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Mike Henderson
01-31-2012, 8:34 PM
I'm almost finished with a tankless water heater project. I'm doing it with a contractor - he's doing the things I can't or won't do and I'm doing the rest. For example, he did all the plumbing since there's both gas and water plumbing to get done. If I did that portion, we'd be out of water for a week because it'd take me that long:)

The unit is mounted on the outside wall, in the area of my air conditioning condenser and garbage can storage, so it's already a fairly "industrial" area - so I didn't mind the exposed unit and pipes. I had them mount it high enough so that no one would get a face full of exhaust. If I had mounted it lower, I can imagine someone peering into the exhaust saying, "I wonder what this is," just when the unit kicked on.

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One of the major reasons we did this project was to reclaim the space taken by the old tank style water heater. The tank was in a closet accessed from the outside of the house, and it took the corner of our laundry room.

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So after the tank was taken out, I took on the task of converting the water heater closet to a storage closet accessible from inside (the contractor closed off the old exterior door with stucco to match the rest of the house). I cut a hole for a 24" door and hung the door. Then, I ran electricity for a light in the closet and then hung drywall. Mudded the drywall and installed door molding. Finally, I prepared the floor and laid tile to match the rest of the floor. Still have to paint and put in base molding.

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This last picture is two pictures stitched together to show the inside of the closet - I couldn't back up enough to get it all in one shot.

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After I finish this portion, my wife wants me to make some shelves so there's still a lot more to do. It's just amazing how many "steps" there are in a project like this.

So - what do I think of the tankless water heater? It works well. No matter whether you're just running a small amount of water for shaving, or running the washer while taking a shower, it gives consistent hot water. Previously, if I took a shower and then my wife put laundry in, there would be no hot water for her shower - or it would be lukewarm.

Tankless water heaters are not that expensive compared to a large tank heater, but retrofitting a tank system to a tankless is expensive because of the plumbing and electrical that has to be done (tankless water heaters require 120V for control circuitry).

But overall, I'm glad we did it. It improved our hot water situation and we were able to get a storage closet where we needed one.

Mike

Phil Thien
01-31-2012, 8:54 PM
Pretty awesome you can put it outside and not have to worry about any venting. Some of those venting kits run $200 all by themselves.

The install looks terrific, can't wait to see finished pictures w/ the shelves, etc.

Bill Cunningham
01-31-2012, 10:07 PM
I had one installed 3 years ago. The best decision I've made as far as water heating it concerned. |Mine runs on Nat.Gas, and burns about 14 cents worth a day. A FAR cry from the oil fired waterheater it replaced. The oil heater was fast, but cost about 1200.00 a year in oil. Now were at about $52.00 a year in natgas.. We are also on a lake based water system, so the water is extremly soft and we have never had to descale it, which can be a big problem for these heaters in hard water areas..

Greg Peterson
01-31-2012, 10:15 PM
Tankless is an upgrade to the old tank style system. You do gain a surprising amount of space. The retro fit/install can be expensive, but I think by the time you are looking at a replacement unit (20 years or so) the RIO really starts kicking in.

I have no regrets going tankless. Probably one of my better moves as a home owner.

Mike Cutler
02-01-2012, 8:47 AM
Nice work Mike!
That's going to be a nice closet/pantry space.

I really want to go tankless. Unfortunately my only option is to use propane, which in Ct., is like putting a loaded gun to your wallet. There's would never been any savings realized for me using propane.
I'm envious.

Jeff Monson
02-01-2012, 9:18 AM
Very clean install Mike. Its good to hear the performance of the tankless heater meets you expectations. It is amazing how much space you saved.

Art Mulder
02-01-2012, 10:55 AM
so this is installed on the outside of your house... is it not secured in any way?

Ron Jones near Indy
02-01-2012, 12:27 PM
I believe Mike said the outside access has been sealed and covered with stucco. The tankless system is accessed from inside as is the new closet.

Mike Henderson
02-01-2012, 12:29 PM
so this is installed on the outside of your house... is it not secured in any way?

It's attached to the side of the house with lag bolts, but it's also behind two fences - a fence at the front of my property and a fence that blocks the side of the house from the front yard. I suppose it might be possible for someone to come in and steal it but if they're going to come that far, they're probably after more valuable things than a hot water heater.

Also, Villa Park (CA) is very low crime area.

Mike

Mike Henderson
02-01-2012, 12:39 PM
I believe Mike said the outside access has been sealed and covered with stucco. The tankless system is accessed from inside as is the new closet.
No, the old hot water closet was closed off but the new tankless heater is mounted on the outside wall of the house. The old closet was closed off so that I can use it as an interior closet. But the exterior door on the hot water closet did not have a lock on it so anyone could have stolen the old tank style water heater, if they wanted to.

On all these things, you balance the risk to the amount of security you install. I really have no worries about anyone stealing the new heater, or tampering with it.

Mike

Jeff Monson
02-01-2012, 2:15 PM
the new tankless heater is mounted on the outside wall of the house

I need to move to california :( that thing would be frozen for 6 months out of the year here.

Mike Henderson
02-01-2012, 3:28 PM
I need to move to california :( that thing would be frozen for 6 months out of the year here.
I hear you. Here in southern CA we almost never get freezing temps, and certainly not enough to freeze pipes. Avocados are a big crop in SoCal and they can't tolerate freezing temps. In fact, our house was built in an old avocado orchard - I have 13 avocado trees in the yard - 8 Fuerte and 5 Hass. The Fuertes produce early (January) and the Hass produce later in the spring. Between the two, I prefer the Fuerte.

Mike

Jim Becker
02-02-2012, 9:07 PM
Congrats on the project, Mike. Looks great!

I'm a tankless fan and have two of them in this house now. We put one in when we added the 2200 sq ft addition in 2008 and I put another in this past fall to replace the infrastructure damaged by the hurricane when our basement in the 250 year old portion of our home was flooded. I wanted to do it earlier, but needed a unit that could be vented with PVC...which is now available.

Mike Henderson
02-08-2012, 11:48 PM
I finally finished the closet. I got the closet painted, applied base molding, and installed some shelves and a few pieces of hanger hardware. Glad it's finished.

The attached picture is two pictures stitched together. I couldn't back up far enough to get it all in one picture.

Mike

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Art Mulder
02-09-2012, 7:40 AM
Looks like you need a step stool to reach your step stool... :D
That's some nice roomy space, Mike!

Andrew Pitonyak
02-09-2012, 3:45 PM
Looks good. I almost went tankless, but I lose power often where I live, and it is nice to have hot water even if I do not have power.

Mike Henderson
03-22-2012, 2:55 PM
Just an update after living with a tankless water heater for a couple of months - I really like it! I don't take really long showers but it's nice to not have to worry that I'm using all the hot water and there won't be enough for my wife's shower or for the load of clothes we want to do.

But it's hard to recommend to everyone to convert. The conversion cost (from a tank) is high because of the plumbing and electrical work that has to be done. But if you're doing a new installation, I'd definitely recommend a tankless.

But note Andrew's comment above - if you're in a place where you lose power frequently, you might not want a tankless because they require line power to operate.

Mike

Larry Whitlow
03-22-2012, 7:14 PM
Mike, I had no idea these could be mounted outside. Similar to your situation, I would like to reclaim the inside space where the old water heater is located. I hope you won't mind a couple of questions. Is this particular make/model intended for outside use, or is that common to all? I note what looks like a filter on what I presume is a water line. Is that typical of these installations?

Thanks.

Larry

Bill Cunningham
03-22-2012, 10:13 PM
Nice work Mike!
That's going to be a nice closet/pantry space.

I really want to go tankless. Unfortunately my only option is to use propane, which in Ct., is like putting a loaded gun to your wallet. There's would never been any savings realized for me using propane.
I'm envious.

Propane (propain:D) is expensive, but remember, it's only going to be burning when your drawing water through it. Electrically, the propane/Natgas units only draw about 3 amps, and could easly be run on a 400 watt converter and 12 volt battery during a blackout. Mine uses 1/2 a meter of natgas a day I'm not sure how that converts to propane, but it won't be a lot, and bound to be cheaper than electric, and I KNOW it's cheaper than oil.

Mike Henderson
03-22-2012, 10:17 PM
Mike, I had no idea these could be mounted outside. Similar to your situation, I would like to reclaim the inside space where the old water heater is located. I hope you won't mind a couple of questions. Is this particular make/model intended for outside use, or is that common to all? I note what looks like a filter on what I presume is a water line. Is that typical of these installations?

Thanks.

Larry
This is a Rheem and it was designed to be surface mounted outdoors. Others are designed for indoor mounting and have a different venting arrangement. Regarding the filter, I went with the recommendation of my plumber, and I assume he went with the recommendation of the manufacturer.

Also, note that the manufacturer recommends flushing the unit once a year with vinegar to remove scale.

And regarding Bill's post, I have noticed a drop in my natural gas bill.

Mike

Greg Peterson
03-22-2012, 10:31 PM
Also, note that the manufacturer recommends flushing the unit once a year with vinegar to remove scale.



The isolation valves make this really easy and convenient. You do need a sump pump to circulate the vinegar. I run the flush for about forty five minutes.

Larry Whitlow
03-22-2012, 10:53 PM
This is a Rheem and it was designed to be surface mounted outdoors. Others are designed for indoor mounting and have a different venting arrangement. Regarding the filter, I went with the recommendation of my plumber, and I assume he went with the recommendation of the manufacturer.

Also, note that the manufacturer recommends flushing the unit once a year with vinegar to remove scale.

And regarding Bill's post, I have noticed a drop in my natural gas bill.

Mike


Thanks -- appreciate the info. This sounds like a real good idea for my situation.

Mike Henderson
03-22-2012, 11:22 PM
Thanks -- appreciate the info. This sounds like a real good idea for my situation.
Let me make one more comment/suggestion. In addition to a light in the closet, I put in an outlet. Lots of people have rechargeable sweepers and it's nice to keep all that in the closet. Otherwise, you have to plug in outside the closet and run a wire under the door.

Mike