It's baby crib makin' time and I need some knowledge!!!!!

[james glenn]

Well, it's official. The LOML and I are expecting our first child towards the end of June and I am getting more excited by the day. As many others have here, I am thinking of
building our convertible crib that will hopefully become an heirloom one day. But with the ever changing regulations, one never knows.

I haven't settled on a design quite yet, but being an architect I have a flare for the modern styles. However mixing in concrete would not be wise (obviously) or allowed by LOML;
so any direction to plans of modern design would be greatly valued.

I have done some research, but do value the knowledge of the forum and experienced input is priceless. So with that said, here goes:


A few questions/design challenges (choices) to make and am looking for some insight from the brain trust that is the 'Creekers':

1. Since this crib will be convertible (crib/toddler/full size bed), what type of attachment would you recommend?
I was thinking that furniture bolts would be the best idea for ease of transformation, but have never used them so would need some recommendations as to what type.

2. How have those of you who built these previously dealt with the mattress support?
I was thinking a frame with slats but not sure how to mount this so it can be converted to a toddler bed in the future.
Also, should the slats have a little spring to them to provide support? (Think European Bed) or is a stiff wood frame sufficient. I haven't slept on a baby matress in
quite some time, so not sure what is comfortable. I have looked at some in stores and they have springs hooked to a metal frame so there is some 'bounce'.

3. Wood choice:
We would like something dark, so I am thinking walnut since I should be able to get this locally and still have a wood look, but please educate me on other 'darker' woods.
If the LOML wants something even darker, then it would have to be dyed or 'painted' and I would like some recommendations as to what I could use.
Something strong right, but easily takes the dye or 'paint' finish. (Not sure if poplar would be sufficient at that point) But I am pushing for walnut.

4. Any other helpful tips, experiences, recommendations?

Again, I appreciate everything you guys and ladies can tell me.

Jimmy
:D:confused::D:confused::eek:

[Ryan Hellmer]

I have built (well, am building the second one) 2 of these in the past two years. I used the plans from wood magazine with minor modifications to accomodate solid wood (no plywood) and real m/t joinery.

(1) furniture bolts with cross nuts is the way to go. Not the most subtle look, but solid and effective.
(2) I made a sort of torsion box for support, although I would think that frame and slats would work. I'm not sure that a spring frame is necessary. Box springs don't really have any spring to them and from everything I read, firm is better.
(3) walnut is awesome, my first was a stained oak, current one is oiled walnut. This stikes me as a decidedly non-modern choice of wood though. I had a friend draw up plans that used maple/birch plywood and galvanized conduit... I don't think he ever built it, but it had that modern industrial-chic chipotle look to it. The standard woods are all pretty accessible, oak, maple, walnut, cherry. If you wanted something a little different, hickory, elm. Walnut and cherry are the only woods that I would call "darker" but most take stain (especially oak) fairly readily. I am a big fan of dye or hybrid stains. General finishes oil based is good stuff and makes minwax look like smeared poo in comparison. I've never painted.
(4) even if you desing yourself, go off the dimensions of the wood mag plan. They are great and the article demonstrated how they complied with federal safety regs (I double checked). Plus the plans also have a companion dresser/changing table to go with it.

Congratulations! This is a very exciting time and you will want to hustle and get it done because you won't have much time to woodwork after the bundle arrives. Kids are the best.

Ryan

[james glenn]

Ryan

Thanks for the info.

I know I want modern (really modern), I don't think it would be safe or at least infant friendly. I was thinking maybe either some cables or aluminum pipes for spidles and concrete corner post legs.
But the wife would not approve, and definitely not be happy with me.

THen I thought of using something like glue-lam beams to give a sort of industrial edge look, but the glues in that can't be totaly safe. (Or, I don't want to chance it)

So walnut it might be choice I can do something with, but I do like the idea of hickory to at least compare.

THanks again

[Neil Brooks]

Huge congrats !

Friends are expecting, too, and asked me to do a crib.

I haven't even decided, yet, but ... do you KNOW for sure that any CPSC regulations would affect something we build in our shops, or ... since we aren't selling them ... can't we just build them the best way we know how, and not be subject to that particular worry ?

Serious question. I don't know the answer, but wouldn't assume that "personal use" (or, i my case, potential gift) items are subject to the same regulations -- just ... build it like you know you have to.

[Rod Sheridan]

James, congratulations.

Starting with a good set of plans and following the applicable regulations is the best way to produce furniture for children.

The safety guidelines such as spacing, finishing methods, mattresses etc are determined after a lot of research, and investigation into accidental deaths.

Re-inventing the wheel may not seem like such a great idea after an accident happens..................Regards, Rod.

[Todd Hoppe]

Huge congrats !

I haven't even decided, yet, but ... do you KNOW for sure that any CPSC regulations would affect something we build in our shops, or ... since we aren't selling them ... can't we just build them the best way we know how, and not be subject to that particular worry ?


This is probably the one area where I would suggest following the regulations to a T, and then do as much as you can to exceed them. Selling the crib or not, there could not be anything worse than a child's injury or death because any of us just gave something the best effort "we know how." I built a crib, and the regulations are not very difficult to find or to follow.

Based upon my build, the best advice I can give is regardless of your design, make the maximum height of the rail relative to the mattress as large as possible. I had a design that was posted on the design forum, which I changed after starting construction to add another 3" or so to the height of the front rail. It made it much harder for my daughter to escape, and in my opinion, a lot safer for her. It doesn't hurt to make the spindles closer together too.

[Tom Hammond]

Wow... they still have cribs? My daughter has four kids... no crib.

[james glenn]

This is probably the one area where I would suggest following the regulations to a T, and then do as much as you can to exceed them. Selling the crib or not, there could not be anything worse than a child's injury or death because any of us just gave something the best effort "we know how." I built a crib, and the regulations are not very difficult to find or to follow.

Based upon my build, the best advice I can give is regardless of your design, make the maximum height of the rail relative to the mattress as large as possible. I had a design that was posted on the design forum, which I changed after starting construction to add another 3" or so to the height of the front rail. It made it much harder for my daughter to escape, and in my opinion, a lot safer for her. It doesn't hurt to make the spindles closer together too.

I've been looking at federal regulations and measuring cribs at stores already. I actually thought they would be a little beefier than most are, so I am sure the strength of mine won't be a concern.

How high did you go with your railing?
Also, what hardware did you use for the matress frame (bed frame) that would allow you to convert it to a toddler bed later on? Or is it a matter of simply lowering the frame and matress and
and reattaching it?

Thanks
Jimmy

[Neil Brooks]

Well ...

Along those lines, this (http://www.cpsc.gov/info/cribs/index.html) seems like as good a starting point as any.

[Neil Brooks]

By the way....

I certainly didn't mean to imply that we should ignore safety regulations.

I actually meant -- particularly as I look at a PDF file (http://www.cpsc.gov/nsn/cribrules.pdf) with clear direction, TO manufacturers, about how to build a safer crib -- that my nature would have been to over-engineer the thing, anyway -- doubtless in excess of what the average commercially-available crib achieves.

Without getting political ... most manufacturers are looking to reduce costs. As we WW's all know ... for projects that we build for ourselves and as gifts to others, that doesn't tend to be our first priority.

We tend to build it better than the big-box stores.

That ... is what I meant, here. Over-engineer it, as you might ordinarily do, and build it to a very high standard of construction and strength, with good materials.

That said, if I take this one on, I WILL read up on what I view as minimum regulatory standards, ... and then ... double 'em ;)

[james glenn]

By the way....

I certainly didn't mean to imply that we should ignore safety regulations.

I actually meant -- particularly as I look at a PDF file (http://www.cpsc.gov/nsn/cribrules.pdf) with clear direction, TO manufacturers, about how to build a safer crib -- that my nature would have been to over-engineer the thing, anyway -- doubtless in excess of what the average commercially-available crib achieves.

Without getting political ... most manufacturers are looking to reduce costs. As we WW's all know ... for projects that we build for ourselves and as gifts to others, that doesn't tend to be our first priority.

We tend to build it better than the big-box stores.

That ... is what I meant, here. Over-engineer it, as you might ordinarily do, and build it to a very high standard of construction and strength, with good materials.

That said, if I take this one on, I WILL read up on what I view as minimum regulatory standards, ... and then ... double 'em ;)


I understood what you meant in the first post.

We aren't manufacturers, we as woodworkers are craftsmen and builders. It's not about production for most of us, it's about pride, skill, satisfaction. etc...

Although this time for me it's all of that and a little bit of 'showing up the inlaws'..... haha

[Lee Schierer]

As others have suggested, follow the safety guidelines because they really do add safety to the project. I built a crib for my first granddaughter and it complied with the guidelines. One bit of advice is to buy the mattress before you cut your first piece of wood to insure that the mattress fits tight inside the crib structure. You can't compress a mattress and a loose fit is bad too. Here's the one that I built.219242

You're also going to want a dressing table/dresser. Here's two that I made. The changing table part on the top come off when the child no longer needs changing and it becomes a regular dresser. Note that the white top fits the cherry dresser as well. 219243219244

[Howard Acheson]

First thing I would recommend is go to the Consumer Products Safety Commission site and look up the mandated safety requirements for cribs. At the same time go to http://www.cpsc.gov/about/CPSIA/smbus/manufacturers.html. The second site outlines the requirements for safety for anything you build for use by a child 12 years old or younger.

[George Gyulatyan]

Hi James,

Don't have any advice to give as something like this is way over my head.

Just wanted to say Congratulations! And don't worry about gaining weight. You'll work it right off once the kid is born :D

As for the choice of wood... I don't think modern look is material dependent, but rather shape dependent, so ogee profiles and the like would be out. For shape ideas, do a Google image search for "modern cribs". I just did and I see some really cool creative ideas there.

Having said that, Wenge would be great, albeit expensive.

[james glenn]

Hi James,

Don't have any advice to give as something like this is way over my head.

Just wanted to say Congratulations! And don't worry about gaining weight. You'll work it right off once the kid is born :D

As for the choice of wood... I don't think modern look is material dependent, but rather shape dependent, so ogee profiles and the like would be out. For shape ideas, do a Google image search for "modern cribs". I just did and I see some really cool creative ideas there.

Having said that, Wenge would be great, albeit expensive.

Thanks George, I will be use google for some design ideas. There are some pretty neat ideas there.

[Todd Hoppe]

I've been looking at federal regulations and measuring cribs at stores already. I actually thought they would be a little beefier than most are, so I am sure the strength of mine won't be a concern.

How high did you go with your railing?
Also, what hardware did you use for the matress frame (bed frame) that would allow you to convert it to a toddler bed later on? Or is it a matter of simply lowering the frame and matress and
and reattaching it?

Thanks
Jimmy

Hi, sorry it took a couple of days to respond on this. Here is the thread that talks about the build: http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?123619-Crib-Project

It shows the hardware I made from aluminum flat stock to attach the mattress support to the frame. I made the top front rail about 3" taller than the in store measurement I found. This was based upon a design sold in several stores called the "Peyton crib." I believe that the Peyton crib can be found on Google 3d warehouse. I also made a plan, but caution that I actually varied from the plan a bit on the fly so it isn't totally accurate.

[Jim Falsetti]

James,

After looking around at several different designs, I made the Rockler 3-in-1 Transitional Crib Bed from cherry for our grandson. I followed their design, which required using patterns to make shaped slats (first time for me). Gluing up all the slats was another great learning experience. Now that the grandson is getting bigger, we are installing the day bed rail. Later on we will be adding the footboard and side rails.

It is a sturdy design, and as far as I know, meets the CPSC standards. The crib mattress support is adjustable and has worked fine.
The hardware package has all necessary fasteners, for the crib, day bed and youth bed.

This photo was prior to installation of the front gate. Let me know by PM if you would like more infomation.

219560

Best,
Jim

[Dan Schocke]

I may be the only one in this camp, but I would suggest building a crib that is just a crib, unless you plan on having only one child. They sleep in a crib for such a short time (typically less than 2 years) and then a toddler bed for an even shorter amount of time, I just don't think the conversion beds are practical. I think the conversion idea was created so furniture companies could talk people into spending a lot of $$$ on furniture for their baby (parents and grandparents are easy pickin's for that first baby or grand baby -- I know I spent money on all kinds of stuff that we really didn't need for the first child). Unless you have plenty of storage, it's somewhat painful to keep those extra crib rails or bed parts around when you're not using them. If you build a crib-only affair, you can cycle it through with the kids and you'll easily find someone else in the family or neighborhood that needs it when your kids are done with it and you no longer have to store it. Same thing with a toddler bed. The twin-size bed you'll keep for a lot longer. Just my opinion.

--Dan