Wood barely absorbing stain/wrong color

[Jonathan Quick]

I started by sanding with 220 grit, then applying minwax pre-stain wood conditioner. This made the color so light that I just flipped my test piece over right away and tried again on bare wood.
I tried both minwax Colonial Maple and Golden Pecan.
Here's the results I was going after:
http://www.jeffswoodshop.com/StainColors.html

And then there's what I actually got. what in the world? the maple is pink looking when it should be reddish-orange. the pecan is OK but it took 3 coats just to get that color. I did wait the 6 hours between all 3 coats.
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[sheldon pettit]

I started by sanding with 220 grit, then applying minwax pre-stain wood conditioner. This made the color so light that I just flipped my test piece over right away and tried again on bare wood.
I tried both minwax Colonial Maple and Golden Pecan.
Here's the results I was going after:
http://www.jeffswoodshop.com/StainColors.html

And then there's what I actually got. what in the world? the maple is pink looking when it should be reddish-orange. the pecan is OK but it took 3 coats just to get that color. I did wait the 6 hours between all 3 coats.
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Well, normally i would tell you to first sand it with a coarser grit like 150, but under the circumstances of you not liking the one color at all, no matter what you sand it with, that part is not going to change, you either like a color or not, lol.

Since your using mudwax, which i detest to begin with, but understand that it is mostly used because of it's ready availability, I would first now suggest you sand it 150 and take it to the big box store you bought the stain from and have them do samples of differing stains, you think you might like, till you find the one you like best. Something i have had to do with my son's work at times when the customer was adamant on the mudwax stain being used. Normally unless there real busy, they will be more than happy if your supplying the sample material, to open stir and apply and wipe the stain so you can judge if it's what you want ok? With that done, you should be able to proceed sanding your project as such and applying something you both know you like, color-wise, and then apply your mudwax or other clears over it ok?

[Scott Holmes]

I did a job a few years ago that the interior decorator (ID) spec'd Minwax such and such oil stain. I informed the builder that this is only a "color" to the ID. If they want to tell you how to do it; let them do it themselves. You can match any Minwax "color" with the right mix of dyes.

Maple will not accept oil based stain very wel; prestain conditioners seal the wood to limit the amount of blotchiness. It makes it difficult for the stain to work, since the wood is sealed.

Dyes work much better on maple.

[Jonathan Quick]

Excellent info and problem is solved! I decided to change stain and I tried tracking down benjamin moore colonial maple instead because the color is amazing. as follows:
http://www.finewoodworking.com/assets/uploads/posts/45725/2011-08-28_14.15_.57__lg.jpghttp://dawnsevergreen.com/images/dadpics%20037.JPG

Turns out literally nobody has this stuff, infact I might guess it's discontinued as I couldn't even find it on ben's own website and none of their distributors in my area carried their stains.
That all led me to a place that had "Old Masters" stains, which I will have to say these are amazing. You basically wipe it on with a towel, buff off and you're done. It was all over my hands for hours, and came off without a mark. talk about convenient.

I mixed two different colors to try to get what i was wanting. It's not exact but I like it anyway. I mixed puritan pine and maple 1:1.
I think I need to add a little red to it to get what's above? Either way i'm happy.
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[sheldon pettit]

LOL, i agree Scott! In fact, long before mudwax was marketed or any other oil soluble dye like for instance Stars old penetrating dye lines, the industry as well as smaller shops that usually had the oils/water/and alcohol types in normal use, were able to make a much better product than mudwax, just using the primaries. I don't disdain oil dyes or any dye, they all have their place and purposes, just as pigments, couldn't do many coloration's without them. my disdain is that they actually have taken something that can give much better results than theirs has and perpetrated it upon the public at large. This would include Whatco? lol, and others to. Oil dyes were never meant to be used on blotchy woods, thus the uneeded "conditioners" being formulated so as to not loose ground in the sales of their product line. ok, before i turn this into a 4 page rant, lol, i will cease:D

[sheldon pettit]

Good for you!!

[Jonathan Quick]

So is their lacquer junk too? I wanted to seal it with a wipe-on poly or something easy sorta like this stain. using a brush with lacquer seems like it would come out streaky to me. probably gonna do low gloss and clear. the minwax polycrylic seemed nice but i'm second guessing that now. Place I got the stains from carried Coronado lacquers.


LOL, i agree Scott! In fact, long before mudwax was marketed or any other oil soluble dye like for instance Stars old penetrating dye lines, the industry as well as smaller shops that usually had the oils/water/and alcohol types in normal use, were able to make a much better product than mudwax, just using the primaries. I don't disdain oil dyes or any dye, they all have their place and purposes, just as pigments, couldn't do many coloration's without them. my disdain is that they actually have taken something that can give much better results than theirs has and perpetrated it upon the public at large. This would include Whatco? lol, and others to. Oil dyes were never meant to be used on blotchy woods, thus the uneeded "conditioners" being formulated so as to not loose ground in the sales of their product line. ok, before i turn this into a 4 page rant, lol, i will cease:D

[sheldon pettit]

So is their lacquer junk too? I wanted to seal it with a wipe-on poly or something easy sorta like this stain. using a brush with lacquer seems like it would come out streaky to me. probably gonna do low gloss and clear. the minwax polycrylic seemed nice but i'm second guessing that now. Place I got the stains from carried Coronado lacquers.

Jonathan, i would buy a small can of each, both poly-acrylic and the solvent poly and run test as to which you find to be easiest to use in your situation ok? Lacquer, unless your spraying, is not a good choice.

[Jonathan Quick]

Whoops I meant varnish not sure why I said lacquer. Since it's a workbench I know it's not gonna look perfect forever but I was looking more to protect the stain and preserve that nicely. Have any other recommendations that would be better for it? oil based varnish or water based varnish? something that wouldn't yellow, and also the wood is pretty soft. Time won't be an issue going to let the stain sit for a while.

[sheldon pettit]

The only thing that won't yellow would be the acrylics Jonathan, though the polyacrylics would be second choice for interior woods. What i don't like about them is they cool or give a more cold appearance to the wood, so you may want to warm them up with just a bit of amber dye, at least the dye will not continue to yellow as a ambering poly or varnish would ok? also the solvent base are easier to repair and recoat as time moves on, but if you can't spray then i would not use them.