Anyone following Paul Sellers methods?

[Don Dorn]

I've been watching this person since his videos started appearing. His methods seem pretty straight forward, so I've tried a few and they have worked well for me. No, I'm not getting quite the same results in quality, but they are certainly satsifactory. He seems to use a modest set of tools and some old methods of work.

My opinion is that he adding to the craft and like Chris Schwarz, think we are better off having him provide his unique (well, at least to some of us) way of woodworking. Anyway - that's my opinion and am curious as to others thoughts.

[john davey]

Yes, I don't have his videos yet but have seen all of his clips on youtube. Actually he is demonstrating at the woodworking show in VA today and I was planning on going mostly to see him (and drool over the Veritas line). I like how he does minimal layout on a dovetail. I am a klutz doing the Cosman divider way but sometimes all of the layout is needed :)

[Bill Rittner]

I saw him at the Springfield MA woodworking show. His methods are sound and will work. With practice they will work better. Frankly I was impressed.

[Bill Haumann]

I really enjoyed Sellers' demonstrations at the NJ show. Each demo was not the same, by the way. I did get his book and am looking forward to working through it. His approach is quite eye-opening for me.

[Greg Berlin]

I bought his DVDs and book after watching him at the Baltimore show and I've been completely impressed with his no nonsense form of working with hand tools. He's the reason started using hand tools for everything. He also is a very personable guy. I'll email him with questions time to time on certain things I may be having trouble with and he always responds, usually in the same day. I'd love to go to one of his weeklong classes in new York. He makes working with hand tools seem very easy and straight forward and after some practice, his methods do work for sure. It's amazing what you can make with a couple sharp chisels, a square, a marking knife , a smoothing plane, and couple hand saws.

[Roy Griggs]

If he is the same Paul Sellers...He should know what he's talking about...he served a 7 yr. apprenticeship (I believe is what he said) in England. He is or was the MasterCraftsman at Homestead village near Waco. I took a class from him several years ago, there. Very intellegent and talented as a teacher. Several years later I am still using his no nonsense method of restoring an edge and getting back to work. My shooting board is a copy of one he had at the class. Some people and their methods are easier to relate to and use; Paul seemed to be one of those people. 'Course his English is a little "thick".

[john davey]

I did make it to the show today. I watched one of Pauls demonstrations and have to say I was impressed. It helps that he seems to be very comfortable with a mic and speakers but he really got his points across. They had a small tv going with one of his videos and they look recent. Meaning I think they are HD and fairly well produced. Don't quote me on this as it is just my observation. I did not purchase the DVD's because he did not accept credit cards and I only had enough cash for the book on me. I did buy his book. He is a minimalist in his teachings from what I can tell. He mentioned getting saws and planes off ebay several times. Also said we do not need thicker irons in the planes and showed us his sharpening strategy to use the thinner iron. He used a chisel (blue chip) spokeshave, #4 and a few tenon saws he said were less than $20 bucks a pop on ebay. He does sharpen with diamond stones and a strop. Greg, I would love to hear your comments on the dvd's. Roy, he mentioned Texas once and also said he has done commissions for the Bush family as well as the White House. So I think it is the same guy. If I could find the time I would love to take a class up in NY at his new school. Probably a pipe dream for me sadly. I am going to contiue to follow his blog and might get some of the DVD's. Paul.... Get a credit card account casue I would have the dvd's now if you had one :).

Other observations from the show:

It was about 80% router bits, sand paper and band saw jigs which is what I expected from last years visit in Baltimore. Paul was great. Tommy Mac was there and I thought he was good as well. I also bought his book which is plans from his projects for the first year. Well, it was cheap and he signed it and I really liked the wall cabinet episode he did and it is in there. TV does fatten people up. Tommy looks great on TV and looked skinny as a rail in person. Being a fatso I guess that is a good thing :). Honestly he was very personable and hung out at the Woodcraft booth after his show and spoke with anyone weather you bought his stuff or not. Lee Valley had a display set up. I am sure I will owe the convention center a cleaning bill after the drool I left all over the floor. I am getting a LA jack with my next order. I know Paul just spoke of old baileys and such but this plane needs me :). And to be honest Paul had several obvious Veritas handles sticking out of his tool cabinet and several Veritas Carcass saw on the bench. Nuff said :). Sadly I have one slight Veritas gripe that I have to put out. Someone please explain to me why the new 6" rule is $25. I know good measuring tools can cost even more. I saw this thing and was so in love until I saw the price when it came out. Told myself I just have to see something like this before purchasing and cannot drop a 1/4 benji on it sight unseen. OK, I've seen it and am not sold :(. I love the design but can't see that much for it. Go ahead and slam me. I am 100% sure Rob et al have the exact reason for this but it is the one and only Veritas item I don't understand. LOVE everything else and could have played in that both for hours so don't call me a hater but I just need a little help with this one.... John

[Darren Brewster]

You can also order a free sample DVD from his website which is a 30 minute sampling of the full set. That and all of his videos on Youtube really impress me a lot.

[Tom Scott]

Paul is a great teacher. I took a week long handtool course when he was at Homestead Heritage about 12+ years ago. It's really what got me started in hand tools. He really breaks tasks down to simple steps and takes a lot of the mystery out of it. As others have mentioned, he does not push the need for a lot of tools or high dollar tools. Simple methods and simple tools, but great results. A lot of the projects in his videos look to be the same ones he used in the course I took. Each project highlighted a new connection...dados, mortises, and dovetails. His sharpening routine is very simple and appears the same as when I took his course except that he didn't emphasize rounding the bevel.

[lowell holmes]

+1 for what Tom said.

I know Paul from the school at Homestead Heritage. He is as talented as any woodworker I've seen or met.

[Steve Branam]

I did a review of his series on my blog: http://www.closegrain.com/2011/12/review-paul-sellers-working-wood-dvd.html.

I also got a chance to meet him at the Woodworking Show in Springfield: http://www.closegrain.com/2012/01/paul-sellers-at-woodworking-show.html (includes YouTube video of some of his presentation).

I heartily agree with everything good everyone has to say about him here. Nice guy, great skills, loves what he's doing and loves sharing it. I'll be showing my daughter his dovetail method today for a box she's building. I'll put that on the blog as well.

[Ralph Boumenot]

I started watching his videos on You Tube and then reading his blog. I bought his book and the artisan DVD series. I've been using and practicing all he says and it's working. The main points I took away from his dvd series is one - proper use of the knife and knifing a wall, two - try to be accurate as you can no matter what you are doing, and lastly, patience -allow what you doing to unfold at it's own pace. Great teacher and highly effective for me. I can see a difference in what I am doing.
ralph

[Jerome Hanby]

Sadly I have one slight Veritas gripe that I have to put out. Someone please explain to me why the new 6" rule is $25. I know good measuring tools can cost even more. I saw this thing and was so in love until I saw the price when it came out. Told myself I just have to see something like this before purchasing and cannot drop a 1/4 benji on it sight unseen. OK, I've seen it and am not sold :(. I love the design but can't see that much for it. Go ahead and slam me. I am 100% sure Rob et al have the exact reason for this but it is the one and only Veritas item I don't understand.

Is there some way to see this rule online? I searched through the LV website and couldn't find one that matched this price/description...

[Steve Friedman]

Is there some way to see this rule online? I searched through the LV website and couldn't find one that matched this price/description...
I think John must be referring to the new-ish Veritas precision square that's $24.50. It's a square, not a rule, and I use it all the time.
http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=66573&cat=1,42936

Even the Starrett 6" rules are less than $25. I don't think Veritas makes a 6" rule. Lee Valley, however, does sell at least two 6" rules.

One is the "Cabinetmaker's Rule" with a hang-hole for $2.90.
http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=32568&cat=1,43513

The other is a much thicker and wider "Pocket Rule" for $10.60.
http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=32566&cat=1,43513

FWIW, I keep several of the cheaper ones hanging all over the place, but the thicker ones are much nicer.

Yes, I am a LV addict.

Steve

[john davey]

Yes I meant the square Sorry...

[Justin Green]

Just watched Paul Sellers do a raised panel with a #4 Stanley. Pretty cool. I wonder how many he had to do to become that proficient?

[Mark Seay]

My wife gave me his DVD set and book for Christmas a couple of years ago. After watching a few episodes, I thought he was quite entertaining but there was no way I'd be able to do any of that stuff with hand tools. Then, I went to the Woodworking Show in Ft. Worth and watched some of his demonstrations and I must say, I was hooked. I had always used water stones for sharpening chisels and such and after watching Paul's sharpening technique, I bought some diamond plates and a piece of leather for a strop and some green chromium oxide compound and tried his techniques. After sharpening my plane irons on my Bedrock design Wood River plane and an old Stanley #3 and a Millers Falls #9 and a Millers Falls #14 and a couple of block planes (you see where I'm going here, right) they all worked as never before. I was getting those nice thin cottony shavings with no catches or severe dig ins. After the satisfaction of learning how to sharpen properly, I decided to tackle his Joiners Workbench. I am about 95% done and like the design quite a lot. I must admit that some power tools were utilized in the process, but I have used planes and chisels more on this project than in all the work I've ever done. I even cut the mortise and tenons for the legs by hand which I have never done before. I got started working wood because of Norm Abram (and I'm NOT ashamed to admit it) but I think my work will improve dramatically by know the old tried and true methods and it will probably give me greater satisfaction in the process as well as the results.

[Matthew Hills]

Just watched Paul Sellers do a raised panel with a #4 Stanley. Pretty cool. I wonder how many he had to do to become that proficient?
I'm sure a lot. But I got a pretty decent result the first time I tried to do one for fun after watching his youtube video on this. In the video, I think he'd made a point to mention that he favors the light weight of the Bailey #4 for this operation. Very good advice. I tried (briefly) with my LN#4, before sharpening up an old stanley and using that instead. Light weight and sharp blade helps a lot.


Matt

[Matthew Hills]

... I had always used water stones for sharpening chisels and such and after watching Paul's sharpening technique, I bought some diamond plates and a piece of leather for a strop and some green chromium oxide compound and tried his techniques. After sharpening my plane irons on my Bedrock design Wood River plane and an old Stanley #3 and a Millers Falls #9 and a Millers Falls #14 and a couple of block planes (you see where I'm going here, right) they all worked as never before. I was getting those nice thin cottony shavings with no catches or severe dig ins. ...

Does Paul put any camber on the blades? (to prevent the corners from digging)?

Matt

[lowell holmes]

Yes! He does. He also sharpens freehand.

[steven c newman]

Just watched a "shooting board" video of his. Might just have to try one.

[Tony Zaffuto]

I have the DVD set. Does anyone know if the DVD's are the same as the YouTube or online videos?

[Rob Lee]

(snip)

Sadly I have one slight Veritas gripe that I have to put out. Someone please explain to me why the new 6" rule is $25. I know good measuring tools can cost even more. I saw this thing and was so in love until I saw the price when it came out. Told myself I just have to see something like this before purchasing and cannot drop a 1/4 benji on it sight unseen. OK, I've seen it and am not sold :(. I love the design but can't see that much for it. Go ahead and slam me. I am 100% sure Rob et al have the exact reason for this but it is the one and only Veritas item I don't understand. LOVE everything else and could have played in that both for hours so don't call me a hater but I just need a little help with this one.... John

Hi John -

It's Made in USA.

Cheers -

Rob
(also assuming it's the Veritas pocket square. One of the most difficult products to make that we have.)

[Roy Lindberry]

I've been watching this person since his videos started appearing. His methods seem pretty straight forward, so I've tried a few and they have worked well for me. No, I'm not getting quite the same results in quality, but they are certainly satsifactory. He seems to use a modest set of tools and some old methods of work.

My opinion is that he adding to the craft and like Chris Schwarz, think we are better off having him provide his unique (well, at least to some of us) way of woodworking. Anyway - that's my opinion and am curious as to others thoughts.

Yes, I've benefited greatly from Paul's teaching online and DVDs. I love his sharpening technique (though I am still using oilstones, the technique works well), I've done very well with his mortise chopping technique as well. I think the knife wall method, while accurate and reliable, is a bit over the top for me personally, but his focus on accuracy is appreciated.

I haven't gotten his cheap router plane idea to work well yet, though I am going to try again in the next couple of weeks. All in all, I really appreciate Paul's work and teaching.

[Hilton Ralphs]

I also love his approach but I have to admit that I don't quite relish the thought of thicknessing a board by hand or ripping with a panel saw. I have a lunchbox planer and table saw for that. Jointing on the other hand appeals to me. I've recently bought a Veritas BU Jointer, LA Smoother and LA Block Plane to go with my old Stanley #6 and #5.

I'm also in two minds about the bench as it's very different to the 21st Century one that I was/am about to build. Still not sure about two aspects;

1. The deep apron - making clamping difficult.
2. The vise not flush with the front edge.

Anyone built his bench?

[Don Dorn]

Never had the pleasure of meeting him / taking a class but would love too. I've been following him for over a year now and have adopted several of his methods including sharpening - it works incredibly well, my blades are very sharp and I'm convinced the convex method helps retain the edge because it gives it more beef at the business end.

He also saved me a great deal of money - I went to the recent "Handworks" show in Amana and didn't spend any more than the cost of a book. There were wonderful tools and suppliers there, but he has convinced me that I don't need more tools - I need to use the ones I have.

[Hilton Ralphs]

he has convinced me that I don't need more tools - I need to use the ones I have.

I wish I could follow that philosophy.

[lowell holmes]

I have the 6" square. It's worth the price. I use it every day.

Of course, I think the 12" Starrett combination square is worth the price also.

[David Weaver]

i don't have the US made square mentioned, but as it's precisely square and has precise measuring on it on both sides, it's kind of a nifty combination.

[Chris Griggs]

I'm also in two minds about the bench as it's very different to the 21st Century one that I was/am about to build. Still not sure about two aspects;

1. The deep apron - making clamping difficult.
2. The vise not flush with the front edge.

Anyone built his bench?

I don't have his exact bench but mine is that "English style" with the big apron. Yes the big apron can make clamping difficult, but if you use holdfasts that's a much smaller issue.

I would definitely advocate putting in a vise that is flush with the front...not doing so defeats the purpose of the big apron which gives you away to support the end of work not clamped in the vise w/ pegs or holdfast. Mine has a leg vise, but you could just as readily install a twin screw vise or QR vise hardware and allow the apron to serve as the back jaw.

[Christopher Charles]

He also saved me a great deal of money - I went to the recent "Handworks" show in Amana and didn't spend any more than the cost of a book. There were wonderful tools and suppliers there, but he has convinced me that I don't need more tools - I need to use the ones I have.[/QUOTE]


I think this is perhaps Mr. Seller's best contribution--providing a counterpoint to the boutique handtool movement since many new comers likely conclude that it takes thousands of dollars to build up even a basic collection of tools. Note, that I'm all in favor of the boutique hand tool movement, but recognize it's excesses.

Cheers,
C

[David Weaver]

I think it's been pretty well documented on these forums that the excesses of the boutique industry are pretty separate from actually making quality work. The same issue goes on above in the power tool sections, though a lot of us down here have managed to avoid the very expensive power tools because flexibility is only as far away as our own two hands and the ability to mark it.

Not trying to pick on your post, but it does seem fairly often that someone comes along, hangs out their shingle and toots some information from their wagon and it's seen as new information.

One of the earliest things I can remember from woodnet is seeing warren mickley mention that he had made is own fore or trying plane. And then he won one of the planing contests at WIA with a standard bailey plane.

The more relevant question for a lot of us is if we can afford the more expensive tools, does that somehow cheapen the work? This stuff goes around in circles, from accusations that you have to go one way or the other. Some of us personally go around in circles with it, I don't think it really cheapens anyones' work, though, despite the suggestions that it does from some people from time to time.

There is one thing that I can't figure out how to do cheaply, and that's when I come up with a carved element, even when it's something as simple as the details on a plane, I have no clue how to get inexpensive carving tools. I wish I knew, but I don't think there is an answer to coming up with a need and then finding cheap carving tools. There may be a case for getting a few carving tools and designing work around them, but specific needs always seem to make specific demands on them.

Well, and based on the above comments, I guess it depends on whether you get information from the forums, or from magazines, magazine related blogs and videos. Not all magazine related blogs or instructionals push tools, but a LOT of them do, including misleading blogging in the past suggesting that it's extremely hard to make vintage tools serviceable. And the introductions and promos that you'll get in your email will show you a few tools here or there and describe how they'll let you do a new function. One that you can probably already do.

But, anyway, if someone could solve the carving tool cost thing, I'd be ecstatic. It's been enough so far to keep me away from carving anything other than small bits on tools.

Oh..and finding good lumber inexpensively around here lately has been a problem, too, but good lumber grows all around us, so that's probably temporary. I wish I would've spent half the time I spent dreaming about tools locating the local custom sawmillers instead.

[Charlie Stanford]

Christopher, yours is a good and sensible post. Except for perhaps David's lone example of carving tools there are several iterations and levels of woodworking hand tools less expensive but essentially as serviceable as boutique offerings.

The best carver I have ever seen carving with my own two eyes worked with a total of fourteen tools which he said would cost about $700 if bought new. I carve, occasionally and not nearly as competently, with a vintage set of 12 Marples tools that cost me about $200. I found them, they fit my budget, had a recognizable name, and I bought them. I didn't spend six months or more hashing and researching the decline in steel quality of English brands from the postwar period 1946 - 1951, if you get my drift. They do require frequent touch ups, which is good. I require frequent breaks. I could produce uglier work even faster with tools that never dulled. They save me from myself. And they aren't all that bad in the grand scheme of things.

[Jack Curtis]

I've spent way too much on good carving tools, like the set of Addis cranked spoon gouges. Only thing in my favor is I got them fairly cheaply when ebay was newish. Also, Dastra are great, also pretty cheap on ebay. And the few Pfeil I have are very good.

But the best deal of all were the Chinese carvers from Dick, http://www.mehr-als-werkzeug.de/product/700970/Carving-Blades-18-Piece-Set.htm I haven't settled on what style handle I want for them, have just been sticking them in some old, small file handles for the moment. They don't care, they just keep cutting like maniacs.

[Jim Matthews]

I just came from a lengthy class, using this bench.

It's very solid, but I found myself wishing for some way to plane things on top rather than in the vise.
That, and the height of the bench (set for users considerably taller than myself) set the vise handle at just the right angle to
whack me on the knee every time I turned it loose.

I suppose there's no reason to have a bench that has more features; unless you like convenience, ease of use or comfort.

[Hilton Ralphs]

I would definitely advocate putting in a vise that is flush with the front...not doing so defeats the purpose of the big apron which gives you away to support the end of work not clamped in the vise w/ pegs or holdfast.

Thanks Chris. Apparently Paul says the deep apron is what makes the bench so taut and less inclined to rack. Interesting that he makes the bench out of pleb wood (pine) which is considerably cheaper here in South Africa. For example, two 12inch wide sections of 3inch thick x 9inch in length maple sections for the top will cost me the equivalent of $500.



It's very solid, but I found myself wishing for some way to plane things on top rather than in the vise.


I think those planing stops that Chris Schwarz uses could solve your problem. Veritas makes two lengths of adjustable planing stops. I bought the shorter version.

[Jim Matthews]

I use planing stops in my bench. There are lots of 3/4" holes in the top.

No holes in the traditional bench used at Mr. Seller's school.
Just the vise for holding things. Less to go wrong, I suppose.

[David Weaver]

I suppose there's no reason to have a bench that has more features; unless you like convenience, ease of use or comfort.

This was worth a chuckle. :)

[Metod Alif]

Davis,
As per your earlier post: There are two kinds of presenters, one promoting competence, the other hawking gadgetry. 'Luckily' there are two kinds of audience as well...
best wishes,
Metod

[Jim Koepke]

My bench has a small apron all around.

A couple of clamps and some scrap wood make a fine planing stop at one end. When using this it is very easy to understand why one lifts a plane on the back stroke. The biggest problem is to hold wood that has a bow. When pressing down on one end the other end may go above the planing stop.

There are also a lot of 3/4" holes in line with the holes on the tail vise. This serves to hold pieces similar to the way a wagon vise does.

Though an apron is helpful in my way of working, there can be too much of a good thing.

jtk