Which one is stronger?

[Rob Wong]

I'm making a framed glass door. Which joint is stronger, if one is? I will be using the Festool Domino for the loose tenons and the door will be 66 " tall.
Thanks,
Rob

[Cary Falk]

I don't know if one is stronger than the other but I have always seen doors made like #2. It is probably mostly for looks so you don't see any end grain. If it was much weaker then I would think you would see #1 more often despite it's looks.

[Lee Schierer]

The strongest joint would be a half lap joint made to look like selection #2 from the front.

[G Douglas Fowler]

The 2nd is the traditional method. Usually the bottom rail is deeper to provide better support against sheer. The other factor is the joinery. Since there is a lot weight involved the tenons should be agressive and pegged.

[Phil Thien]

Note that Krenov made an awful lot of doors that looked like #1, but I always suspected that it was because many of them were curved.

[Bill White]

#2. That's gonna be a long piece of glass. Tempered?
Bill

[Rich Engelhardt]

Won't #1 put the joint where rail and stile meet in plain view on the edge of the door?

[Sam Murdoch]

# 2 is the way to go. Tenon the rails to fit into the mortise that will be also be used to house the glass AND use the Domino Tenons too. This creates a very strong door with near perfect alignment of the faces of the rails and stiles. Do the Domino slots BEFORE you tenon the end of the rails and run the mortise into the stiles. The depth setting will be different from the rails to the stiles because you are letting the rails into the stiles to the shoulders. This will be evident if you do a mock up.
Here is a photo (though my panel is wood not glass - the same principals apply):

229315

[Bob Wingard]

Hmmm ... if you're not satisfied with the multitude of responses to the same question in a different forum, you're probably gonna come away from her unsatisfied also.

[Bruce Page]

Rob, each door will have around 9lb of glass. (assuming you will be using 1/8” thick glass) I agree with Lee, a half-lap joint with pegs would be my first choice.

[Bruce Page]

Here’s a door I did that carries ~ 25lb of glass. Its conventional mortise & tenon with square ironwood pegs. The pegs add an incredible amount of strength to the joint and would also be suitable for a half lap.

[Rob Wong]

Hmmm ... if you're not satisfied with the multitude of responses to the same question in a different forum, you're probably gonna come away from her unsatisfied also.

Bob, I am not disatisfied with the number of responses I've been getting. I want as many different ideas as possible and apprectiate all that take the time to respond. I'm okay with going with the design on the right. Now it seems I may have a strength issued with just going with the Domino. Which now is more important than my first question.

thanks,
Rob

[Bob Wingard]

Dominos have their place ... but, in a door that is carrying a heavy piece of glass ... I prefer something more secure.

[Sam Murdoch]

Lots of other questions about the construction of such a door, e.g., how wide is this door, how thick is the frame stock, how many hinges will be used, are you using tempered glass, and why not add another rail? Using frame stock that is 7/8" or thicker and truly flat and straight, I am completely comfortable suggesting the system I show in my post above. Dominos provide a very well fitted tenon and with the additional shoulder and glue surface of the tenoned rail I stand by my suggestion. Nothing wrong with pinned half laps of course - a very fine and rugged joint.

[Jerome Hanby]

For doors on a lathe stand, I used a slip joint that I glued and pegged that ended up looking like #2...

[Curt Harms]

Bob, I am not disatisfied with the number of responses I've been getting. I want as many different ideas as possible and apprectiate all that take the time to respond. I'm okay with going with the design on the right. Now it seems I may have a strength issued with just going with the Domino. Which now is more important than my first question.

thanks,
Rob

You won't have strength issues if you go with Lee & Bruce's idea -- half lap joints. Titebond III lists its strength at 4000 lbs. P.S.I. I'll bet you have more than 1 square inch to glue and there's no end grain. I assume the rails & stiles won't be wide enough to get into crossgrain gluing problems.