Millers Fall #18

[Jerry Thompson]

My friend found `a MF #18 in Deadwood, SD and gave it to me. I love this plane. While tuning it up I lost the tote screw. This would be the short one at the front. I have tried SB screws and searched HW stores but to no avail. I am short on talent to make one. Any ideas?

[Paul Incognito]

If it's the same as a Stanley I have an extra that you're welcome to.
PM me your address and I'll send it down.
Paul

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

My MF 22 has the same threading as stanley parts - I replaced the front knobs screw on it with the parts stanley sells.

[Jerry Thompson]

I wonder if mine has been re-done?

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

Or maybe mine has. I know the handles weren't original, and someone had repainted the red frog black. Just a single data point.

[David Weaver]

The threads may be the same as stanley parts, but if you already have an MF knob or MF post and you need to match it against the complementary part, MFs are different than stanley. Stanley has the thick barrel nut at the top of their totes and knobs. MFs had a top like a flat slotted screw (it didn't go deeply into the tote or knob like the barrel nut). I probably have one of those screws for the knobs, but you need to put the picture of your knob at the top on here, or measure the depth of the recess below the top where the screw fits. The large diamter hole should have a depth of about 1 1/2 or 2mm or so, and not the 1/2 inch or 3/8ths inch or whatever the stanley barrel nut is.

If you have a stanley knob to go with the plane instead of MF, then you won't be able to use the original MF hardware without modifying the top of the knob so that the hardware beds tight.

Let us know.

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

Do all the MFs have single piece screws like you discuss David? I thought the earlier ones had brass screws - I just assumed it was a two-piece like the Stanley.

I had a Fullton or something that had the one-piece, shallow recess bolt to hold the front knob, but a Stanley knob with the recess for a barrell nut. I just shimmed it with washers.

Countersinking a knob a little deeper to make a barrel nut fit isn't hard either, I assume.

I may actually some parts kicking around here as well that might work, if the other two offers don't work for what you've got, Jerry.

Like David says, some measurements of what you need can help. Does the threaded rod from the tote thread into the hole for the missing one for the knob? Might make it easier to take a measurement of TPI or whatever so we have something to check against.

[David Weaver]

Maybe type 1s had the brass barrel nut and a rod threaded on both ends, but of the 10 or so MFs that I've had (all were of the red frog era), I never had anything except the one piece screw threaded only on the end that goes into the casting.

I never paid much attention to types on MFs because they are all pretty good users if they have a red frog, but I know enough to know they weren't type 1. I never would've gotten them as cheaply had they been type 1.

The funny thing about MFs is they cut corners on a lot of things, like those nuts, on the thumbwheels sometimes, on the tote material and paint on the castings, the stamped yoke for the adjuster. But, other things they didn't (they stuck to the earlier style frog with the milled face, and used a nice plain carbon tool steel iron). They have all been good users that i've seen, but the same can be said generally for any plane where the frog goes all the way to the casting. I haven't been as big of a fan of the planes, like some ohio planes, KK keen kutters and any others where the frog stops short of the casting and leaves a gap.

The beauty of the MFs is that they used to be a great option for the #9 and #14 (4 and 5 size for those reading who haven't had MFs) because you could get a good one for $10, and they are as nice to use as vintage stanley planes. I'm sure the same is true if you can find one locally from someone who thinks only stanley is a money name, but it's harder to get a clean one online now that there's been positive press on the forums.

I wouldn't go so far to say that they're better users than desirable type stanleys (they are probably about the same), and when I see them selling for stanley T11 prices, with resellers trumpeting stuff that's been said on forums, it makes me choke a little.

[Jerry Thompson]

It is not the knob. It is the tote. The screw is the little short one at the base @ the front of the tote. A kind person is sending me one.

[David Weaver]

Ahh...missed "short one at the front" being the short screw. My apologies for clogging the thread with pie in the sky talk about the MFs!

(I did have 2 18s at 1 point, they were great planes. I only sold them to force myself to use a plane I had put together, but I probably would've been much ahead - and definitely money ahead - with either one of the MF 18s).

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

! I did the same thing and read "small one at the front" as the knob. Glad to know I'm not the only one.

I don't remember now if that screw was the same threading as a Stanley on my 22. I was thinking the other screws. . .

[David Weaver]

I think they are the same, because I know i've pulled random short screws out of my parts box and put them in the front of an MF tote.

[Paul Incognito]

Duuude!
I sent a screw for the KNOB!
I also completely missed the "short one at the front" part of your description.
I'll dig into my parts box and see if I have the front TOTE screw.
Sorry,
Paul
BTW, the Stanley knob screw and the MF are identical, at least on the ones I have in my shop.

[john brenton]

I got tired of hunting down screws and rods so I have just resorted to retapping the holes and using new screws and rod. I have yet to have a problem with doing it that way.

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

John's method is how I would be tempted go, but that said, have you had any luck on finding that screw, Jerry? I found one in my shop today; I don't even remember where it came from, but it's in my bag of plane parts - My Miller Falls 22C jointer is the only non-modern plane I currently have that uses two screws on the rear tote, and that screw doesn't appear to have been replaced, so heck if I remember where this came from. But I pulled the screw on that plane and threaded this one in - threads right in, so if someone hasn't gotten you what you need, it's yours. The very first thread (farthest from the head) seems a bit rolled, (perhaps whatever it was threaded into previously wasn't tapped with a bottoming tap?) but still seems to hold tight in my MF.

[Paul Incognito]

I have one as well. I can get it in tomorrow's mail.
Between Joshua and me we'll get you what you need.
Paul

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

Well, I've got mine screwed into one of the "mystery" holes in the end of my benchtop, so I don't lose it. PM me if you want me to send it.

Paul, I've know you've sent me some little stuff, and I get the impression you've done the same for others, so if you want me to take this one, let me and Jerry know.

[Paul Incognito]

Thanks Joshua,
Seeing as I already sent Jerry the wrong screw, I'd like to make it right. I'll put the front TOTE screw in the mail to him today.
Paul

[Joshua Byrd]

Maybe type 1s had the brass barrel nut and a rod threaded on both ends, but of the 10 or so MFs that I've had (all were of the red frog era), I never had anything except the one piece screw threaded only on the end that goes into the casting.

I never paid much attention to types on MFs because they are all pretty good users if they have a red frog, but I know enough to know they weren't type 1. I never would've gotten them as cheaply had they been type 1.

The funny thing about MFs is they cut corners on a lot of things, like those nuts, on the thumbwheels sometimes, on the tote material and paint on the castings, the stamped yoke for the adjuster. But, other things they didn't (they stuck to the earlier style frog with the milled face, and used a nice plain carbon tool steel iron). They have all been good users that i've seen, but the same can be said generally for any plane where the frog goes all the way to the casting. I haven't been as big of a fan of the planes, like some ohio planes, KK keen kutters and any others where the frog stops short of the casting and leaves a gap.

The beauty of the MFs is that they used to be a great option for the #9 and #14 (4 and 5 size for those reading who haven't had MFs) because you could get a good one for $10, and they are as nice to use as vintage stanley planes. I'm sure the same is true if you can find one locally from someone who thinks only stanley is a money name, but it's harder to get a clean one online now that there's been positive press on the forums.

I wouldn't go so far to say that they're better users than desirable type stanleys (they are probably about the same), and when I see them selling for stanley T11 prices, with resellers trumpeting stuff that's been said on forums, it makes me choke a little.

That's odd, because only one of my five MF planes has the single-threaded-end tote screw. They are all Type 3s and 4s, as best I can tell. Luckily, I acquired most all of mine a couple of years ago before the MF prices really shot up for the plain-Jane No 9s and No 14s. Can't even get a junker now for less than $20 shipped.