15 inch planer question

[Russ Ambrose]

am finally able to upgrade from my Ridgid lunchbox planer. in terms of how much time i spend in my shop/use my equipment, i am more than a hobbyist but not a pro. i spend a LOT of time woodworking and just as with my soon-to-be table saw upgrade, i intend my next planer purchase to be my last planer purchase. however, while i have saved long and hard for these purchases, money is not unlimited. seems to me that a 15 inch planer with a helical cutterhead will be everything i need and then some. my reasoning for wanting a helical cutterhead is twofold: (1) a little higher quality cut, and (2) not having to repeatedly purchase straight knives. the reason for targeting a 15 inch model is easy, i can't afford (and cannot imagine i need) anything bigger.

at this point, i've sorta narrowed it down to two models: (1) Jet JWP-15HH and (2) Powermatic 15HH. i know the Grizzly 15 in. helical head planer is well regarded by many and i don't mean to insult Grizzly or the many people who love their equipment. my one experience, however, with Grizzly products was so-so and, therefore, i'm not really giving them much (if any) consideration. this is also based on my understanding (per Fine WoodWorking) that the cutterhead on the PM and Jet is a tad better (straight vs shear cut). i've read a lot of info/reviews/observations about the mustard machine here and elsewhere. the sense i get is that it's a really good machine, but it doesn't walk on water or cure the common cold. as for the Jet, i am unable (aside from a single review on Amazon) to find ANY info. has Jet been selling this particular model for long? are people just not buying it? i've no experience with Jet equipment (or Powermatic for that matter) so i don't really have a sense of the general quality of their machines and whether such is trending up or down lately.

when i look at both machines, they look identical. they're probably even manufactured in the same facility, but that doesn't necessary mean that they are made with the same components or to the same specs. so, i'm not willing to simply assume that they are the same machine with different color paint. as for price, the difference (from where i'd be buying) is the mustard machine is $255 more. i don't want to spend an extra $255 for mustard paint, but at the same time i'm ok spending an extra $255 in this instance if there is a real difference between the two. i realize that either machine (or pretty much anything else) will be a galactic upgrade from the orange lunchbox, but i want to get the best 15 in planer i can.

any thoughts, advice, input, observations, alternative suggestions, etc. are greatly appreciated. many thanks.

[Andrew Hughes]

Hi Russ,I have a powermatic 15hh,its a okay machine.The best thing about the machine is the cutter head tearout is not a issue.The thing i dont like about my planer are the bed rollers.The machine snipes my small dewalt didnt so i dont caree for the bed rollers.One can spend alot of time adjusting the machine i have and its alittle better i just dont like losing 3 inches on both sides.Taking lite passes are sometimes hit or miss the feed rollers leave tracks.If you are in calif,You are welcome to come by and try my machine.

[Van Huskey]

The PM has cast iron extensions and the Jet does not unless they changed it VERY recently. Worth the extra in my book.

To be honest I am a PM fan but the reality is you get a longer warranty (5 yrs vs 1) and a US made Byrd head instead of a straight cut Asian head over the Grizzly. In all honesty the PM isn't worth the greater than $1100 premium. Again I love PM stuff but this is one machine I would not spend the extra money on.

[gregory young]

I am also in the same position...was leaning towards the powermatic with the Byrd head, but was taken back by the notable lines left by the cutter..

[David Kumm]

Don't forget used. Delta Rockwell RC33, PM 100, General 14" are all a step up in quality, the General a huge step, and can be bought and a Byrd head installed for less than an average new machine. An old PM 160 or 180 can be had for similar money and are light industrial- maybe more than light- machines. Dave

[joe milana]

Hey, there's a "used but barely used" 15" straight knife General on ebay for $850. Basically the same planer as the PM, 'cept it's green. Perhaps it's something you could use for a while , then upgrade to a byrd head in the future. Might be worth a look.

[Stephen Cherry]

If you are considering dropping several thousand on a planer, I would consider something like this:
http://chicago.craigslist.org/wcl/tls/2811717482.html

It gives a tremendous amount of tersa headed bang for the buck.

[Van Huskey]

I am also in the same position...was leaning towards the powermatic with the Byrd head, but was taken back by the notable lines left by the cutter..


That cutterhead needs the bits removed and the gunk cleaned out from under them and retorqued.

[keith micinski]

So far with my Grizzly I have Been underwhelmed by the spiral head. The lines are so close to not being there they don't bother me but the cut quality isn't even close to my dw735. That goes for figured wood also. It doesn't tear out the grain per say but it comes close to it and leaves a really bad finish in those areas where the grain switches back. Running it at 16 feet instead of 30 really helped for the finish pass.

[Kent A Bathurst]

The thing i dont like about my planer are the bed rollers.The machine snipes my small dewalt didnt so i dont caree for the bed rollers.

Veering OT for a second....

Andrew - FWIW: I have the Delta DC-380 15". 12 years old. Works great. It also has the bed rollers. About 10 years ago, I put paid to the snipe once and for all this way: I got a straightedge - mine is the Starrett 48" [I also wanted it for the jointer and some other tasks] - and the One-Way Multi Gauge.

I carefully - painstakingly might be a better word - adjusted the rollers, constantly checking the ends - until I was at one one-thousandth elevation everywhere. Then, added an ever-so-slight up-hill incline to the outfeed extension table. No more snipe. Ever.

Turns out that, after we moved, I didn't get around to reinstalling the extension tables. As the trailing end of the board disappears into the planer, I add a slight upward pressure on the board as it exits - mimics the incline in the outfeed table. Works perfect. Sold the extension tables.

[Russ Ambrose]

The PM has cast iron extensions and the Jet does not unless they changed it VERY recently. Worth the extra in my book.

To be honest I am a PM fan but the reality is you get a longer warranty (5 yrs vs 1) and a US made Byrd head instead of a straight cut Asian head over the Grizzly. In all honesty the PM isn't worth the greater than $1100 premium. Again I love PM stuff but this is one machine I would not spend the extra money on.

Van, thanks for the input. the Jet does have cast iron extensions like the PM, perhaps a recent change. aside from the slightly different shape of the base, the Jet and the PM LOOK identical. i'm not sure i agree with your other comment, however. the Griz has only a one year warranty (a HUGE minus in my book) whereas the PM has a five year warranty. plus, the PM has a US made head that appears to be better than the non-US head on the Griz. assuming all other things are equal (i realize they may not be, but...) those two things are worth a premium to me. i'm getting the PM at 15 percent off plus the woodcraft guy here will put the machine in my shop at no cost so i don't have to move it myself (which i can't do) or pay extra for "special" delivery which puts the price difference between the Griz and PM at $700.

perhaps the choice for me is not between competing helical head planers, but between a helical head planer and a straight knife planer. the latter would certainly save me a lot of money. but every time i feel good about how much i'd save with a straight knife planer, i remember how quickly that initial savings would be eaten up by the having to repeatedly purchase new knives....

[Salem Ganzhorn]

I like PM machines but I would not spend extra for their 15" planer. I don't think it is any better built or has any real innovation over all the other clones of Delta's original 4 poster. That doesnt mean it is a bad planer, on the contrary I like my woodtek clone.

Also used planers are a great value. They don't hold their value on the used market. Good luck!
Salem

[david brum]

perhaps the choice for me is not between competing helical head planers, but between a helical head planer and a straight knife planer. the latter would certainly save me a lot of money. but every time i feel good about how much i'd save with a straight knife planer, i remember how quickly that initial savings would be eaten up by the having to repeatedly purchase new knives....

That is my argument in favor of helical cutter heads. It's true that a fresh, sharp set of straight blades leave a better finish, but that finish quickly degrades as the blades dull. Then you have to go through the incredibly tedious job of installing fresh blades. Aside from the cost of replacement and sharpening, I suspect that the time spent sanding the tiny imperfections from the helical heads is less than the time spent replacing standard straight knives. I mean, you're sanding anyway. I'm pretty mechanically inclined, but I found that replacing planer blades was always an exercise in frustration. Maybe it's just me, but I always let the blades get really dull before replacement because I dreaded the job so much on my 15" planer.

[Carl Beckett]

I have a Jet 15" with straight knives.

It has been a workhorse for me - no complaints whatsoever.

Smooth cuts.

The one thing I notice (and this is a safety issue I believe), is that there is a small guard that prevents taking deeper than a certain depth of cut. When running a rough cut board (like tapered lumber off a home done sawmill), or something with twist or warped, etc - I would like being able to do a deeper cut. Not only just taking off more material in a pass, but taking off more material at a particular high spot that I might not notice when first starting the feed.

There were some 20" planers available recently with quite good pricing. But they were beasts (very large floor space), and I passed on them preferring the smaller, roll around footprint of this 15".

If you are anywhere near MA you are welcome to come try in person.

[George Panagopoulos]

I was doing the same search recently but with 20" planers. I narrowed it down to the Jet 208HH and PM209HH. I went with the Jet because it was made in Taiwan vs. China on the Grizzly 20" models and was not that much of a premium vs. Grizzly. It too has the cast iron extension beds. I also went with the Jet/PM as they all use byrd insert cutters (all of the replacement model numbers are the same whether it is a PM helical head or Byrd). This was important to me as I had a PM jointer that used the same insert cutters and the added convenience of having one item for jointer and planer was a small plus for me. I have not noticed any snipe and have been happy with the quality of cut.

[Kent A Bathurst]

The one thing I notice (and this is a safety issue I believe), is that there is a small guard that prevents taking deeper than a certain depth of cut.

I will hazard a guess that this small guard - a metal bracket - is a few inches wide, in the center of the infeed.

It's not a safety issue - it is there to limit the depth-of-cut on boards wider than 6" [or, whatever - my Delta is set at 6"]. Machine overload issue.

[Van Huskey]

Van, thanks for the input. the Jet does have cast iron extensions like the PM, perhaps a recent change. aside from the slightly different shape of the base, the Jet and the PM LOOK identical. i'm not sure i agree with your other comment, however. the Griz has only a one year warranty (a HUGE minus in my book) whereas the PM has a five year warranty. plus, the PM has a US made head that appears to be better than the non-US head on the Griz. assuming all other things are equal (i realize they may not be, but...) those two things are worth a premium to me. i'm getting the PM at 15 percent off plus the woodcraft guy here will put the machine in my shop at no cost so i don't have to move it myself (which i can't do) or pay extra for "special" delivery which puts the price difference between the Griz and PM at $700.

perhaps the choice for me is not between competing helical head planers, but between a helical head planer and a straight knife planer. the latter would certainly save me a lot of money. but every time i feel good about how much i'd save with a straight knife planer, i remember how quickly that initial savings would be eaten up by the having to repeatedly purchase new knives....

With the price being closer I would probably go with the PM as well.

I thought some more and came up with what may be a more complete list of positive for the PM over the Grizzly:

1. 4 extra warranty years
2. a significant amont of the purchase price is for US made parts
3. FWW at least thinks the cut is better on the Byrd than the Grizzly head
4. the Byrd inserts are cheaper than the Grizzly inserts (for that planer they are 5.30 each vs 3.00 each
5. the extensions are a LITTLE longer if both sites spec sheets are accurate
6. some people prefer the Jet/PM dust chute that angles to the side

This with getting the PM on sale may well make it a better value for a lot of people.

[Andrew Hughes]

Hi kent,I'll give it a try.If i remember correctly the beds are not flat enough esp in the middle between the rollers.So i used a 12 straight edge to set things up.I just dont think i can get those numbers on my machine.Its time for a cleaning and some tlc so tomorrow i go over it again.Thanks for the hope. Andrew