Suggestions on pro setup

[Jesse Hughson]

Hi all,

I've been researching a bit trying to find pricing on Trotec, Epilog and Universal lasers, with very little luck. I make wood crafts and have been dreaming of adding engraving to my offerings, along with some cutting and perhaps rotary engraving down the road.
The trotec speedy 300 looks pretty good for production volume work, and it sounds like Epilog and Universal are worth looking into as well, although I'm open to other options if there are other companies that meet my needs. Quality cuts, production speed, reliable operation, room for upgrades (rotary tool, etc) and good tech support/replacement parts are key.
Additionally, I need to know what peripherals I will have to think about. Can I use a 100CFM bathroom fan for exhaust, or do I need something with several hundred CFMs of airflow? Is all the cooling stuff built into most machines now, or do I need to research and choose that stuff too? What software will I need to buy or choose from to set up jobs, is it included in the package?
Overall, what is a reasonable entry cost to expect?
I know there are probably a few dozen more details I will need to supply about what my needs are, but in the interest of keeping this opening post concise, I will stop here and await your responses.

btw - I am new in this forum, and look forward to meeting you all!

[Ross Moshinsky]

To get pricing you have to contact each company and they will get you in contact with a regional rep who will give you a price quote. I suggest you get pricing on replacement parts too. That all figures into things for the future.

The bathroom fan isn't sufficient. You should use a real exhaust fan.

Software is your choice. All of these machines run off of print drivers so you can use essentially any design software. Inkscape is free. Adobe Illustrator is good. CorelDraw is the industry standard.

Cost? Hard to say because size and power are the main determining factors. I assume for craft work you're going to want 40-50 watts so you can cut wood easily. I don't think going down to 30W is ideal. It's not great for cutting at all.

While you're looking at things, you might as well look into Chinese lasers. You can buy them from US distributors like Rabbitlaser or Full-Spectrum Engineering. Otherwise you can buy directly from China. Shenhui laser is the company most people on the board have been dealing with.

[Michael Hunter]

If you go for an American or European made laser (which is possibly a good idea for a first-time laserist), then try to get a "package deal" from the dealer.
Adding a rotary attachment afterwards can be pretty expensive, whereas getting it as part of he deal ought to bring the cost right down.
An air-assist pump (essential for cutting) may come as standard with some machines ; otherwise the dealer should be able to add one in or recommend a suitable supplier. Similarly with the exhaust fan.
Cooling of these lasers is built-in in all but the smallest machines. For the few that require cooling via the exhaust fan, there will be specific instructions on the type of fan to use (and again, try to get it as part of the deal).

Choosing between the machines can be difficult. Rather than just being "given a demo", try to present the sellers with a (simple) project so that you can watch how they go about it and time how long it takes to run on the machines.

There is a lot to learn when the laser is finally delivered, so you want to know that the "extras" are the right ones from the start - no niggling worries.

[Jesse Hughson]

Thanks Ross and Michael,

I understand that I am going to have a bit of dialogue with several sales reps before this whole thing is over. I would like to have some numbers in my head before talking to them, just to help me feel more prepared.
What setups do you guys have and what were your costs? Is there anyone out there who has recently acquired a machine that they could recommend to me?

It seems really odd to me that these companies (trotec, epilogue) are not up front about the price of their machines, and that I can't seem to find direct comparisons or a review forum that shares specifically the info I am asking about. Perhaps I am looking in the wrong place? Do you guys know of any resources like this?

[Michael Hunter]

The list prices are not a big secret. The actual selling prices are, because it all depends on how badly the salesman needs the sale (to meet his target, save his job etc.).
It often looks better on the books for the salesman to get nearer to the list price on the machine itself, but throw in accessories cheaply or free.

This forum is probably the best place to find out about the machines, but bear in mind that most people only have real experience on the one machine that they own.

Even if another make is "better", buying the same make again makes sense for an existing user as they avoid the learning curve of a new way of working - so only a very few of the regular posters here operate more than one make of machine.

The "big name" machines are all capable of producing high quality work, though each has its own stronger and weaker points. Very difficult to choose between them.
Most important is your attitude to the seller (and vice versa) as you ***will*** have problems (even if just finger trouble) so you need to have faith that your chosen supplier will hold your hand a bit at first and respond effectively later on as bits of the machine start to wear.

[Jesse Hughson]

Yep - I just sent out emails to Trotec and Epilog, and for Epilog the autorespond message contains a full price sheet! Hopefully I won't have to wait until after the holiday to hear something from Trotec. Anyone know where their list prices can be seen?

[Keith Outten]

I spent over ten hours yesterday engraving 20 ADA door signs with my old 35 watt Epilog. This job would have taken less than 4 hours with a 60 watt machine.

If you have any inclination to engrave projects that involve a lot of time you would be best served by a machine that has plenty of power and is designed to last. Otherwise you will be disappointed and probably lose money.

I recently ordered a Trotec Speedy 300 with an 80 watt power supply, it is scheduled to be delivered the third week of January. The Trotec will be my third laser engraver, I have learned my lesson.
.

[Mike Null]

Jesse

The prices are almost always negotiated. Make some phone calls as some don't take email inquiries seriously. (Oh yes, that's true)

[Jesse Hughson]

So I talked with Epilog and Trotec reps this morning and got my rough numbers on the trotecs and epilogs.
The Epilog rep is only located 45 minutes from me, and the Trotec guy is about 7 hours away. However, there is a Trotec client about 1.5 hours from me that could hold a demo.
The Epilog rep says that the Mini 24 is comparable to the Speedy 300. It's only about half the price, so I'm skeptical. I'll have to see for myself, I suppose!
I'll be putting together a sample job to test out on both of these machines in the next few weeks. I'll post more updates as this develops.

[Mike Null]

If your Epilog rep say the mini 24 is comparable to the Trotec Speedy 300 then a VW Beetle is comparable to a Mercedes.

Do your homework!

[Ross Moshinsky]

My biggest piece of advice is don't trust a rep from any of these companies. Their opinions are typically completely baseless. Very few of them have run these machines to make a living. They know their price points (maybe) and they know how to blow through a demo. Beyond that, you're going to need to talk to people who own the machines to make the best choice.

[Jesse Hughson]

Haha! Man, all those mercedes owners are gonna be ---- when they find that out!

:p