Timberwolf carbide blade

[Per Swenson]

In the intrest of maufacturing less sawdust.
I sprung for the new 1" carbide blade from timberwolf
I formerly used a regular 1" blade from a competitor,
which will remain nameless. Sorry, this is the Jet 18.
I also purchased the carter bearing guides, I was
not pleased with the quality of the stock ones .
Long story short, I am amazed. The cliche,
"hot knife through butter" comes to mind.
This photo is the first piece of mahogany through it.
No planing no sanding no photoshop.
I have no affiliation with this company,
For those considering serious resawing,
I thought you might be interested

Per

[Mike Cutler]

Looks good Per. I'm not sure if you'll be making less sawdust though, resawing makes lots of dust. The 1" Timberwolf is a nice blade. I have a 1" Lennox Tri-master and a 1" Lennox Bi-Metal. I'm still waiting on the Timberwolf to arrive, and some warm weather, to compare the three. You're right about the guides on the Jet, they definitely need to be replaced.
How do you like the Jet 18"? There's been a lot of discussion lately about different bandsaws and the relative merits of each.

[Dennis McDonaugh]

How does the Timberwolfe carbide compare to the Lennox pricewise?

[Per Swenson]

Hi folks, as to how how much it cost, I am not sure.
I just put in on a account. I think around 200 dollars.
But thats not the reason I bought it. What sold me was the folks
at suffolk machinery who knew what they are talking about,
gave me a 20 minute tutorial over the phone(before they knew I was
a buyer) And by golly I am a redneck thats been around a bandsaw
daily for 30 years. I thought I knew it all. Wrong again.
As for the sawdust ,I was refering to the dust made in cleaning
the band saw marks, final planing and sanding.
Although I am blessed because I love what I do, all work ,no
play makes per a dull redneck. My customers really don't care
about the process the way we do,just the final product.

I am very happy with the jet 18 (with the carters)
but this is my dedicated resaw machine, so I can't really
comment on anything else.

Again ,Thanks for asking. Isn't the internet wonderful?

[John sexton]

I just ordered a 1 ¼ “Timberwolf carbide blade 161” long it cost $219.It will also be a dedicated resaw machine.

I need the cleanest cut I can get as it will cut down on additional time spent surfacing the wood.

I have used Timberwolf blades on my other band saws and the guys there are great. I also spent some time talking to a guy at Lenox that was also a very nice guy.

I will be resawing mostly 6”eastern red cedar the guy at Lenox estimated that I would get maybe 5000 lineal feet out of their regular carbon blade, maybe 15 to 20,000 out of their Bimetal blade and around 50,000 maybe more out of their carbide blade.

One of the reasons I went with Timberwolf is because they have a 1 ¼” blade and Lenox only has a 1” blade and the extra ¼” may help get a better feed rate. I also like the way Timberwolf people are always very helpful and you can get them on the phone if you ever need them.

Thanks for showing the pictures, that blade gave a great cut.

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[Jim Becker]

I use the Lennox 1" Trimaster Carbide Tipped blade for resawing with similar results. Yes, these blades are not inexpensive, but they can last for years, rather than the hours or days that a regular blade will function acceptably. In the long run, they cost less...IMHO.

[Darren Ford]

Rednecks don't quote T.E. Lawrence !

[Per Swenson]

For the first time ever, I almost spit my coffee all over the monitor.
Thank you. Per

[Jeff Sudmeier]

Per, those are some great looking results! Hopefully they stay that way as the blade dulls.

[Charles McKinley]

Hi Per,

Is the Timberwolf a high tension blade like the Lennox? The 1/2" Lennox was recommended to me for my 18" Jet. Have you had any problems with the saw tensioning the blade or seen any extra wear on the saw?

Thanks,

[Perry Holbrook]

Hi Per,

Is the Timberwolf a high tension blade like the Lennox? The 1/2" Lennox was recommended to me for my 18" Jet. Have you had any problems with the saw tensioning the blade or seen any extra wear on the saw?

Thanks,

I just put the 1/2" Lennox blade on my 18" Jet this week. It really is as good as others have said. As far as tension, the Jet can tension the 1/2" blade correctly, but based on the position of the spring at the proper tension, I'm not sure if it would handle a 3/4", although Ittura says it can. The 1" is certainly out of the question.

[Per Swenson]

I am confused. Are you saying a 1 inch blade is out of the question,
or are you saying a 1 inch lennox blade is out of the question?
The jet 18 will tension a blade all the way to 1 1/2" blade width.
For the Timberwolf Blade I tension it to a little below the one inch
mark. This works and works well. I did not intend for this thread
to become a contest between blade companys.
I will say this though , I have held many preconceived notions
about what can and cannot be done in this business. Some
changed by younger men " who didn't know any better", some by
older and wiser men. The point is nothing , (for me,as I grow older)
is out of the question.
Per

[Perry Holbrook]

I am confused. Are you saying a 1 inch blade is out of the question,
or are you saying a 1 inch lennox blade is out of the question?
The jet 18 will tension a blade all the way to 1 1/2" blade width.
For the Timberwolf Blade I tension it to a little below the one inch
mark. This works and works well. I did not intend for this thread
to become a contest between blade companys.
I will say this though , I have held many preconceived notions
about what can and cannot be done in this business. Some
changed by younger men " who didn't know any better", some by
older and wiser men. The point is nothing , (for me,as I grow older)
is out of the question.
Per
The 18" Jet is not really designed as a heavy duty machine. The spring rate is matched to the strength of the mounting of the wheels, neither of which is designed to be able to properly tension a 1" carbide blade, at least not for production work. In my case, when the 1/2" blade is tensioned, the spring doesn't have much left before fully compressing. Wider blades will require even more force, which IMHO is not available.

The tension indicator is not a true measure of blade tension, but is fairly good for relative comparisons. If I remember correctly, the indicator was over 1" when I have the 1/2" carbide blade tensioned properly.

Perry

[Mike Cutler]

Perry. I'm with Per on this one. I'm a little confused also. I'll admit that the term "production work" in your post may be subjective.
For the sake of discussion I have a Rikon 18" bandsaw running a 1" Lennox Tri-Master Blade. I have also tried a Lennox 1" Bi-Metal blade, and I have a Timberwolf 1" blade on order.
The only blade width restictions I've been advised of are using blades wider than 1". This restriction is based on the incidence of Micro cracking and premature failure of the blade due to the circumference of the bandsaw wheel being too tight. Blades wider than 1" are .042 to .053 thick. The Lennox and Timberwolf 1" blades are .035" and less. The 3/4" Timberwolf's and Lennox Blades are .032" thick.
I can't comment on the Jet 18", but I have to believe that it is every bit as capable as the Rikon. I find it difficult to believe that it can only properly tension a 1/2" blade max. My Jet 14" with the Iturra spring could more than adequately tension a 1/2" woodslicer blade, and that is a tiny spring comparatively.
Bill Crofutt. Grizzly Quality Control Manager, recently posted the following;

"In discussing bandsaw blade tension, a few key points to remember are:
1. Blade tension is a function of the blade width and thickness; the wider
and thicker the blade, the more force is required to achieve a given
tension.
2. Blade force and blade tension are not the same thing. Force is measured
in pounds and does not depend on the blade. Tension is measured in pounds
per square inch and varies inversely with the cross sectional area of the
blade.
4. Higher quality bi-metal band material like that found in the Lenox
blades that Grizzly sells is stronger and can be tensioned higher than
traditional carbon steel bands. This does not mean it needs to be tensioned
higher, only that it is capable of being tensioned higher. I have discussed
this fact with Lenox reps in the past and they agree completely on this
point. Unless you are using a horizontal resaw designed specifically for
resawing, you will not be able to achieve the 15-30,000 psi. tension that
you mention. In fact, our Lenox rep told us he knew of no vertical consumer
bandsaw on the market that can achieve 30,000 psi blade tension with a
1" blade. Lenox suggested adding about 20% additional tension over a
standard blade but ONLY if required.

Our bandsaws, including the G0513, are built of heavy gauge materials and
thoroughly tested for performance. They are fully featured and, when
equipped with the proper blade, suitable for everything from intricate
scroll work to resawing. That said, when resawing you do want to use a
wider and thicker blade and a relatively high tension in order to achieve a
straight cut and satisfactory results.
The G0513 bandsaw is capable of properly tensioning all the blades we carry
for it, including the Lenox. We have many satisfied customers using this
machine, including for resawing with the Lenox blades, and we stand behind
it 100%."

and the following from the same thread:

" Well, I’ll apologize up front because I’m going to sound like the bad guy here but there is some “straightening-out” that needs to be done. And you guys gotta remember that just because you read it in a post somewhere doesn’t make it so.

First, the Lenox carbide blade we sell was designed to cut metal, not wood. Yes, that’s right, metal. It was only the last few years this blade was even listed in the wood cutting column from Lenox. Metal cutting, as I am sure you would understand, is a significantly higher challenge than cutting wood. High tensions are required to get a straight cut. Did you ever cut a piece of pipe with a hack saw and get a perfectly straight cut? I bet not, yet you can routinely get a straight cut with your hand saw in a 2x4. That isn’t the best comparison, but it does make my point. Metal does not cut the same as wood. If you are cutting cast iron with your bandsaw then you may need 25,000 or 30,000 psi of tension, but certainly that is not the case.

For those of you who have more industrial machines that can tension a blade that high, my question to you would be, why? There is no need to run those kinds of tension with blades made today. If you cannot get a straight cut at lower tensions….well I have no idea why. Why put everything under such a load when it’s not needed? Just because your truck CAN haul 2,000lbs in the back doesn’t mean you need to drive around all day with a load of sand in the back. That’s the same with these blades. Yes, they CAN be tensioned to 30,000psi IF NEEDED.

The G0513 will easily tension a ½” blade to well over 40,000psi but cannot tension a Lenox 1” blade that is not only wider but thicker to anywhere near that number. The G0513 will tension it to 15,000psi and more if we wanted to add a “cheater bar” to the tension handwheel. But why would we? There is absolutely no logical reason to have more tension on a blade than is required. If 10,000psi works wonderfully what is the point of exceeding it?

Remember that these blades are for cutting metal and just happen to do an incredible job in wood. That is where this misconception came from about these very high blade tensions which ARE needed if cutting a piece of iron pipe and you want a straight cut. But not needed when plowing your way through a piece of wood.

Should you disagree with my comment, I invite you to call the Lenox rep. His name is Larry DeWilde at 360-920-8886. He will confirm what I say as being accurate."

I use only the amount of tension necessary to obtain the proper results, and fully echo Bill's thoughts on the subject. I can only add that the Rikon 18" with a 1" Lennox Tri-Master can properly resaw, with consistent, quality results. I also fully believe in the quality of Jet machinery, I have a shop full of it, and I believe that the Jet 18" is capable of utilizing an 1" blade for resawing. It may not be tensioned to 30kpsi, but it will work, and as Per's photos show, quite well.
Lastly. I am absolutely, positively not asserting that you are wrong in your post about your observations, only that there are more variables involved than Kpsi.

[Doug Shepard]

Very nice looking cut quality. I can only see one slight saw mark in the whole pic. One of these days I've got to make the leap to a carbide blade.

[Perry Holbrook]

Mike, I didn't mean to cause such a stir. I understand all your points. My point was based on a discussion with Ittura and my observations this week. Ittura, strongly advised against anything over a 3/4" Tri Master on the Jet 18", so I went with the 1/2". When I put the blade on and tensioned it properly, the spring only had a little more than 1/16" spacing between each coil. There may be enough spring left to handle the 3/4 but I can't see it handeling a 1".

My saw is about 3 years old and the spring could be a little weak. It's obvious that discussing band saw blades and the tensioning of them is a little like discussing politics or religion. I'm a little sorry I chimed in on this one. Anyway, the 1/2" Trimaster does a good job on the 18" Jet in my shop where the bandsaw can easily run 20 to 25 hours a week.

Perry

BTW, a couple of years ago I designed an electronic blade tension meter that could be permanently mounted to the saw as a retrofit, but have so far decided not to market it, so I do have a pretty good understanding of tension, force, etc.

[Alan Turner]

I have an Aggazinni 20", and run a Lenox Trimaster carbide blade, 1". One thing I have not seen addressed in this post is why the Timberwolf is a better carbide blade, if it is better. What did Timberwolf have to say about this?

[Mike Cutler]

Perry. I'm not sorry that you "chimed in" at all. There is nothing wrong with having or a expressing your point of view. Healthy, productive, interactive discussion is what Sawmill Creek is all about in my opinion.
If I in any way implied that your point of view, or contribution was not wanted I sincerely apologize. That was absolutely not my position.
There has been a lot of discussion lately on bandsaws, and bandsaw blades. It seems as if this was the machine to upgrade over this past winter.
There seems to be no 100% solution on the bandsaw blade tension issue. One member set his blade to the 30Kpsi spec and snapped it. Another member,me, sets his to just enough pressure to prevent barreling, and leading. Neither is right, and neither is wrong.
If my post was a little "over the top" I'm sorry about that also. I'm one of those anal types that likes to have all the info I can find on a subject before I proceed. I drive my wife nuts because I actually read all the instructions on an appliance before I plug it in. It drives her crazy, she has to leave the room sometimes.
I'd be interested in your digital tension indicator, as an instrumentation person by trade I always find the "twigit stuff" interesting.

[Karl Fife]

Is anyone in a position to compare the new Timberwolf Carbide blade to the Laguna Resaw King blade? (or other carbides blades, like Lenox)

I would guess that:
-They're both a quantum-leap above any 'normal' or bi-metal blade with 'set' teeth.
-They would have VERY SIMILAR initial cut quality
-The important differences between them would come down to some aspect of usability, durability & 'resharpenability' (because the alloys chosen for each are different).
-Whereas each manufacturer could have each chosen the same alloys, there must be engineering/philisophical reasons behind the choices. What are the reasons behind these choices, and/or the practical trade offs of each each? For example, (and I'm completely making this up), I could imagine someone saying "C-8 carbide stays sharp longer but tends to chip".

Can anyone speak to this?
Thanks!
-Karl

[Eddie Darby]

Is anyone in a position to compare the new Timberwolf Carbide blade to the Laguna Resaw King blade? (or other carbides blades, like Lenox)
-Karl
I think this has the makings of a good magazine article!

http://www.suffolkmachinery.com/1_carbide_blades.asp

I just wish it fitted smaller saws.

[Josiah Bartlett]

Variable pitch designs are great. I like the 3-4 pitch woodslicer a lot. Nice finish and much quieter than either a 3 or 4 tpi blade.

[glenn bradley]

I will say this though , I have held many preconceived notions about what can and cannot be done in this business.

Amen to that. Thanks for the review Per. I always appreciate you sharing your experience and this time is no exception . . . redneck or not ;-)

[Jamie Buxton]

Is anyone in a position to compare the new Timberwolf Carbide blade to the Laguna Resaw King blade? (or other carbides blades, like Lenox)

I would guess that:
-They're both a quantum-leap above any 'normal' or bi-metal blade with 'set' teeth.
-They would have VERY SIMILAR initial cut quality
-The important differences between them would come down to some aspect of usability, durability & 'resharpenability' (because the alloys chosen for each are different).
-Whereas each manufacturer could have each chosen the same alloys, there must be engineering/philisophical reasons behind the choices. What are the reasons behind these choices, and/or the practical trade offs of each each? For example, (and I'm completely making this up), I could imagine someone saying "C-8 carbide stays sharp longer but tends to chip".

Can anyone speak to this?
Thanks!
-Karl

Here's a comparison of the Resaw King with the Lennox Woodmaster CT.http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=85218&highlight=woodmaster+resaw+king