Bandsaw: Fence more trouble than it is worth?

[Anthony Scott]

I am new to the bandsaw world. I read up on adjusting the fence for drift. The technique I used was to mark a straight line down a peice of wood. Cut it by hand first, then clamp the wood to the table and adjust the fence to it aligns with the wood.
Simple enough, except that even when using the same blade and same piece or type of wood (pine), I still get drift.
I am thinking the fence might be more trouble than it is worth. Thoughts?
Thanks

[Neil Brooks]

Some people say that adjusting the fence to compensate for drift is sort of a "cheat," on the theory that a decent band-saw, with a decent -- and SHARP -- blade should be able to resaw straight, with most woods.

I've actually found this to be true, with my Grizzly G0555X.

I'd recommend a book like Mark Duginske's "Bandsaw Book." A bandsaw is like the old process of tuning a carburetor: a series of steps, taken in a certain order, performed methodically.

The difference between a fair bandsaw, properly set up, and one not well set up, is pretty substantial.

Blade choices (teeth per inch -- TPI) make a big difference, too. I'm VERY happy with my Wood Slicer.

Ditto tension. Tension matters. The book, and other posts/articles spend a fair amount of time on tension.

Good luck !

[Van Huskey]

Drift is one of those things that can be maddening BUT 99.99% of the time it can be cured, but you didn't ask about that.

BS fences can be very useful particularly when cutting veneer, but quite a bit of the time freehand works just fine. When all is said and done unless it is a dedicated contour cutting bandsaw I want a fence. I think the key here is you have a problem that you need to cure (tons of posts on drift, or start your own specific one), the fence is just collateral damage. Fix the drift and you will appreciate the fence.

[glenn bradley]

The article that sold me on the payoff for diligent setup of a bandsaw was the one where a Ridgid and a Laguna were setup from scratch by someone who knew what he was doing. End result was pretty much identical performance within the Ridgid's capabilities. There are some tasks that the Ridgid just couldn't do but, those that could be done on both showed near identical cut quality and resaw accuracy. I followed suit on an old 12" Craftsman and was amazed. I have been a proponent of proper (and diligent) setup ever since.

[Anthony Scott]

I did put a new 1/2 4 tpi Carter balde on it. I have the Jet 14" model. I am sure I need some practice on it as well....

[Brad Patch]

The article that sold me on the payoff for diligent setup of a bandsaw was the one where a Ridgid and a Laguna were setup from scratch by someone who knew what he was doing. End result was pretty much identical performance within the Ridgid's capabilities. There are some tasks that the Ridgid just couldn't do but, those that could be done on both showed near identical cut quality and resaw accuracy. I followed suit on an old 12" Craftsman and was amazed. I have been a proponent of proper (and diligent) setup ever since.

Can you provide a link?

[Jim Finn]

[QUOTE=..... on the theory that a decent band-saw, with a decent -- and SHARP -- blade should be able to resaw straight, with most woods.

I've actually found this to be true, with my Grizzly G0555X.
.....![/QUOTE]
I have a Grizzly GO555 also and I agree. I re-saw a lot and use a resaw fence and a woodslicer blade and get good results in hardwoods and softwoods.

[Cody Colston]

I use a fence for resawing only along with a 3/4" Woodslicer on my GO513. I think it's the only blade I've ever had on the saw that had zero drift.

If you have a drum sander (I don't), then marking a line and using a pivot fence will allow you to saw fairly thin slices. Any blade deviation can be sanded out.

[Jim Matthews]

Watch this (http://www.finewoodworking.com/ToolGuide/ToolGuideArticle.aspx?id=34055), it's an eye opener.'

FYI - 90% of my problems were solved in a brief conversation with Iturra Designs.
They're in Florida, and they've forgotten more about using a bandsaw than I'm likely to ever know.
(904) 642-2802

Be honest in assessing your ability, and take the advice Louis gives you.
He won't steer you wrong.

[Anthony Scott]

Great video. A lot of things I didn't see mentioned in other books. Particularly he recommends setting the tension for a 1/2" blade to the tension equal to a 3/8" blade.... In Lonnie Bird's book, he recommends the other extreme. Cracking the tension up to almost the max...

[Van Huskey]

I think it's the only blade I've ever had on the saw that had zero drift.
emphasis added

In general the saw itself doesn't case drift, it can cause a symptom similar to drift but it is usually a gross error that even a marginally decent setup will cure. The reality is drift is a blade issue but in most cases you can't "fix" the blade you have to compensate for the blade. Low quality blades tend to be more difficult to work with but even the high dollar ones can have their issues.

My general point is no matter how high the quality of the saw and no matter how well the saw is set-up and tuned you will still run into drift resulting from the blade.

Directly to the OP, don't get discouraged out of all the basic machines in the hobby shop they tend to be the one that takes the most touch and feel to set up and use. Without knowing anything else I would take a wild swing and say check the tension first. I am guessing it is low. Here is what happens, while you determine drift you take your time with very little forward pressure on the wood, then when you get it all adjusted you start actually doing work and the increased pressure of cutting faster ( a more normal feedrate) the low tension allows the blade to twist and track sideways.

[Van Huskey]

I use a fence for resawing only along with a 3/4" Woodslicer on my GO513. I think it's the only blade I've ever had on the saw that had zero drift..

Meant to mention regarding the Woodslicer, there is a reason that this type of blade rarely shows any significant drift. They have a very minimal set, variances in set ithe main reason blades drift so the almost complete lack of set ensures the absolute variance is low. Actually, most good resaw blades, spring steel like the WS and carbide tipped, tend to have little drift the spring steel blades due to their small set and carbide blades since they are ground fairly accurately.

[Peter Quinn]

I like having a fence on the BS for a variety of things. Resaw, ripping, a place to attach certain fixtures. But its not particularly useful if you can't get the blade to track consistently and in a direction that is either parallel to the fence or within a range that the fence may be set parallel to it. One thing I am wary of is bandsaw experts. Each seems to have his or her own strongly held beliefs about exactly what factors influence performance and how the machine should be set up. Often the information you will get from different experts is contradictory. Drift, no drift, high tension, low tension, narrow blade, wide blade, meat blade, this blade, that blade,....phooey. There is no consensus among experts at all on the subject of bandsaw set up. And yet using a variety of different approaches wood workers are able to achieve excellent results. It can be maddening. What to do? I'm not sure, but the BS requires you develop a relationship with it like no other tool in your shop. Its a very intimate machine, so become as familiar with yours as you can, play with it, experiment. Learn every adjustment and its effects on the saws performance. Read all the experts, try their suggestions, or parts of them, but don't feel sworn to any "proven" method. Your own method will develop in time.

Im still in the "every blade has a little drift" camp. I've played with a few saws a fair bit and have yet to find some machine setting by which every blade placed on the machine cuts exactly parallel with the fence every time. I get a consistent cut angle on a given blade at a given tension, its just not the same for different blades. Rather than tune the entire machine to match the fence each time I change blades, I prefer to adjust the fence to the blade, its just much quicker for me. I've found that when setting the fence to the drift, if I choose a board about 20" long I can cut in 12' or so, stop the saw, and mark the drift angle on the table with a pencil. I'll usually do this three times with the same board to get a sample set I trust, and see if the angle is consistent each time. If not, the saw may require other adjustments, or my technique may be to blame. I've experienced both conditions. I'll usually pick an angle that is the average of my three samples, set a bevel gauge to the pencil marks, set the fence to the bevel gauge. This works for me.

Other observations? Blades which have been used to cut curves don't seem to make good resaw blades after that. I don't know why, they just don't seem to track as straight and consistently after that. And dull blades will cause all sorts of problems that cannot be corrected except by changing to a fresh blade. A thick resaw cut demands your sharpest blade, blades too dull for resaw may still have plenty of life to make other simple rip cuts or light curved work. If a blade starts wandering in a thick rip or resaw operation my first question is is this blade sharp enough for this work?

[Michael Peet]

I'm certainly no bandsaw expert, but I did spend a non-trivial amount of time setting mine up and getting it as square and true as I could. Maybe I am lucky, but I always use a fence when cutting straight lines and do not notice a problem with drift. It seems to me that where the blade rides on the crown of the tires directly correlates with the presentation of the blade to the wood at the cutting location just above the table surface, so it seems logical to me that this can be made to be parallel to the fence. But again, I am probably more lucky than anything.

Also, like others upthread, I too use Woodslicers but I have read on these here forums that there are blades made from identical stock that can be had for cheaper. I can't remember which ones though.

Good luck,

Mike

[Adam Cormier]

Watch this (http://www.finewoodworking.com/ToolGuide/ToolGuideArticle.aspx?id=34055), it's an eye opener.'

FYI - 90% of my problems were solved in a brief conversation with Iturra Designs.
They're in Florida, and they've forgotten more about using a bandsaw than I'm likely to ever know.
(904) 642-2802

Be honest in assessing your ability, and take the advice Louis gives you.
He won't steer you wrong.

+1 on this! This is a great video. I have seen so much negative written on my particular bandsaw (Ridgid 14") but I can't help but think that there are so many people out there that don't take the time to properly set up their tools. Mine works absolutely perfect, but I did everything that this guy mentions in his video.

Once you have your bandsaw tuned up, I doubt you will get anymore drift......as long as you have a half decent blade.

[Bob Wingard]

I've seen several articles written about how a band saw will not drift IF the blade is perfectly centered on a crowned upper wheel ... BUT ... they never really explain the WHY of it. It's really a simple explanation ... if the blade is tracking dead center on the upper wheel (assuming a crowned wheel), the stresses on the blade are equal front-to-back. If the blade is tracking to the front of the upper wheel, it is stressed more on the rear or smooth edge of the blade, causing it to slightly change it's shape from that of a cylinder to that of a thin slice of a cone with the rear being slightly larger than the front. In this scenario, even with the blade guides set tight, the blade is unbalanced regarding tension and the front (toothed edge) is under less tension. If the blade is tracking to the rear of the upper wheel, everything reverses, and the toothed edge of the blade is under higher stress than the back. Since the blade is made of thin spring steel, it can & will stretch and deform, causing a large portion of the infamous drift. When I set up my band saw, I disregard the teeth and set the blade so the body is tracking dead center on the upper wheel, and the only time I experience drift is when one side of the blade is more or less sharp than the opposite side ... and to a small extent, even that can be adjusted out with blade tracking rather than fence adjustment.

Hope that makes sense ... ...

[Chris Parks]

Maybe I am lucky, but I always use a fence when cutting straight lines and do not notice a problem with drift. It seems to me that where the blade rides on the crown of the tires directly correlates with the presentation of the blade to the wood at the cutting location just above the table surface, so it seems logical to me that this can be made to be parallel to the fence. But again, I am probably more lucky than anything.

It is obvious that tracking affects the angle of cut in relation to the fence but so obvious that very few have thought about. Sure all the other things also affect it but blade tracking is one of the big ones and the one we hardly ever try.

[Van Huskey]

Other observations? Blades which have been used to cut curves don't seem to make good resaw blades after that. I don't know why, they just don't seem to track as straight and consistently after that.

One side of a blade used to cut contours is almost always more dull than the other since during contour cutting more pressure is applied to one side, that side then doesn't cut as cleanly thus more friction and causes the blade to drift.

[Van Huskey]

Also, like others upthread, I too use Woodslicers but I have read on these here forums that there are blades made from identical stock that can be had for cheaper. I can't remember which ones though.

Good luck,

Mike

Ittura sells the Blade Runner and Spectrum Supply sells the Kerfmaster, both are either the exact same blade stock or perfect copies. The WS is the most expensive and the Kerfmaster the least expensive.

[Myk Rian]

I've seen several articles written about how a band saw will not drift IF the blade is perfectly centered on a crowned upper wheel ...
That's been my experience.
I track the blade in the middle of the upper wheel, not bothering with where it tracks on the lower.
I use the flutter method to tension the blade.
Never have a drift problem.

[Peter Quinn]

Now here is my point exactly. An earlier post references an article in FWW by Michael Fortune, he sets the blade dead center on the top wheel, never any drift. Hasn't been my experience, but it seems to work for him. I love his work, stunning designs. So I set my blade dead center on my wheel, I get drift, not parallel to the miter slot, not perpendicular to the front edge of the table. So I futs with the tracking. A nudge forward, a smidge backward......ARGGGG. Lets not even discuss the fact that Mr. Fortune also advocates "low tension", thats a discussion for another day.

So I'm looking at this months FWW, interesting article by David Welter, teacher at College of the Red Woods, article is about making and working with shop sawn veneer. College of Redwoods, pretty well respected, I've been to the area, checked out student and teacher exhibits in local galleries in person, great stuff. And Mr. Welter's article has a good description about "setting the blade on the center of the wheel's crown...then adjusting for any drift..."

Yes folks, experts simply do not even agree on whether or not drift even exists, and if it does what to do about it. Sort of like UFO's. Those who have never seen one don't believe in them?