dados? I'm not sure I understand.

[james glenn]

Here are a couple of pics of the outline and templates taped to it (note the blue tape is holding the templates in place).

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[Jay Jolliffe]

Those book shelves are really cool. I'd like to see yours when their done.

[james glenn]

I thought it would be a different, yet interesting way to incorporate the shelf into the theme. I'll keep progress pics posted.

I have another question for all of you:

I'm thinking about using "floating shelf" brackets to support this thing, but cannot use the brackets themselves because the mounting plate is too big
for most areas on this 'tree'.

Do any of you know of something that is threaded on one end and a rod on the other? I am thinking of basically a lag bolt without the head???
This will allow me to anchor the bolt to the wall and then slide the parts on the rod and attach them together.

[David Hawxhurst]

you could alway cut the head off a lag bolt or buy some rod and thread the section you need and then cut the unthreaded part to the proper length.

[Jay Jolliffe]

https://hachol02.hafeleonline.com/OA_HTML/ibeCCtpItmDspRte.jsp?item=19310&sitex=10020:22372:US#
I used these on some floating shelves. They worked pretty good....

[james glenn]

David: I was thinking that as well when I re-read my post. And after looking around last night, I found a hole jar full of 1/4" x 7" lags that
would do just the trick.

Here are some progress pictures. So far I have all the pieces laid out and am cutting them to rough size on the bandsaw, I then run them thru the jointer to get
a decent finish before the final sanding. The big section on the bench is the main trunck built with 1/2" plywood frame and 1/4" walnut veneer. Resawing an 8' board wasn't
as great as I thought it would be.

I still have to build the boxes for the larger main branches and get the veneer on those.

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[james glenn]

Now that summer is over and the farming thing slows down a little, I finally am getting back into the shop again.
First issue I now have is how to clamp these branches. I have drilled and dowelled them and thought a bandclamp would work
but it does not give even pressure and actually makes the branch 'tip'.

Any suggestions???

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[Shawn Pixley]

Depending upon which way your dowels orient, I would create a scrap jig to support the acute angle and then a tapered block opposite the doweled branch, so a clamp on the branch would have a 90 degree reference to pull on. I have heard other use hot melt glue to attache the clamping block. Afterwards they knock it off and clean the glue residue. I usually would fabricate clamp points on a jig.

[Bruce Page]

With a butt joint like that all of the strength is in the dowels, right? I don’t see why you would have to clamp it at all as long as you have a good square fit.

[Kenneth Speed]

James,

WOW! That is a far bigger tree than the ones in the original picture! You could do the trunk torsion box style with a hidden batted that the trunk would be fastened to with capped screws. The branches are going to be tough! You could affix then to the studs in the wall with a pocket hole type system and then cap the screw heads.


Ken

[james glenn]

Depending upon which way your dowels orient, I would create a scrap jig to support the acute angle and then a tapered block opposite the doweled branch, so a clamp on the branch would have a 90 degree reference to pull on. I have heard other use hot melt glue to attache the clamping block. Afterwards they knock it off and clean the glue residue. I usually would fabricate clamp points on a jig.

Yeah, I was thinking something like that while staring at the pieces after posting. I already have a similar jig that I am using for drilling the holes. It allows me to get perpendicular alignment of the ends of the branches on the drill press. Since the branches are all various angles, I need something adjustable.

Thanks Shawn.

[james glenn]

With a butt joint like that all of the strength is in the dowels, right? I don’t see why you would have to clamp it at all as long as you have a good square fit.

Bruce

I have a good fit, but since some of the dowels can only be drilled 3/8" into the branches, they don't always seem to stay perfectly immobile. So I wanted to
make sure the butt joint is glued tightly to help reinforce the connection.

[james glenn]

So I started putting the branches together with the dowels, but ran into an issue with using the drill press because I do not have enough height to always
fit the ends under the drill. I suppose I could use a hand drill, but am concerned about the lack of control and repeatability of getting the same angle on all three dowels per branch.

I thought about dado'ing them in, but realized I only get a perpendicular bottom. Since all the pieces are cut, I cannot use this method.

Next I tried multiple passes on the table saw, and then used a chisel to clean the bottom. And this is where my question comes in. What would be the best way to make these dados and be able to repeat the process at all various angles and widths. See pictures below for reference.

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[james glenn]

So it's been over a year, and I still have not finished this bookshelf. My little princess has taken up a lot more time than anticipated, combined with the farming and working full time, my shop time has been reduced considerably.

But I have completed the trunk part and the main wall. See the pictures below.
It was a little complicated attaching the 'branches' and making sure they would support the weight of books, and I ended up using a few different methods. (dowels, trim screws, brad nails, all combined with glue)



Now to finish the other wall.

[Dale Coons]

That is a WAY COOL bookcase, and the kid's pretty cute too!

Very nice.

d

[Mel Fulks]

Nice concept . Children really benefit from seeing imaginative and unusual spatial configurations . Do yourself a favor and draw a picture of it with her.

[james glenn]

Thanks guys.

Mel - she already has her own art easel, one side for chalk the other for dry erase marker, then it has a role of paper to draw/paint on. We get her some time on that nearly every day. She's only 19months old, but she loves drawing.

[Mark Blatter]

Nice concept . Children really benefit from seeing imaginative and unusual spatial configurations . Do yourself a favor and draw a picture of it with her.

I have been looking at different versions of this book case and yours is one of the of the best. I have been wanting to make one for my grandkids, but I have always had this little voice urging caution in the back of my mind. My third daughter (fourth child) started climbing standard bookcases at about 10 months. By 20 months old we would routinely find her perched on top of an old style upright (5' tall) piano. I keep looking at these bookcases and every time I see stairs instead of shelves.

I still love the look and feel that these give to a kids room and may try it out one of these days.

[Mark Bolton]

For fastening this to the wall....

Assuming of course because of the thickness of the lower main members (trunk) they will be hollow, why couldnt you cut ply or solids that would get screwed to the wall, then you would slip the hollow (no backs) trunk forms over that ply ledger (of sorts) and fasten into the ply. The fasteners could be plastic capped as they would barely be seen. The smaller stems/limbs on the wall the he left look like they may be thick enough for the same treatment?

[james glenn]

Mark - Great suggestion, however at the time I did not think of that, mostly because I did not want to use screws or any fasteners for this project. It was not until I built parts of it and started to assemble that I realized the wall attachment difficulties. Before finishing, this thing actually was in place without any wall attachments for 4 months or more and it held books without issue and probably could have been placed with only a ledge to stop it from sliding down. But for safety reasons I wanted more.

The trunk and two branches to the right are plywood sides with shop made veneer and the top and bottom are 1/4" thick with interior supports, so the ledgers would have worked great. I am now working to finish the branches on the adjacent wall and will look at trying this.

So far my daughter has not tried to climb this, only climbs chairs, but we try to keep an eye on her to see how she interacts with it. She does love picking out her books for story time each night though.