Potential USA Shenhui Customers: Buyer Beware!

[Doane Buksar]

I ordered RECI 80W, SH-G1280 from Shenhui in mid November of last year. The machine was received late January and was missing a number of critical parts despite assurances from the sales rep Pascal that everything was accounted for.

The missing parts are as follows:



Honeycomb table
Aluminum knife table
Spare Z axis stepper
Spare Stepper driver
Spare lenses


I have expended a lot of effort in an attempt to recover these missing items with many e-mails to Pascal. The lenses were supposed to be sent out by air several weeks ago but I have yet to see anything. The tables, I was told, were too heavy to go by air and needed to be shipped by sea. The import process was something I really wanted to avoid and I needed to find out more details as to who would be paying shipping and customs fees. I asked again that the parts be sent by air and to be marked under warranty replacements and was told that the crate was already at sea! Yesterday, I received a freight invoice for $126 from a random logistics company in Los Angeles. I guess that answered the question about who expected to pay for the import and shipping fees.
I spoke with this freight company and stated that I did not authorize the shipment and that I would not be paying the invoice. E-mails to Pascal have yet to be adequately answered.

My assumption is that this is the end of their involvement and that I will not get the parts that I have already paid for.

I hope my experience will give other USA customers pause before ordering and I apologize to anyone who may have placed a Shenhui purchase based on my initial positive review.

What a shame…

[Gary Hair]

With all of the other successful orders from Shenhui I'm surprised that you are having this much trouble. It seems like there are parts "forgotten" on some of the other posts I have read, but it always seems that they got the parts eventually. No mention of who paid the shipping though.
Have you suggested to Pascal that they PayPal you the money for freight? They can send it and pay the fees so you would get the entire $126. Just a thought.

I'm going to be in Medford the end of May, any chance I could stop in and see your laser?

Gary

[Ross Moshinsky]

I think you should pay the $126 and then look for a refund afterwards. I know you've already paid for everything and this is a bit of a kick in the teeth, but I'd suck it up and pay for it.

This is also why I always suggest people pay with credit cards. When you wire money, you have no legal recourse. When you pay with a credit card, you hold all the power. It keeps people honest. Even if you pay the 3% extra, you're only talking about $150-200 insurance. That's very low all things considered.

[Doane Buksar]

Gary, I would welcome you to vist when you are in the area. As for the $126, I would be very happy to have paid that amount and be done with it. However, that would only be the start. That money is for the port fees in Los Angeles only. Because Shenhui shipped the crate to Los Angeles, it still needed to get trucked up to Seattle. Once it Seattle, it would go through through US Customs & FDA. Afterwards, if all was well, it would get put on another truck and finally get delivered to me in Sourthern Oregon. I imagine no less than $1k although I'm only guessing. All this for $500 in parts. I tried to nail down all these particulars, but Pascal would never answer my inquiries.

[Craig Matheny]

Doane my only thought is if the items where sent to you originally you would have had to pay the freight and custom fees so why not pay them now? Then as mentioned above request a refund or split the fees for the hassle make it a win win for both parties and in the mean time you get your laser up and running.

Good Luck

[Rodney Gold]

I am amazed they don't learn , seems a problem with Pascals orders , you aren't the first one placing orders with pascal and having significant parts missing.
Pretty bloody basic business/production methodology to check all the parts on the order are there. I would complain bitterly and rant and rave a bit , but to whom I don't know.. Point pascal and your tech guy to this post ..

[Khalid Nazim]

Rodney,

Can you reach out to your contact and have her escalate the issues people are having with Pascal? I am sure if their upper management learns about this, they would take corrective actions immediately.

[George M. Perzel]

Doane;
I understand your frustration and anguish as I went through the same "missing parts" dilemma with Shenhui, in spite of assurances by your friend Pascal that the shipment was checked and verified against the invoice. Fortunately for me, I was able to get my 80 watt spare tube, a knife table, and some small parts all airfreighted to me within two days of notifying them they were missing-all without any custom fees or paperwork as they sent it via TNT as "warranty spare parts". A month ago I had an issue with one of my tubes-they air freighted a new one to me after I demanded it as they were going to include it in your shipment (maybe they did) and I guess expect us to meet somewhere in Kansas as you are in Oregon and I am in New York-geography is also not one of their strong suits. Bottom line?- always some nagging little issue with Shenhui but so far they have always responded immediately to emails or Skype and my twin-headed laser is working fine.
I had mentioned in previous posts that the only way to handle the missing parts issue with them is to demand, no make that DEMAND!-that they send them air freight as "wareranty spares"-all the customs and FDA paperwork goes away.
Craig- he already paid duty on the original invoice which included the missing parts.
I also suggest that anyone ordering from Shenhui DEMAND to go through Blanca-Pascal has been given many chances to atone for his past sins and has blown them all.
Best Regards,
George
Laserarts

[Rodne Gold]

Due to work heirarchy , it appears that my connection can't "interfere" with other folks orders. They have a less than diligent person handling their most important N American market and boggering it up for them. I would now demand a video of them checking and putting the stuff in your crate if anyone chooses to order from em in the future. I don't think they out to cheat you , more just a disconnect tween despatching/packing/order taking. They not a mickey mouse org so I don't see how they keep messing up in this regard.

[Doane Buksar]

That’s a good idea about the video Rodne. In my case I wanted photos and personal assurances from Pascal. For anyone still wanting to do business through Pascal, his responses might be similar to the following e-mails that I saved and now refer to when I want validate my dissatisfaction:

Pascal,
Before I send the money for the deposit, I will need your assurance that you will personally check each and every item and spare part on the Invoice before shipment.
Can you verify that you will do this?
(Send 11/15/2011)
Dear My Friend,
…Yes, sure, we will make photos when we package the machine, and we will send you the package pictures for check. please don't worry about this...

Best Regards.,
Pascal


Pascal,

Please check each item listed and spare part on the invoice to make sure it is included in the crate. I would like you to do this personally. I would also like to see pictures of the spare parts.

When you- personally- verify that all the parts are accounted for, I will send the remaining balance.

(Sent 11/30/2011)
Dear Doane,
thnaks for your email.
We are sure that we put all psare parts on the machine, my friend, please don't worry…

Best Regards.,

[john banks]

It is a 5 minute check at most for two people separately to check everything against the invoice is there and tick a box each which could become part of their certification before sending out. It would save so much later hassle, expense and bad reputation for them!

[George M. Perzel]

John;
Of course what you say regarding a 5 minute checklist makes perfect sense to our western logic and minds. I have been through the whole routine at least four times with Pascal and have received all of the same assurances that Doane has- and more. They have twice assured me that the chief packer responsible has been fired and hung by his kujimies from the Great Wall and his 10 closest relatives have been sent for redoctrination to a monastery in Tibet. I am at a loss of how to get through to them and can only suggest that anyone ordering withhold 20% of the payment until the shipment is received and get written agreement from them that any missing items-ANY- will be sent immediately via air freight and marked as "warranty replacement" parts.
If anyone out there (in the USA) is thinking about ordering from Shenhui please contact me via PM before finalizing anything with Shenhui and before paying anything. I have a scenario in mind which should eliminate this issue once and for all without taking away anyone's rice bowl.
Best Regards,
George
Laserarts

[Gary Hair]

If anyone out there (in the USA) is thinking about ordering from Shenhui please contact me via PM before finalizing anything with Shenhui and before paying anything. I have a scenario in mind which should eliminate this issue once and for all without taking away anyone's rice bowl.

Why not post here for all to see George?

[George M. Perzel]

Gary;
I'm going to sacrifice my Knight to pin his queen against his king-but wait, if I tell him what I'm going to do he probably won't fall for it.
Best Regards,
George
Laserarts

[Nick Foley]

I'm thinking about placing an order through Shenhui - but I'm nowhere near the final stages yet. Right now I'm just trying to figure out the best venue for placing an order with them, and looking for a current catalog/price list.

Several months ago, they seemed to be all over eBay, but now I can't find much of a presence there... Their website is a chore to navigate, and doesn't exactly get in to details.


How are people on this forum placing orders? eBay? Local Rep? Their website? Something else? Any guidance would be appreciated.

[Tom Schulze]

I'm currently preparing an order with Shenhui through Pascal, he handles the US orders. If you want his contact info I'll be glad to send it your way. Just be prepared to spend you nights chatting with him because of the time difference. Also be prepared to make sure he is very thorough on your order to get it correct and shipped correctly. George has formulated a plan for this. I have modified it a bit and will give my results as I go through the order process. I'm not sure if I can post his info in here, but I'll be glad to send it to you via PM.

Tom

[Nick Foley]

I'm currently preparing an order with Shenhui through Pascal, he handles the US orders. If you want his contact info I'll be glad to send it your way. Just be prepared to spend you nights chatting with him because of the time difference. Also be prepared to make sure he is very thorough on your order to get it correct and shipped correctly. George has formulated a plan for this. I have modified it a bit and will give my results as I go through the order process. I'm not sure if I can post his info in here, but I'll be glad to send it to you via PM.

Tom


That would be excellent. Did he direct you to a pricelist or was it all conversation-based?

[Tom Schulze]

That would be excellent. Did he direct you to a pricelist or was it all conversation-based?

I sent you a PM

[Ross Moshinsky]

The best way to protect yourself is to use a credit card. If the shipment is damaged, missing something, ect ect ect all you need to do is call your credit company and they will do a charge back.

[Greg Facer]

I didn't see the last posts in this thread, and fortunately am not dealing with Pascal (Beata Wang). My process is simply to only pay the balance when I see photos of the machines (getting 2) and, most importantly, spares. It will no doubt delay the shipping a few days to get all the photos to my satisfaction but so be it.

Much indebted to everyone here though, looking forward to having some experience to contribute!

Greg Facer

[Ross Moshinsky]

I didn't see the last posts in this thread, and fortunately am not dealing with Pascal (Beata Wang). My process is simply to only pay the balance when I see photos of the machines (getting 2) and, most importantly, spares. It will no doubt delay the shipping a few days to get all the photos to my satisfaction but so be it.

Much indebted to everyone here though, looking forward to having some experience to contribute!

Greg Facer

How exactly is that going to help if they package things incorrectly and things arrived damaged?

Again, insist on paying with a credit card. Even if you have to pay extra, it will be worth it. Wire transfer = 0% buyer protection. Credit Card = 100% buyer protection. I've been buying on the internet for a long time. There is one universal truth you should always follow: Buy with a credit card.

[Rodne Gold]

I don't think you can pay them via CC.

[Marc Pod]

You can pay using paypal. Everything I deal with them I pay through paypal.

[Greg Facer]

I decided not to go Paypal after reading about how they put up a bit of a fuss and te fact that there seems I be zero protection if the seller clears out the PayPal account first. False protection is worse than no protection ( just caution and research).

My view anyways! However, if I could use a credit card directly that would be another story, although looking up the card agreement would be in order!

[Ross Moshinsky]

I decided not to go Paypal after reading about how they put up a bit of a fuss and te fact that there seems I be zero protection if the seller clears out the PayPal account first. False protection is worse than no protection ( just caution and research).

My view anyways! However, if I could use a credit card directly that would be another story, although looking up the card agreement would be in order!

I'm not going to go into great detail on how Paypal does things and why there is a lot of false information about them. I'm just going to post facts.

1. When used correctly, Paypal is nothing but a company that processes credit card payments online.
2. You do not have to talk to Paypal's claims department. In fact, I suggest that you don't even bother.
3. Your credit card company will push Paypal around as if they are nothing if required. Paypal's abilities are very limited. A credit card company has a lot of power. The credit card company essentially tells the processor (Paypal in this instance) to give them the money. They do. Then the processor (Paypal) is left trying to collect their money.

Paypal has different tricks to make this whole process more complicated than it should be. Don't fall for them. Sign up for Paypal. Register your credit card. DO NOT TIE YOUR BANK ACCOUNT TO YOUR PAYPAL ACCOUNT. Make the payment to whomever you need to. Afterwards, remove the credit card from Paypal. If you have an issue, flip over your credit card and call the number on the back. DO NOT CONTACT PAYPAL.

I've been buying online for over 15 years. From big companies to small companies to individuals. The biggest mistake people make when buying online is processing a payment not through their credit card. The second biggest mistake people make is not contacting their credit card company as soon as a problem arises. If you do those two things, and your credit card company is a real credit card company (AMEX is the best but Visa/MC from any major bank are fine too) you will have no problems getting a refund. It's when people pay via wire transfer, bank check, or money order they get in trouble. They get in more trouble when they contact someone like Paypal and ask them to fix the issue. They also get into trouble when they don't even bother getting a 3rd party involved. Paypal have policies to protect Paypal. Credit card companies have policies to protect the consumer. As long as you're in the right, the credit card company will protect you.

[Doane Buksar]

My missing parts arrived in Seattle and are awaiting Customs clearance. I got a quote from the broker for the remaining misc. fees including delivery to my house in Southern Oregon which came to ~$650.00. I submitted the quote to Pascal and he has refused to pay stating that Shenhui has already paid the sea freight and "all fees in China" (whatever that means).


I am now faced with a decision. Either pony up $650 for parts that I have already paid for -or- decline possession. I suppose that I can try and recover some of my original payment to Shenhui by contesting to American Express since I paid by Paypal. However, that still leaves me without a honeycomb cutting table (which I really want).

[Gary Hair]

Doane,
You can buy a honeycomb table in the US. I bought mine from Mike Null when he had the business, he sold it to someone else but I can't for the life of me remember the name of the company...

I would immediately contest the charges with AMex, timing is everything with credit card disputes. At least the money will be taken away from them until you get it sorted out. You can also file a dispute with PayPal but they are pretty worthless in this kind of circumstance, in my experience anyway.

Gary

[Tony Lenkic]

Gary - does En-gravs sound familiar?

[john banks]

I was interested in getting the longer cone section that a member is receiving with his machine. The price from Shenhui was good (under $40), but their bank fee (even with Paypal) was similar again, and then airmail was similar again, all making it unattractive. It is a shame you have to pay the same value of the item again in bank fees, yet I can order a $5 small part from Hong Kong and that is the price delivered!

[Gary Hair]

Gary - does En-gravs sound familiar?

ding, ding, ding, we have a winner!

[Gary Hair]

I was interested in getting the longer cone section that a member is receiving with his machine. The price from Shenhui was good (under $40), but their bank fee (even with Paypal) was similar again, and then airmail was similar again, all making it unattractive. It is a shame you have to pay the same value of the item again in bank fees, yet I can order a $5 small part from Hong Kong and that is the price delivered!

No kidding. I ordered 10 - .8mm pcb drill bits and 5 - 20 degree pcb engraving bits, total price, including shipping from Hong Kong - $19.85. I can't even buy 1 engraving bit here for that...

[Ross Moshinsky]

My missing parts arrived in Seattle and are awaiting Customs clearance. I got a quote from the broker for the remaining misc. fees including delivery to my house in Southern Oregon which came to ~$650.00. I submitted the quote to Pascal and he has refused to pay stating that Shenhui has already paid the sea freight and "all fees in China" (whatever that means).


I am now faced with a decision. Either pony up $650 for parts that I have already paid for -or- decline possession. I suppose that I can try and recover some of my original payment to Shenhui by contesting to American Express since I paid by Paypal. However, that still leaves me without a honeycomb cutting table (which I really want).

Contact Amex. You're going to be shocked how they bend over backwards to help you.

I'd be shocked if Amex doesn't refund you the full amount of the machine.